MoP Shadow Priest vs Affliction Warlock

[Juicebox]

Ok, once again OP:
1. You did manage to win a few of the duels.
2. It's 1v1. The game isn't balanced around 1v1.
3. I think you're bad.

[creamie123]

Ok, once again OP:
1. You did manage to win a few of the duels.
2. It's 1v1. The game isn't balanced around 1v1.
3. I think you're bad.

1. Yes, 2 out of 6 fights vs a similarly geared and experienced Warlock.
2. Good point.
3. As said, I played both a Shadow Priest and a Warlock since Vanilla, and have duelled the most skilled players of all classes (2400+ arena) in my guild, and have analyzed almost every possible tactic against every class, as both a Warlock and a Shadow Priest. I even dueled Beckon and tied 2:2. I'm not bad, but my partner is even more skilled.

Edit:

Even after today's change to Blood Fear to a fear effect, it matters little. A good warlock will just cast it first to waste Fear Ward, then Shadowfury, DoT up, and recast Blood Fear after 5 secs.

I even duelled him today with his new spec. This time I was using grenades, trinket and Wotf.

Most of the new Warlock talents and baseline abilities are not dispellable.

1) Got him to 50% HP, he uses Unending Resolve and Soul Burns: Drain Life to heal back to 90%, nullifying most of my DoTs.
2) Got him back down again to around 30% and prepares to use SW. He uses Sacrificial Pact for a 200000 HP shield that cannot be dispelled, and he healed himself back again to 100% using Soul Burn: drain life.
3) Got him back down again to 30%, he uses Glyphed Healthstone, Cauterize Master and Life Harvest spam to get back up to 80%.
4) Got him to 30% again, he uses Dark Regeneration, Mortal Coil and maintained at 66%, and he uses Twilight Ward to absorb.

5) Managed to use all DoTs on him at first, and started off with a horror, he used Unbound Will to dispel all my DoTs and horror.
6) I silence him, his Imp singes magic and removes silence.
7) I psychic scream, he WotF out of it.
8) I finally used a grenade on him.

9) He got me to 50% HP, I use VE to heal back to 90%, but it was mitigated largely because of Unending Resolve by 50%.
10) Used dispersion, and all he did was renew DoTs.
11) Used Shadowfiend, and he summoned a 2nd pet, 5 Imps, and 1 Guardian to do heavy damage on me (something like 10k HP per sec)
12) Popped out to flash heal back to 80%, but his DoTs dealt far more damage than mine with Haunt on me, along with all his summons.

It was a battle where we popped all our cooldowns this time, and I lost again, while he had 30% HP remaining.

A good warlock will have 5 lives, and he will use them all to his advantage.

[Venteus]

Did you fight on an open field or was this using some sort of terrain? I think with some skillfull LoS a shadow priest could have a chance simply because of the ability to heal without having to have the a target to generate health from.

However I do not appreciate the fact that warlocks offer so much more control and utility over a shadow priest. Even though people will say that the game isn't balanced around 1v1 until they're blue in the face - this doesn't seem fair. And I can see this being a disadvantage for shadow priests when trying to join RBGs, arena teams, and especially raids (the warlock demon gate alone trumps ANYTHING a shadow priest offers)

[Inactivity]

Even though people will say that the game isn't balanced around 1v1 until they're blue in the face - this doesn't seem fair.

And if you played a warlock and knew shit about them, you would say it until you were blue in the face against warriors/rogues, and no shadow priest would give a flying fuck. (assuming two highly skilled players, warlocks in live have next to no chance against DKs, and hardly any against rogues. Warrior is also quite one-sided). So again, why should anyone care about your whining?

I'd be more open to discussing arenas/BG, but honestly this thread is written with so much inaccurate info you'd be better off starting a new one.

[Micke]

This is the worst QQ thread I've read in a while. Plus there's just so many facts wrong it would take me ages to correct you.

