Is this a troll thread? I cannot believe rogues are crying. Do you guys even play your rogues?
http://imgur.com/dp2Hf
Is this a troll thread? I cannot believe rogues are crying. Do you guys even play your rogues?
http://imgur.com/dp2Hf
Why do so many people appear in this thread just to announce they don't find the topic interesting? I'm confused.
Well, if that's considered valid discussion then I'll hop in with great excitement and wave my flag around while cheering "I find this topic interesting!" and also adding nothing more productive.
HUZZAH! I LOVE VAGUE BUT RELEVANT CLASS DEMOGRAPHIC COMPARISONS!
obviously you don't or you would know that list has been a joke since beta. subtlety is our worst spec, not our best, and the margin between combat and the other two specs is laughable as well. no one knows how they did their calculations, but theyre assuredly incorrect.
and no one here is crying, once you get some gear rogues aren't bad, but the beginning of this tier was terrible for us. When people aren't having fun playing a class, they stop playing that class...especially at the beginning of an expansion when it's easiest to reroll. The statistic from GC in the title is pretty indicative of just how many people stopped enjoying the current incarnation of rogue. There are a lot things they could fix to make the class better, our talent tree is a great starting place. and all of these things were reported a multitude of times during beta and ignored. That's what this thread is about.
I think someone needs a nice sit down, a cup of tea, biscuit and maybe a nap.
The knee-jerk defence of ret wasn't really needed. When an iconic pure damage class is being played less than a generally low-balled spec (we've been generally unloved as a damage class since inception till Wrath era and still kinda "ok" at best since) it's fair indication there's a problem with the class being compared. That's all he was trying to say dear.
I'm Ret too, I enjoy it, too. Let's agree that we're awesome but rogues aren't in a good place now and the comparison used is a fair one hmm?
Last edited by mercutiouk; 2012-12-06 at 11:12 AM.
Originally Posted by BoubouilleOriginally Posted by xxAkirhaxx
I think it's hilarious that this post was apparently made in context of PvP, because Rogues have been the single best PvP class in the game for a large part of the entire game's history largely due to their stunning capabilities(something that you give the edge to Paladins for one spell that has been nerfed time and time again).
Also, Ret Paladins are pretty worthless in PvP now that PvP power has been adjusted for hybrids and their heals are awful. Even prior to the nerf they were bad at killing anyone and could just heal all day. Now they're just bad at killing anyone.
Originally Posted by BoubouilleOriginally Posted by xxAkirhaxx
And my rogue beats out other players, and there are rogues I know who play far better than I do in similar gear :P
Rogue damage isn't the reason so many have switched characters. Personally, I switched for my raid for healthstones, portals, mobility (what?), multi-dotting and not having more melee. It just works better for me atm, although I have to say recently that I'm finding affliction's gameplay more compelling than anything I've done in WoW since Firelands Subtlety.
Rogue Forum Moderator (formerly Mugajak)
Former Electric Sheep Recruitment Officer (They're Great!) - Kaeldraens
I hold a lot of respect for SimC, even if the results are a bit odd for Rogues (they're not massively off, mind). But the major complaints right now are far more in line with actual spec enjoyment.
Most rogues appreciate that they are in a nice place dps wise. However, the way we obtain this position is incredibly dull. In addition, many of our talents and most of our glyphs are very poor and uninteresting.
I am the lucid dream
Uulwi ifis halahs gag erh'ongg w'ssh
Oh sorry, let me link you something you may actually believe.
http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...ination_Rogue/
http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...ution_Paladin/
Don't dismiss something because you simply want a buff. My previous comment stands.
I give you my response in video format:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4
Well, I spent most of my Glory years (end of Vanilla till end of Wrath most of it as a rogue raid leader) as a rogue. As a class it's lovely to play and it's a shame to see them hurting at the moment. I'm pretty sure I could still un-pack my swords, maces, fists (screw daggers, COMBAT ROGUE FOR LIFE!!!) and blow away most folks as it's a class I have a massive personal affinity for (not saying I'm awesome, I'm saying I "click" amazingly well with rogue, it's like pulling on an old pair of much loved jeans). It doesn't mean they don't have issues at the moment though and that's all the poor OP was trying to point out
Originally Posted by BoubouilleOriginally Posted by xxAkirhaxx
Please find me one instance of the claim "Retribution Paladins do more damage than Rogues"...because that's what you're attempting to disprove with these links. No one has said that. If you're too dense to read the thread before contributing, go see if that guy from page one will share his Crayolas.
Now to illustrate why your claim was dismissed...
http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...ubtlety_Rogue/
http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...ination_Rogue/
http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/.../Combat_Rogue/
Firelands subtlety was hands down my favorite raiding as a rogue...even if I did have to answer the question "Y R U SUB PVE?!" from every clueless tool who inspected me. Sub caught on heavily in DS, so luckily I stopped having to explain "because it's the top single target damage spec".
Last edited by Infective; 2012-12-06 at 11:29 AM.
Oi! Let's all keep a civil tongue. The knee-jerk reply was a bit off colour but Paladins are people too! /sadfaced ex-rogue
Actually, as one small point there's something to keep in mind:
Rogues ALWAYS suck balls in the first tier of a new expansion. They are VERY gear dependant (as are most melee that don't rely on some sort of spellpower conversion type mechanic which basically means Warriors too). As gear improves expect to be back on top again.
Warriors tend to be a bit of a "favoured child" hence the nerf bat gets broken out every tier as they start too high with the crappy gear and get massively stronger with each tier of upgrades.
There will be a boatload of rogues again by the end of the expansion.
Last edited by mercutiouk; 2012-12-06 at 11:28 AM.
Originally Posted by BoubouilleOriginally Posted by xxAkirhaxx
No, it doesn't. Your assumption is that we care about our damage relative to other people (as it stands) and that is the primary complaint. Rogue damage is fine. The class is BORING compared to where it's been in the past, and uninteresting in theory. Check out the rogue talents for PvE! How compelling is that compared to the old talent tree? Here's a hint: there's a right choice for everything but elusiveness/leeching poison, or they don't affect PvE at all. Glyphs? We're in the same place as talents.
As the OP mentions, we're hoping for changes to talents in 5.2 (but unfortunately we're mostly looking at numerical tweaks). What gave anyone the idea rogues are complaining about their DPS? Personally I'd like to see sub actually outdamaging assassination when it's played well, but eh, mostly I just don't want them to be boring anymore. With very few exceptions, I can play my rogue with 1-5 and S1-5, where my warlock is using those, and q/e/f/g and their shifts, the odd 6-= that I haven't had the time to remap yet, and some things I put around to click because I just don't have the patience to learn more new bindings right now.
Rogue Forum Moderator (formerly Mugajak)
Former Electric Sheep Recruitment Officer (They're Great!) - Kaeldraens