Method just killed Argus on Mythic

[Coldfire989]

10/11 on first day.
11/11 after first reset.

Well done Blizz.. loool.. such a joke tuning again..

And gz Method!

Because the top guild in the world that raids an insane amount of time and does split runs out the ass beating it quick means it is tuned bad. Riiiiight.

[netherflame]

Says who? Make me then.
I could argue that since I've voted with my wallet, I have just as valid reason to comment the balance state of the game as you do. It might even be the reason I'm not giving Blizzard any more of my money.

Good you voted with your wallet on things of the past, go somehwere else where you are actually supporting a product and critique that.

[Deleted]

Good you voted with your wallet on things of the past, go somehwere else where you are actually supporting a product and critique that.

Where in the forum rules does it say that? Are you a mod?
How about this - mind your own fucking business and leave the forum moderation to the actual moderator. If you don't like my posts, go ahead and put me on your ignore list. I don't mind. I promise.

[Spotnick]

You are aware that i am looking on Method world firsts and not the actual playerbase? Less then a week it took to clear it. Method had much harder raids in WoD.

Yes, people never get better over time.

[Onikaroshi]

Considering very rarely does the race exceed 3-4 guilds, this was definitely abnormal.

ToS had 9, it's been awhile since it was 3 or 4, and really there were only 2 guilds "racing" none of the others were ever going to win.

[IceMan1763]

Because the top guild in the world that raids an insane amount of time and does split runs out the ass beating it quick means it is tuned bad. Riiiiight.

"Bad" might be a matter of opinion. Raids are tuned differently now than they were in the past, that's for sure though. The difference is in where powerful gear is acquired from for guilds competing at that high of a level. Split raiding, TF proc range being WAY too high, and the importance of Legiondaries in Legion meant time is an incredibly (to an unhealthy level competition wise) valuable commodity. Basically to the point that almost all of the gear (and traits, in Legion's case) necessary to defeat the whole raid could be acquired before the raid even opens, if the raid as a whole has the grinding time.

In my opinion, the state of high end raiding is in a terrible, awful, incredibly unhealthy place right now. The hardest part about participating in it is having the requisite free time raiding at that level requires.

And yes, all of it IS the fault of Blizzard devs who simply could care less.

- - - Updated - - -

Yes, people never get better over time.

You're saying the guilds competing at the top level are more skilled at the game now than they were back in the Wrath/Cata days when skill was FAR more important and 3-4 times the number of people played the game?

I think you're pretty naive if you think you can say that for sure. I think you could make a case that the players of that era were probably MORE skilled than the "top 50 guild" raiders of today.

[Onikaroshi]

"Bad" might be a matter of opinion. Raids are tuned differently now than they were in the past, that's for sure though. The difference is in where powerful gear is acquired from for guilds competing at that high of a level. Split raiding, TF proc range being WAY too high, and the importance of Legiondaries in Legion meant time is an incredibly (to an unhealthy level competition wise) valuable commodity. Basically to the point that almost all of the gear (and traits, in Legion's case) necessary to defeat the whole raid could be acquired before the raid even opens, if the raid as a whole has the grinding time.

In my opinion, the state of high end raiding is in a terrible, awful, incredibly unhealthy place right now. The hardest part about participating in it is having the requisite free time raiding at that level requires.

And yes, all of it IS the fault of Blizzard devs who simply could care less.

- - - Updated - - -



You're saying the guilds competing at the top level are more skilled at the game now than they were back in the Wrath/Cata days when skill was FAR more important and 3-4 times the number of people played the game?

I think you're pretty naive if you think you can say that for sure. I think you could make a case that the players of that era were probably MORE skilled than the "top 50 guild" raiders of today.

It's not up to Blizzard to regulate our play time, nor should they base systems around what the "top" does. Everything single thing you mentioned is not an issue to 99% of the player base.

[IceMan1763]

It's not up to Blizzard to regulate our play time, nor should they base systems around what the "top" does. Everything single thing you mentioned is not an issue to 99% of the player base.

It is up to Blizzard to provide a somewhat fair and competitive landscape for mythic raiders since mythic raiding is a part of the game.

This is a thread about the mythic race/high end competitive raiding and tuning is an obvious topic of conversation that might come up.

Sorry for bringing it up at such an inappropriate time [/sarcasm]

[Onikaroshi]

It is up to Blizzard to provide a somewhat fair and competitive landscape for mythic raiders since mythic raiding is a part of the game.

This is a thread about the mythic race/high end competitive raiding and tuning is an obvious topic of conversation that might come up.

Sorry for bringing it up at such an inappropriate time [/sarcasm]

They don't care about the mythic race beyond, grats you won. And there's zero reason they should, you start basing things around what Method does to compete and it just starts trickling down and hurting other raid teams, I mean... look at what people suggest to get rid of split raiding... forced personal with no trading, account locks, etc. its all horrible.

[Zoldor]

After the complaints from Exo and Method last tier about stupid tuning for the sake of stupid tuning I think they were happy with this. No one wants it to last more than about 14 days max besides spectators that want to dream about the insane difficulty. Blizz recognized how much strain the last raid put on the community and how many guild breakers were in the mix. Burnout because shit is massively overtuned isn't really what they are going for with their gameplay experience.

Also, lol at anyone who thinks 7 days on a single boss isn't long enough. I think folks expected Coven, Vari and Aggramar to be more difficult, but after the last tier and titan forge gearing it is going to be tough to tune a raid accurately. Blizz brought that upon themselves by creating insane gearing abilities through raids and M+. It is always going to be hard to tune things to an accurate level and Antorus will probably turn out to be a well tuned raid for the average raid group.

[Gimlix]

Yes, people never get better over time.

