How are DKs still accepted in Horde OR Alliance?

[Wyattbw09]

There is going to be a lot of hand waving when it comes to DKs in BfA. The Ebon Blade should be hunted down and every single DK put to the sword for what the order did.

[Highwhale]

Dude. Alliance and Horde should have thank Death Knights for preventing Bolvar to unleash Scourge on Broken Shore. Also they do what it needs to do to save Azeroth.

PS Kinda funny how people like to jump on DK and being ok with Illidan... or Sylvanas.

[yetgdhfgh]

The Ebon Blade is prolly gonna keep a low profile from now on with its members free to fight in the Horde and Alliance.

Its not really in anyones best interest to settle old scores with the Ebon Blade at least not yet....

[Friendlyimmolation]

Dude. Alliance and Horde should have thank Death Knights for preventing Bolvar to unleash Scourge on Broken Shore. Also they do what it needs to do to save Azeroth.

PS Kinda funny how people like to jump on DK and being ok with Illidan... or Sylvanas.

Sylvanas and the forsaken weren’t attacking fellow order halls, neither were the Illidari.

She also wasn’t raising one of the Alliances oldest champions, and one of the Horde’s champions as well

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IIRC, death knights attacked lights hope chapel during time the paladins helped priests in their order hall. So they were greatly weakened.
And you as a pala character also go and help the priests.

This is also correct, death knights would have had a bad time if the high lord and every other named high ranking paladin was at lights hope and not just Liadrin.

[Huntaer]

DKs are like walking nukes.

If one side has them then the other side has to have them as a deterrent.

If you can sway as many of them to your side and bring back their past loyalties to home faction then you have a powerful weapon and if your opponent is gathering the same weapon you need something of equal power to hold them in check.

You just explained the US and North Korea in detail.

[Maxilian]

After the DKs attack Light Hope Chapel, they get contacted by the Paladins of their order hall, and they ask for the DK help to fuel an orb with energy or something (the DK do not want to, but because of what they did in LHC, they do as the Paladins want, then they dismiss the paladins while pointing out that they are "even" now)

Note: The only things that may bring problem in general to the DKs now is with the Horde (attacking Undercity, killing guards and freeing a war prisioner) -but unlikely anything will be done about that.

[kasuke06]

Exactly. And they don't give us a drop down menu for responses where we can say, "No Darion, I don't think this is what we need to be doing" or simply "No, I won't be doing that." You pretty much can't get your order hall/artifact up and running if you are unwilling to participate in some heinous acts.

You're an undead monster that's so detached from what it used to be that you don't even sleep anymore and you have an actual need to cause pain and suffering lest your body start to break down on you.

You picked the monster class and you're surprised you're a monster?

[Albert the fish]

by lore the Death Knights are too powerful to send off. maybe not each individual DK but the Ebon Blade as a whole is either going to be a faction that lends warriors to the Alliance and Horde in a sort of loose mercenary fashion. the alternative would be for either major faction STOP currying favor with us and just allow us to slip entirely into the hands of the Lich King and a Lich King with the full might of the Ebon Blade behind it is terrifying for the Horde and the Alliance so they are not about to do that.

it's a matter of "damned if you do, damned if you don't and this damnation is the best possible option at the moment."

[Morgomir]

Well there is the factor of how you complete each the quests, when I went to Light's Hope on my Dk I only killed 6 people and when I'm in the Ruby Sanctum I killed 1 Red Dragon,the Ruby Lorekeeper, no whelps. Its entirely up to you, as the Lich King says when you enter.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

You're an undead monster that's so detached from what it used to be that you don't even sleep anymore and you have an actual need to cause pain and suffering lest your body start to break down on you.

You picked the monster class and you're surprised you're a monster?

My take on DKs from the starter zone was that we were created to be undead monsters, but the series of events between being asked to kill someone we knew from our previous life --> Tirion's intervention at Lights Hope Chapel restored our free will. We may be damned and without happy endings, but I'd never thought of my DK as someone who would go around murdering allies without provocation.

Well there is the factor of how you complete each the quests, when I went to Light's Hope on my Dk I only killed 6 people and when I'm in the Ruby Sanctum I killed 1 Red Dragon,the Ruby Lorekeeper, no whelps. Its entirely up to you, as the Lich King says when you enter.

