[MoP] Protection Paladin Guide

[Deleted]

I honestly have no clue. I was driven mad on PTR though as our monk was checking out the changes and was running with RJW. Its just no fun, I can tell you that :-)

Whats that avatar btw.? Seems familiar but I just cant place it

Gordon Ramsay?

[Promdates]

I honestly have no clue. I was driven mad on PTR though as our monk was checking out the changes and was running with RJW. Its just no fun, I can tell you that :-)

Whats that avatar btw.? Seems familiar but I just cant place it

I used RJW for a lot of T15 honestly, maybe a few fights where I might use Xuen. I can see using the new RJW on trash, maybe on a few bosses that have lots of adds that spawn, but I'll prob end up using Xuen on more fights in T16, especially with the changes they did to him.

edit: Yeah, Gordon Ramsey from Kitchen Nightmares/Hell's Kitchen/Master Chef/every other major cooking show between UK and USA.

[Riemu2k3]

I used RJW for a lot of T15 honestly, maybe a few fights where I might use Xuen. I can see using the new RJW on trash, maybe on a few bosses that have lots of adds that spawn, but I'll prob end up using Xuen on more fights in T16, especially with the changes they did to him.

edit: Yeah, Gordon Ramsey from Kitchen Nightmares/Hell's Kitchen/Master Chef/every other major cooking show between UK and USA.

I have to say I'm so glad they made those Xuen changes. That damn tiger cost me my last nerves in T15. Constantly doing things he wasn't supposed to - like offtanking mobs in the middle of nowhere.

[Nairobi]

Oh and to top this off NB (i'm just gonna shortcut you NB from now on Nairobi if thats alright): They now have a spinning crane kick THAT DOESNT LOCK THEM OUT OF ANYTHING (fucking RJW)

Meaning: KEGMASH RUSHINGJADEWIND KEGSMASHWHILERUSHINGJADEWINDISACTIVE ROFLPOWOMG

I saw it in the other thread and figured as much.

RJW does look really interesting, but I've not tested it much. I seem to recall it's a loss at certain breakpoints since the DPS is a bit lower than SCK, but the tick time is longer, meaning a net gain in NRG. However, for BRM that pretty much means just an extra jab, so not a ton of DPS and certainly not a ton of AOE.

I think RJW is actually a dps loss above 4 targets.

Apparently it's 4.

I used RJW for a lot of T15 honestly, maybe a few fights where I might use Xuen. I can see using the new RJW on trash, maybe on a few bosses that have lots of adds that spawn, but I'll prob end up using Xuen on more fights in T16, especially with the changes they did to him.

Hmm, really? I thought RJW would get more use. Don't get me wrong, I love the changes to Xuen, but figured with more than a few fights featuring cleave situations that RJW would be better. I need to monk more

[Riemu2k3]

Gonna derail the converation abit but I'm sure you'll pick it up again :-)

I have 2/2 brutal talisman, 0/2 hc feathers, 0/2 hc twins-str-critproc

Should I just stick with the talisman? or upgrade feathers and use them? or use feathers without upgrading them (i actually hope to get 1-2 items im missing and i dont have any valor left)?

All those trinket changes confuse me

[Promdates]

Hmm, really? I thought RJW would get more use. Don't get me wrong, I love the changes to Xuen, but figured with more than a few fights featuring cleave situations that RJW would be better. I need to monk more

The problem with the new RJW is it's directly less damage than SCK. EVEN if you can manage to get a jab or two in, it's still less damage. Using 522 MH/OH and 150k ap:

31,102-37,325 SCK = 273,708 for 2 SCK

18,606-22,343 New RJW or 184,270 for 1 RJW

Two Jab's won't come close to the almost 100k damage difference.

[itsyaboy]

@Firefly: Ji-Kun HC is solotankable. Big adds can be handled by ret/cat/warri etc. and the talonrake can be resetted by running away before and let the boss do the rake onto a *guess what* GID! No joke

The only thing you have to worry about is the nasty dot, but still easily done with zerg strat.

Ok I gotto pour salt into it... 2 kills, 2 chests (ret+prot) :-)

im actually really mad. 12 H, 10 N, 15 Coins, no chest. DA WORSE MECHANIC AND LOOT BOSS EVER

[Nairobi]

Two Jab's won't come close to the almost 100k damage difference.

To be fair, it'd be 2 jabs AND a BOK.

Plus you can still stack EB while RJW'ing. For what that's worth...

[Deleted]

Thinking ahead to the new gear and the possibility of my getting to a 50% haste "cap", how can you gauge this? Is it just your % haste stat in the armory or are there any complications (like raid buffs, melee vs spell haste etc that I am all vague on)? Right now I think the game says I'm at about 30% haste or so, so it's a long way to go for me but just curious.

[Deleted]

Thinking ahead to the new gear and the possibility of my getting to a 50% haste "cap", how can you gauge this? Is it just your % haste stat in the armory or are there any complications (like raid buffs, melee vs spell haste etc that I am all vague on)? Right now I think the game says I'm at about 30% haste or so, so it's a long way to go for me but just curious.

21250 haste rating. buffs don't matter since they're attack speed not actual haste. (and it's melee not spell haste)

[Vaggelis]

Hey all, just wanted to ask, did the macro to calculate avoidance got removed? Cuz i can't see it anywhere. If it did can anybody send it to me?