Also, destro starting off with a chaos bolt in a duel and then using 2 more ember spells shortly after? And in the second duel he used 4 ember spells? So he literally was dpsing a dummy or something seconds before each duel...? If you let him do that you wanted to lose. Or you're trolling us all with this awful thread. Either way it is obvious you're just QQing for OP buffs on a BETA REALM.

[Naraga]

A lot of these you're comparing apples to oranges.

Just going to point this out too but if haunt grants 40% increased dot damage and and the filler causing dots to tick 100% faster means affliction dots will hit for good single target damage but when multi dotting they're going to hit like complete wet noodles.

He's not, Spriests and Warlocks take eachothers spots constantly in 3v3 arena. I cannot think of a comp where only the spriest is viable and the warlock would not be.

[Venteus]

And if you played a warlock and knew shit about them, you would say it until you were blue in the face against warriors/rogues, and no shadow priest would give a flying fuck. (assuming two highly skilled players, warlocks in live have next to no chance against DKs, and hardly any against rogues. Warrior is also quite one-sided). So again, why should anyone care about your whining?

I'd be more open to discussing arenas/BG, but honestly this thread is written with so much inaccurate info you'd be better off starting a new one.

Why wouldn't a shadow priest care again? The classes you mentioned (especially rogue/DK) hard counter shadow as well. But what we're discussing here isn't how melee stacks vs casters. Shadow and Warlock have always had similar playstyles, and the first step to balance across any front (3v3, rbgs, PvE, etc) is providing every class their own unique advantages, then balancing the classes around those abilities.

The point I've made which seems to have gone right over your head is that those modes of utility are NOT balanced (Interrupts, CC, motility, damage output, etc) between these two classes. And as a result, a shadow priest is not as beneficial as a warlock when it comes to both PvP and PvE. That shouldn't be the case.

[Inactivity]

The point I've made which seems to have gone right over your head is that those modes of utility are NOT balanced (Interrupts, CC, motility, damage output, etc) between these two classes. And as a result, a shadow priest is not as beneficial as a warlock when it comes to both PvP and PvE. That shouldn't be the case.

I repeat myself:

I'd be more open to discussing arenas/BG, but honestly this thread is written with so much inaccurate info you'd be better off starting a new one.

This thread was started to QQ over 1v1 warlock versus shadow priest and everyone has concluded that Blizzard doesn't balance around that, so any QQ is pointless. The laundry made-up list of crap is about 20% accurate (and hence 80% plain wrong), so this thread should pretty much not be used for serious discussion of 3's/RBG group-comp balance, if you want to do that I'd say start a new thread, and list the issues you think are bad when it comes to group comp.


[edit]

One big draw for shadow priests in group comp is the 5% spell haste buff that only they, boomkins, and elemental shamans offer.


[edit]

@OP:

1) Where the hell did you read that Inner Fire was dispellable? Because looking here, it seems that it is not (as is it is not on live):

http://mop.wowhead.com/spell=588 (same goes for Inner Will). Also, PW:F is free dispel fodder. We'd want to remove your shields and most of all, your Dark Archangel.

However, a good warlock will always keep lesser buffs such as Unending breath and Detect Invisibility

2) LMFAO... please... just stop while you're not that far behind.

[Darth-Piekus]

As I said before allow me to disagree that the Shadowpriest can't win over a warlock. In any case let's wait to hit the level 90 healing abilities first and see some more changes and then compare.

[Yattz]

PURE dps class VS a hybrid-like class
The pure dps class deserves to be more versatile and hav mor ways to pwn. Imo ;p

[Demetrion]

Sure, you can say a Shadow Priest can drop out of SF to heal and outlast the Warlock, and using Dispersion and Shadowfiend to regenerate around 60% of our total mana (maybe 80% with the empowered Shadowfiend talent), but so can the Warlock. Glyph of Dark Regeneration replaces the Warlock's Life Tap and grants him a +625% mana regen that scales with more haste, with no cooldown, while our shadowfiend has a 4 min CD.