I reconciled my head cannon with the order hall campaign by deciding that I hadn't done some of these things. Yes, I did the quests because Blizz funnels you through them. I even did the mount one because I needed the number to reach "Lord of the Reins" cheevo. But I don't use that mount; I already have three skele drakes (two from ICC and one from Nightbane) that I like just as much. And (in my head cannon) I never led an assault on LHC; I skipped that step and simply promoted Darion to lead the Four Horsemen, telling him he was every bit the hero - in his own way - that Tirion had been. As for Bolvar? Sometimes I have to remind him that I've already killed one Lich King and if he doesn't mind his place I may have to kill another.

[kasuke06]

My take on DKs from the starter zone was that we were created to be undead monsters, but the series of events between being asked to kill someone we knew from our previous life --> Tirion's intervention at Lights Hope Chapel restored our free will. We may be damned and without happy endings, but I'd never thought of my DK as someone who would go around murdering allies without provocation.

I reconciled my head cannon with the order hall campaign by deciding that I hadn't done some of these things. Yes, I did the quests because Blizz funnels you through them. I even did the mount one because I needed the number to reach "Lord of the Reins" cheevo. But I don't use that mount; I already have three skele drakes (two from ICC and one from Nightbane) that I like just as much. And (in my head cannon) I never led an assault on LHC; I skipped that step and simply promoted Darion to lead the Four Horsemen, telling him he was every bit the hero - in his own way - that Tirion had been. As for Bolvar? Sometimes I have to remind him that I've already killed one Lich King and if he doesn't mind his place I may have to kill another.

That's your interpretation. my paladin is still a blood knight that drains his light powers from a chained up na'aru in the basement of the paladin training area in silvermoon, note the similarities in that both of our characters are utterly against the lore as it stands.

DK's are unrepentant monsters because they literally do not have the same emotions as everyone else anymore. It's entirely possible that they literally can't feel bad about what they're doing, or even might be enthralled to the new lich king bolvar who's seeming a lot more lich kiing-y than his "sacrifice" would imply he was.

[Shelly]

You just explained the US and North Korea in detail.

No. I described MAD.

Mutually Assured Destruction.

Basically nuclear policy from post WW2 to the 1990's.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Before blizzard changed it we literally had the option to genocide the majority part of the remaining red dragons in that stupid quest.. and with the achievment it was even semi-canon, or at least they feared that would be what people think.They took that away. Still, the quests are pants on head retarded. When you recruit that annoying forsaken cunt, you also murder one of you allies, as the Thorongnir (sic?) are allied with us in Stormheim and to a degree Odyn. We just go and kill one of their oldest dragons so that we can nuke some legion fools on the broken shore (and never use her again after that). The DK quests are just nonsensical and make no logic sense given the context and frankly I think they were written by someone who is on the mental level of a 13 year old edgelord.

[Razion]

Because they're heroes who stopped the Lich King. Also helps that Tirion vouches for them. Besides, they're willing to fight for their faction. Who cares where the help comes from?

[Cosmic Janitor]

That's your interpretation. my paladin is still a blood knight that drains his light powers from a chained up na'aru in the basement of the paladin training area in silvermoon, note the similarities in that both of our characters are utterly against the lore as it stands.

DK's are unrepentant monsters because they literally do not have the same emotions as everyone else anymore. It's entirely possible that they literally can't feel bad about what they're doing, or even might be enthralled to the new lich king bolvar who's seeming a lot more lich kiing-y than his "sacrifice" would imply he was.

Tharissan caring to free Koltira clearly disproves that they no longer have any kind of emotion, sense or loyalty.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

DK's are unrepentant monsters because they literally do not have the same emotions as everyone else anymore. It's entirely possible that they literally can't feel bad about what they're doing, or even might be enthralled to the new lich king bolvar who's seeming a lot more lich kiing-y than his "sacrifice" would imply he was.

Not cannon at all. Plenty of examples of DKs weighing the morality of their choices, including Darion Morgraine arguing that we are wrong for attacking Lights Hope Chapel. He says he will do it if we order it, but he strongly feels Tirion deserves better and warns us we will be pariahs on Azeroth for what we are doing.

[Wyattbw09]

Exactly. And they don't give us a drop down menu for responses where we can say, "No Darion, I don't think this is what we need to be doing" or simply "No, I won't be doing that." You pretty much can't get your order hall/artifact up and running if you are unwilling to participate in some heinous acts.