1. We talking about world firsts, they all got skills.
2. They all got the same around ilvl (on each patch)
3. It's all about how hard Blizzard designed the raid. This time around, it was not hard designed.

[Taeldorian]

1. We talking about world firsts, they all got skills.
2. They all got the same around ilvl (on each patch)
3. It's all about how hard Blizzard designed the raid. This time around, it was not hard designed.

Not hard but the last boss took 2 lockouts to kill for the best guild in the world. Okay bud.

I guess every boss that doesn’t last 4-5 lockouts is terrible, badly tuned and not at all hard. Blackhand, guldan, helya, imperator (which was claimed to be one of the most exciting boss fights on M), Garrosh, etc.

But KJ who lasted 3(?) lockouts was awesome and super hard but yet every guild hated him. I don’t think you understand the difference between tuning and challenging. KJ was hard as fuck but terribly tuned and very annoying making that boss fight garbage. Just because it lasted long doesn’t mean it was a good fight.

[Ryry]

10/11 on first day.
11/11 after first reset.

Well done Blizz.. loool.. such a joke tuning again..

And gz Method!

Yeah what's your current progression in this joke tuned mythic?

[Gimlix]

Not hard but the last boss took 2 lockouts to kill for the best guild in the world. Okay bud.

I guess every boss that doesn’t last 4-5 lockouts is terrible, badly tuned and not at all hard. Blackhand, guldan, helya, imperator (which was claimed to be one of the most exciting boss fights on M), etc.

Exciting and hard are 2 different things. I loved the first boss in ICC, but was it ever hard? Ow hell no.
I know you big nerd fanboys of WoW won't think any other way but "WoW is the greatest game ever" but i got news for you. WoW is not so great anymore and so isn't this end raid.

[Dormie]

I don't think world first players are so much better than people think. I think any "good" player could be world first if they had the same raid schedule as the people attempting world first. Don't get me wrong they're about as good at WoW as you can be, but I could handpicked about 10 raiders I know that are just or nearly as good. Difference is the number of pulls.

[Gimlix]

Yeah what's your current progression in this joke tuned mythic?

Retarded statement once again. "Well show me ur mythic" Did he even say that he would clear it? Did any of us?
We came here to watch the best of the best fighting for weeks over a world first. Seeing them clear it all in 1 week time is a massive dissapointment and a big failure of Blizzard.

But your whiteknight eyes will probably not see that part. all you see is "Show me ur mythic then" Because that is all you can say.

Infracted.

[Taeldorian]

Exciting and hard are 2 different things. I loved the first boss in ICC, but was it ever hard? Ow hell no.
I know you big nerd fanboys of WoW won't think any other way but "WoW is the greatest game ever" but i got news for you. WoW is not so great anymore and so isn't this end raid.

Quote me where I said wow is the best game ever. Quote me where I praised blizzard for there amazing tuning this expansion. Go ahead.

You won’t because you can’t. You’re talking for me instead of reading my posts. You contribute nothing to the thread.

The first 10 bosses were easier than expected, especially coven. However argus lasted 2 lockouts and was a very fun fight by the looks of it.

[Gimlix]

Quote me where I said wow is the best game ever. Quote me where I praised blizzard for there amazing tuning this expansion. Go ahead.

You won’t becusse you can’t. You’re talking for me instead of reading my posts. You contribute nothing to the thread.

The first 10 bosses were easier than expected, especially coven. However argus lasted 2 lockouts and was a very fun fight by the looks of it.

Actually i am contributing more to the thread then most here. Especially those saying "Show me ur mythic progress"

[Taeldorian]

Actually i am contributing more to the thread then most here. Especially those saying "Show me ur mythic progress"

Not gonna show me where I said wow is the best game ever? Not gonna show me where I praised blizzard for their amazing tuning?

Course not because I said the opposite of that second part but you’re too busy spewing random bullshit to actually read my post that you responded to.

Watching the argus fight it looks like one of the best fights we’ve seen in a while yet you think it’s trash because why? It didn’t last long enough? It lasted 2 lockouts before the best guild in the world killed it. That’s a pretty long time for the best guild.

KJ was absolute assdick. He lasted 3 lockouts but is probably one of the worst fights due to awful tuning and mechanics in general. He was hard for the sake of being hard (aka bad tuning) and that resulted in all These guilds saying kJ is the worst fight they’ve seen. Argus is clearly way better and the guilds clearly had a lot more fun with it.

It was clearly an exciting fight. Maybe the rest of the raid was a bit poorly tuned for these mythic guilds but it’s quite evident they enjoyed the last boss which is really all that matters in the end since it’s all people remember from these races.

You said it yourself bud. Hard doesn’t mean fun or exciting. What matters more? That the fight was so tightly tuned it took a long time to kill (KJ) or a fight that was tuned very well and was mechanically interesting but lasted for less time (Argus)? You tell me

[Gimlix]

Not gonna show me where I said wow is the best game ever? Not gonna show me where I praised blizzard for their assdick tuning?

Course not because I said the opposite of that second part but you’re too busy spewing random bullshit to actually read my post that you responded to.

Watching the argus fight it looks like one of the best fights we’ve seen in a while yet you think it’s trash because why? It didn’t last long enough? It lasted 2 lockouts before the best guild in the world killed it. That’s a pretty long time for the best guild.

KJ was absolute

Because the fight is fun for once doesn't mean it's good when it comes to raid quality.
High end raiding should take forever to be completed. They need to give you some sort of satisfaction. I see no point to be happy about clearing a raid in a week time.
Yes they are the best, yes they basically no lifed it. But still. A mythic raid should be designed to be as hard as possible and let only the best of the best slowly get through it.

But hey. most people in todays MMORPG world, rather want it to be quick and easy and as nerfed as possible. So i'm glad u like it.