Apples and Oranges

It's the same as you would say "Feral druid needs to shift in caster form to cast instant cyclone".

Leaving shadow form was and will always be part of shadow priests game play. Yes you NEED to drop down your sform to self heal. I don't know did you play beta but shadow priests are overpowered as fucks. Even with the nerfs to DP DMG, overall damage with procs is high as hell. I managed to heal myself to full in 2 flash heals with the new PVP power not to mention my mending heals me for almost 25% of my HP.

And now you have glyph which doesn't even require you to leave shadow form.

Shadow priests "invis" can be used on numerous ways, one of them is getting yourself free cast.

Stuff on paper might look unbalanced, but believe me in reality it isn't, and things are still in beta, lots of stuff will shuffle and change.

---------- Post added 2012-05-14 at 12:37 PM ----------

3) 1) Warlock uses Blood Fear on Shadow Priest for 8 secs.
2) Warlock uses Dark Soul: Misery and dumps all 3 DoTs, plus Curse of Elements + Haunt and Fel Flame on Priest, while summoning 5 Imps, an extra pet using Grimoire of Service, and an Infernal or Doomguard to sig on Priest.
3) Priest uses VE and DoTs up Warlock, tries to cast VT, but is spell locked by Felhunter
4) Warlock spams 2 Malefic Grasps
5) Warlock uses a 2nd Blood Fear on Shadow Priest for 4 secs.
6) Warlock spams 2 Malefic Grasps
7) Warlock stuns Priest using Shadowfury for 3 secs
8) Warlock uses Soul Burn: Soul Swap and instantly reapplies all DoTs, and refreshes Haunt
9) Warlock casts the final Blood Fear on Priest for 2 seconds
10) Warlock spams a final Malefic Grasp or 2 on the Priest
11) Priest dies without any chance of retaliation.

Ever heard of fake cast? PVP trinket?

---------- Post added 2012-05-14 at 01:10 PM ----------

1. Yes, 2 out of 6 fights vs a similarly geared and experienced Warlock.
2. Good point.
3. As said, I played both a Shadow Priest and a Warlock since Vanilla, and have duelled the most skilled players of all classes (2400+ arena) in my guild, and have analyzed almost every possible tactic against every class, as both a Warlock and a Shadow Priest. I even dueled Beckon and tied 2:2. I'm not bad, but my partner is even more skilled.

Edit:
This time I was using grenades, trinket and Wotf.

Stopped reading here.

You try making reasonable arguments and talk about how skilled you are and yet you aren't using basic PVP items?

Good day to you.

[Crudelitas]

PURE dps class VS a hybrid-like class
The pure dps class deserves to be more versatile and hav mor ways to pwn. Imo ;p

on the contrary, a pure dps class should just dps and versatility is the treat of a hybrid class. i'm stating this just to counter your argument though. hybrid tax is long gone. if you spec dps, you ARE a dps. utilities may and will vary depending on your class.

on the topic, i tried dueling an affliction warlock and it was not as good as i expected to be. shadowform healing is awesome. glyphed pom heal every 10 secs sustained with renew is super sweet. yes, they have more cc compared to us, but we have the opportunity to go los and spam flash heal which i like <3 also no one mentioned our horror also has a disarm utility. that shit will cut one thirds of a caster spell power. isn't it awesome?

all in all, i feel so imba now since i can pwn every single class with an exception of warlock. and frankly, i don't give a rat's ass if i can beat them on 1v1 or not. it's still fun.

[creamie123]

Stopped reading here.

You try making reasonable arguments and talk about how skilled you are and yet you aren't using basic PVP items?

Good day to you.

I don't use PvP trinkets or WotF during duels, and I expect my dueling partner to do the same, in order to uphold the purism of the classes' abilities.

[Greywardenn]

Ya that's precisely what I was referring to. I'm mainly discussing a comparison between the 2 classes in absolute terms, and also in terms of 1 vs 1 PvP, not in terms of other things such as healing or arenas.

LOL 1v1 really? Balancing this game around 1v1 would be impossible.