No no, you don't simply participate you order each and every atrocity committed. At several point Darion is like don't do this. There is no coming back from this and you say nope we are doing it.

You can't even blame the Lich King. As far as the world is concerned the Lich King is dead and you alone are ordering the Ebon Blade to commit each and everyone of these depraved evils.

[Halwyn]

A lot of yor confusion comes from trying to piece what you do in-game with the lore. Which do not go hand-in-hand most of the time in WoW.

Yes, you did attack Light's Hope with the intention of getting your fourth Horseman. Yes you wentured to claim essentially a Frost Wyrm on steroids for you to ride. The only problem with that - you don't get to see the benefits those actions reap in the end. Actual ends that justify the means, so to say. You don't get to see the Four in action on Broken Shore (much) and on Argus (at all), to actually see them slaughtering hordes of demons like an unstoppable force they are. You just ride that dragon, yes, but that's about it, you don't actually use it as an air suppot to rain down death on demonic forces while you attack them on ground. You don't raise an undead army to wave at Antorus and say 'sick em', a useful and replacible distraction tool.

THAT is the problem, if you can see the scale of results your actions wrought and get that little thought of 'worth it'. Maybe lore-wise those things ARE happening, and the other class orders agree that while your methods are ruthless, no one can deny your effectiveness on a battlefield. In a sense, DKs are what DHs are supposed to be.

[Kagthul]

There is going to be a lot of hand waving when it comes to DKs in BfA. The Ebon Blade should be hunted down and every single DK put to the sword for what the order did.

What exactly did the Order do, really?

Attacked an organiztion that is their polar opposite? (The Silver Hand, which, like the Ebon Blade, os an independent organiztion not part of the Alliance oe the Horde). Thats not exactly an atrocity or even unexpected. And the Highlord of the Silver Hand says its all good. If the aggrieved party (The Silver Hand) have let it go, then thats that.

The other stuff is... almost entirely unimportant. They whacked a Forsaken who was having delusions of grandeur and was about to set himself up as King of Stromgarde. Big whup. I have to immagine Sylvanas is happy about it, to be honest. Similarly... they broke Koltira out of captivity, but left no living witnesses, so no one has any proof that the Ebon Blade was responsible.

Umm.. wiped out the Scarlet Nuissance? No one cares. And/or are happy about it, since theyve always been hostile to both Horde and Alliance.

Sooooo yeah. Not really sure any of that requires a crusade to hunt them down.

Before you bust out the “but muh dwaguns!” Arguments... all that happened, canonically, is that we were arrogant towards some dragons, and roughed up a bronze dragon to get info. The slaughter of the red dragons is entirely optional (i completed it without killing any dragons) and not canon (which was one of the reasons the FoS achievement was removed).

So, yeah... dem terrible, terrible DKs.

Of all the campaigns, i liked the DK the best, because it displayed (very well) that ot everything in the Warcraft universe ismbright and shiny, and that often times, the “heroes” arent neccessarily good people. Just because youre the protagonist doesnt mean youre a good person. (See also: Warlocks, Shadow Priests, Demon Hunters, Trolls)

I like the depiction of the Ebon Blade as a group that has realized that they are utterly damned, and that they embrace it, and do the things that must be done that others cannot, or should not do.

We do what the living cannot, as they say.

[AcidicSyn]

Well, to be fair, the DKs make up for their attack on Light's Hope to the Paladins. Spoiler warning.

If you go after the hidden ret skin as a pally, the last step of the skin requires you to go to Acherus with one other NPC pally. You fly in and basically demand the four horsemen empower Ashbringer with their powers. They make a point of saying the DKs and Pallies are even now.

As far as the dragon aspects go, iirc they're pretty well dismantled at this point. There's a few remnants of the aspects tending to a few key aspects related places but otherwise they're well since done. So chances of word spreading that far might be little to none. Could be wrong though.

I didn't know about the Pally ret skin quest, that much at least is pretty cool that they addressed.

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Well I'm starting a war with the Red and Bronze Dragon Flights just so I can have a new mount to ride.

Make sure to kill every single pathetic red dragon you find in that filthy sanctum of theirs! let the hate empower you, and suffer well!