[Deleted]

Hey all, just wanted to ask, did the macro to calculate avoidance got removed? Cuz i can't see it anywhere. If it did can anybody send it to me?

Avoidance?
Ignore it completely. -> Problem solved!

Long version:
There is no point in optimizing your D/P ratio anymore. Simply reforging the highest avoidance stat on your gear to haste/mastery/hit/expertise nets the highest benefit. As their value is way higher than that of avoidance.

[Deleted]

Hey all, just wanted to ask, did the macro to calculate avoidance got removed? Cuz i can't see it anywhere. If it did can anybody send it to me?

Block and avoidance (CTC) are on two different /roll tables so you can no longer CTC cap yourself. As such there's no point in using a CTC macro anymore. Nor is there much reason to go for avoidance at all anyhow.

[Zambal]

Ok I got two questions, first how do I create mousover link for wowhead?
Second I am wondering between these two shields, atm I got the lfr version from spirit kings:
http://www.wowhead.com/item=86778

But I just got the heroic thundeforged healer shield from twins:
http://www.wowhead.com/item=96910

My question is the healer shield alot better or not, from my pov it seems like I should use the healer one, but I could be wrong...

[Deleted]

Healer shield without a doubt. It is so much better than the spirit kings shield.

[trystero]

One is 541....the other 476...

Strength/avoidance would have to be REALLY good to offset that difference.

[Vaggelis]

Oh ok thanks didn't know that.

[Riemu2k3]

On a semi-offtopic sidenote:

I was on PTR yesterday (Flexraid testing) in a 10-man raid. I got completely obliterated by our Prot Warrior. It wasn't even funny anymore. Maybe something to do with the gear scaling to 520 (still had 41% haste though because of gems/sockets). But seriously, the buffs to prot warrior are really something to look at. Single target tanking as well as aoe tanking. It's like kegsmash all over again. Jump -> Thunderclap -> 1-2 Deep Wounds ticks -> GG aggro. If there are 3 mobs or less, it gets even worse because of the revenge rage change.

It's especially noticable in a 0 vengeance szenario.

----

The change they did with ground / aoe effects not affecting vengeance really bothers me. Especially in conjunction with the decline in multi-target vengeance. We did Galakras yesterday and this fight just sucks to tank. It literally sucks.

You take so much damage from AoE effects / Ground effects / Fire effects / Tidal Wave whatever. And it just doesn't add to your vengeance. I mean, you don't even try to stand in shit. You just can't avoid it when you're tanking 5 mobs or 2 prot drakes and the bowmen keep shooting stuff at your feet. Even though flexraid is abit overtuned atm - I think in normal / hc it's gonna be even worse.

I tanked 3-4 mobs most of the time + took alot of damage, really alot of damage at times - and my vengeance just never climbed past 50-70k. Mostly because nothing that counts as aoe / ground or whatever damage gives you vengeance anymore and those mobs don't give you enough vengeance due to the 1/n? diminishing return thingy. You really need to make sure to split the adds right down in the middle now in order to maximize vengeance / damage.

Anybody else notice that?

[Deleted]

On a semi-offtopic sidenote:

I was on PTR yesterday (Flexraid testing) in a 10-man raid. I got completely obliterated by our Prot Warrior. It wasn't even funny anymore. Maybe something to do with the gear scaling to 520 (still had 41% haste though because of gems/sockets). But seriously, the buffs to prot warrior are really something to look at. Single target tanking as well as aoe tanking. It's like kegsmash all over again. Jump -> Thunderclap -> 1-2 Deep Wounds ticks -> GG aggro. If there are 3 mobs or less, it gets even worse because of the revenge rage change.

It's especially noticable in a 0 vengeance szenario.

----

The change they did with ground / aoe effects not affecting vengeance really bothers me. Especially in conjunction with the decline in multi-target vengeance. We did Galakras yesterday and this fight just sucks to tank. It literally sucks.

You take so much damage from AoE effects / Ground effects / Fire effects / Tidal Wave whatever. And it just doesn't add to your vengeance. I mean, you don't even try to stand in shit. You just can't avoid it when you're tanking 5 mobs or 2 prot drakes and the bowmen keep shooting stuff at your feet. Even though flexraid is abit overtuned atm - I think in normal / hc it's gonna be even worse.

I tanked 3-4 mobs most of the time + took alot of damage, really alot of damage at times - and my vengeance just never climbed past 50-70k. Mostly because nothing that counts as aoe / ground or whatever damage gives you vengeance anymore and those mobs don't give you enough vengeance due to the 1/n? diminishing return thingy. You really need to make sure to split the adds right down in the middle now in order to maximize vengeance / damage.

Anybody else notice that?

It's my experience that vengeance levels rise a lot from lfr > normal > heroic (and I'd assume flex too) without the actual damage intake rising all that much even single target. I don't think it'll be that bad although I must admit doing Galakrond was slightly dissapointing consideirng how much dmg I was taking at times and how low vengeance I gained from that.

Iron Juggernaut felt a lot better vengeance/dps wise.

[Deleted]

The new 1/n vengeance scaling for mobs is just retarded. It would be fine if they didnt design add fights, but they do.