[creamie123]

on the contrary, a pure dps class should just dps and versatility is the treat of a hybrid class. i'm stating this just to counter your argument though. hybrid tax is long gone. if you spec dps, you ARE a dps. utilities may and will vary depending on your class.

on the topic, i tried dueling an affliction warlock and it was not as good as i expected to be. shadowform healing is awesome. glyphed pom heal every 10 secs sustained with renew is super sweet. yes, they have more cc compared to us, but we have the opportunity to go los and spam flash heal which i like <3 also no one mentioned our horror also has a disarm utility. that shit will cut one thirds of a caster spell power. isn't it awesome?

all in all, i feel so imba now since i can pwn every single class with an exception of warlock. and frankly, i don't give a rat's ass if i can beat them on 1v1 or not. it's still fun.

A video on youtube (by a Ret Paladin) actually tested all classes with most specs, and Affliction warlocks are actually among the top in terms of burst damage. Shadow Priests ranked 10, Affliction Warlocks ranked 3. But guess who was no. 1? A Retribution Paladin ._.

Pretty much once an Affliction Warlock puts on all DoTs on you, and uses Haunt and Malefic Grasp, your HP will go down extremely quickly. Haunt already hits much harder than Mind Blast, their DoTs do more damage, and with Malefic Grasp, they all tick 100% faster. A well geared Warlock can simply lock you in with Blood Fear, shadowfury and spell lock and finish you off before you can even heal in around 6-8 seconds, worse than hunters.

[Inactivity]

I don't use PvP trinkets or WotF during duels, and I expect my dueling partner to do the same, in order to uphold the purism of the classes' abilities.

What are you talking about? Honestly, at this point you are so dumb it's beyond reason... you try to argue we put "Detect Invisibility" up to cover purges. Now you don't trinket or WotF in duels, and you claim to be a "PvPer"

Here's a hint... usually for duels the rule is, anything usable in arena is usable in a duel.

Should we all duel naked to "uphold the purism of the classes' abilities?" Or ban any on-use trinket or fuck, take our shadow protection racials off our action bars???

[creamie123]

What are you talking about? Honestly, at this point you are so dumb it's beyond reason... you try to argue we put "Detect Invisibility" up to cover purges. Now you don't trinket or WotF in duels, and you claim to be a "PvPer"

Here's a hint... usually for duels the rule is, anything usable in arena is usable in a duel.

Should we all duel naked to "uphold the purism of the classes' abilities?" Or ban any on-use trinket or fuck, take our shadow protection racials off our action bars???

Ok you got me lol.

I stopped playing WoW since TBC.

I never had either a Warlock nor a Shadow Priest.

I had a warrior and mage only, till level 70.

Gotcha.

[Direshadow]

our new Fade mechanic is all I really need...

Seriously, being untargetable by ranged spells every 30 seconds (lower if glyphed) is overpowered and dumb. But I'm not complaining. If a warlock tries to fear us, we fade, if he tries again after, we silence him.

[Demetrion]

I don't use PvP trinkets or WotF during duels, and I expect my dueling partner to do the same, in order to uphold the purism of the classes' abilities.

That's the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Just imagine warrior dueling a frost mage, try to imagine that in your scenario.

By your logic, 2 opponents should just stand there and hit each other in order to uphold the purism of the duel...

---------- Post added 2012-05-14 at 10:17 PM ----------

Ok you got me lol.

I stopped playing WoW since TBC.

I never had either a Warlock nor a Shadow Priest.

I had a warrior and mage only, till level 70.

Gotcha.

Just read this. It smelled on trolling since the first post. I had to admit you put the effort in it...

[Darth-Piekus]

I would reccomend to the Fellow Shadowpriests to wait for the level 90 talents first as there are some other healing abilities there and then compare. Also if what you mention is true that the warlock heals too much I am sure that won't remain like this. Even if it stays like this think the positive side of things. A warlock with a shadowpriest will be unstoppable duo.