Why does versatility exist?

[Firefall]

How about a stat that gives an x% chance for a spell with a CD to not trigger its CD when cast?

Cool but not easily balanced. There is no relationship between CD length and damage/rotational value that spans specs or classes, so you can't easily scale it either. Fun for trinkets or tier/heart of Azeroth tho.

[Puri]

They removed multistrike because it caused performance issues on both the client and the server, it was already announced that they are going to remove it when they streamlined many often-ticking abilities into ticks with higher value but longer period in the middle of wod.

Generally I agree, versatility is a very boring stat.
Performance wise it's for most dps specs pretty bad, but usually it's not as bad as people make it out to be, with current gear for most specs it's about half as valuable as their best stat. It's better for classes that are ressource limited (like arcane or outlaw).

But I could not think of a different stat to replace it that would be equally valuable for all classes and roles and not some boring stat.

[schwarzkopf]

Couple of questions, if I may. What is it about versatility that you enjoy? What is your main spec?

Fundamentally all 4 numbers just increase your throughput in various ways:
Haste makes you go faster, crit makes you go bigger (sometimes), mastery makes you do X (spec specific) and mastery makes you go bigger (consistently).

As an Arcane mage - you are always about forward planning, not 'twitching' - versatility is nice as it gives you more control over that planning.

On my Balance Druid though - I love mastery and haste, and vers is the last on the list because you are firing things off way faster and wanting more bang for buck.

Of course that might all change if I EVER get some tier gear to drop from Antorus (0/26 on main tier rolls so far).

I play for enjoyment not perfection, so your mileage may vary.

[Swizzington]

That could work if we limited it to spells that have their cooldowns reduced by haste.

Yeah that probably makes sense.

[Zamfix]

IMO Blizzard should rework these stats into something that makes sense for what they are used for. Haste and crit are the only ones that easily makes sense - terms wise and through the name as well. I've always been confused about mastery and versatility... what does it mean and what does it do for you? It really should make more sense. Heck, if the term doesn't make sense for the class, have the stat be called something else for another class/spec, just like how a gear piece changes from agility to strength

If only the stats had tooltips that tell you what they do...

[Detheavn]

because arp was to simple and boring?

As a stat in itself it was boring, but back in WotLK when the stars aligned, the elders chanted my name and my ArP trinket procced, little kitty meow meow capped and skyrocketed on the meters, giving tanks a little challenge to keep aggro.

I loved WotLK feral dps <3

[schwarzkopf]

IMO Blizzard should rework these stats into something that makes sense for what they are used for. Haste and crit are the only ones that easily makes sense

Crit makes the least sense of the four... it should be the first to go.
Crit is the only one that removes control from you and gives control of your output to the RNG machine.

[Swizzington]

Cool but not easily balanced. There is no relationship between CD length and damage/rotational value that spans specs or classes, so you can't easily scale it either. Fun for trinkets or tier/heart of Azeroth tho.

As another guy suggested, it would probably only work for certain spells, like ones that were already reduced by haste. Idk, I think it could probably work, just have to do it right.

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Crit makes the least sense of the four... it should be the first to go.
Crit is the only one that removes control from you and gives control of your output to the RNG machine.

I think crit is the most fun. Getting a series of big numbers in a row feels very satisfying.

[Florena]

They wanted another secondary stat but didn't have any ideas other than 'hit harder' (crit) 'hit faster' (haste) and they already have mastery as one that varies by spec.

[kasuke06]

It's an easy extra stat, that's why. They wanted 4 secondaries and vers just requires like no balancing.

Hell, why do you think FFXIV added it.

which stat is it in ffxiv?

[Stormcall]

It's such a God awful boring stat. Between that and multistrike,why did they decide to remove the one that was actually fun

Cause they needed a filler stat for gear that, in theory, will sorta work equally well for anyone. The theory works, it does work sorta equally for everyone...it's just equally meh.

[schwarzkopf]

I think crit is the most fun. Getting a series of big numbers in a row feels very satisfying.

I think crit is the least fun. Getting a series of low numbers in a row feels very frustrating.

Enough of the game revolves around procs already, I'd like to not have the RNG gods double dipping on every cast.

[Keltas]

No. Needing to cap hit and expertise added nothing to game play, it was just a pain in the ass. Especially if you were overcapped and the extra was just worthless wasted stats

At one point I remember them talking about making excess hit/expertise convert into extra damage.

I think returning them with that, and perhaps the "differing" hit values on a boss by boss basis (mentioned in the same interview) would be a good idea as a stat to re-add.

You could even bring back armor/spell pen alongside hit by making your hit % over the cap become your chance to ignore the targets resistances, and bring back varying resistances/hit ratings (to an extent) for certain fights.

[Emerald Archer]

Performance wise it's for most dps specs pretty bad, but usually it's not as bad as people make it out to be, with current gear for most specs it's about half as valuable as their best stat. It's better for classes that are ressource limited (like arcane or outlaw).

But I could not think of a different stat to replace it that would be equally valuable for all classes and roles and not some boring stat.

No for most specs, it's only slightly worse than their best stats (assuming they're geared) Like for example, boomkins can commonly see mast/haste worth 32-34 dps per point, and vers 30-31 dps per point.

And for MM, you could see mast/crit worth 45ish dps per point, with vers worth 40-44 dps per point.

Just because it's your worst stat of the 4, does not mean it is a bad or weak stat. People need to look at the real difference between the stats, not just look at some random online guide that has "Crit>Mast>Haste>Vers" and think, damn that's a trash stat.

Boring? Sure, if you aren't doing very high content. But if you are? Vers defensively starts to matter as a dps.

[Blamblam41]

To add onto what that guy said, it's not just a defensive stat for tanks, it's a defensive stat for dps.
It's not a truly bad stat for most specs, it might not be best, but it isn't trash. It's just flat dmg.

But it comes in handy for people doing very high end content, tanky builds for super high m+, or for very high dmg mythic raid encounters (Aggramar is a good example of that)

Instead of giving dps no option to be tankier (outside of the little bit of stam stacking you could do and the rare tank trinket) now we have prydaz/avoidance/vers, options that aren't making people lose a shit ton of dps just to make work.

Versatility hardly makes DPS 'tankier'. The amount of damage reduction it gives is absolutely minimal in any situation outside of hard math statistical boss encounters where literally taking .5% less damage is 'beneficial to the raid group'.

Armor giving bonus attack power (essentially what versatility is, Armored to the Teeth but for every class) is the absolutely boring without any redeeming qualities in gameplay. Its only redemption is that it is statistically good, but in practice it fails to augment gameplay in any real manner like how haste (reduces cast time, reduces cooldowns of certai spells, reduces auto-attack delay, increases dot tick timer) crit (enables certain effects for certain classes built around it and is the basis of RNG proc stats) and mastery (unique for every class, generally just +damage in a class flavor).

And that's where versatility falls flat, when you realize we already had versatility in as far back as Cata, but they changed how it scaled and threw damage reduction on it while removing the class flavor. It's as bland and as pointless a stat as you can get. But if that damage was crit damage.... Things would be different, obviously. It would be an actually interesting stat for classes that use crit primarily and thus would have a legitimate affect on gameplay.

[Goondicker]

No. Needing to cap hit and expertise added nothing to game play, it was just a pain in the ass. Especially if you were overcapped and the extra was just worthless wasted stats

This was only really the case after stats could be reforged. Before that, it altered your gearing and such in an interesting way (imo).

[Puri]

No for most specs, it's only slightly worse than their best stats (assuming they're geared) Like for example, boomkins can commonly see mast/haste worth 32-34 dps per point, and vers 30-31 dps per point.

And for MM, you could see mast/crit worth 45ish dps per point, with vers worth 40-44 dps per point.

Just because it's your worst stat of the 4, does not mean it is a bad or weak stat. People need to look at the real difference between the stats, not just look at some random online guide that has "Crit>Mast>Haste>Vers" and think, damn that's a trash stat.

Boring? Sure, if you aren't doing very high content. But if you are? Vers defensively starts to matter as a dps.

Well for my BM haste is worth 42 and versatility 24, for my affliction mastery is at 37 and versatility at 26.
Obviously we can now go through all specs, but it also depends on itemlevel and on your current stat distribution. But generally we already agree, as I said it's not as bad as people make it out to be.

[Emerald Archer]

Versatility hardly makes DPS 'tankier'. The amount of damage reduction it gives is absolutely minimal in any situation outside of hard math statistical boss encounters where literally taking .5% less damage is 'beneficial to the raid group'.

Maybe if you don't hold onto viable gear it's only .5%, but I can switch around gear that equates to 5% dmg reduction and 15% avoidance, with only a little bit of a dps loss for content that needs it. And that little stuff matters when you're doing very high m+ and are at risk of being 1 shot even with Prydaz on.

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Well for my BM haste is worth 42 and versatility 24, for my affliction mastery is at 37 and versatility at 26.
Obviously we can now go through all specs, but it also depends on itemlevel and on your current stat distribution. But generally we already agree, as I said it's not as bad as people make it out to be.

That's not common though,

Haste 44.32
Vers 33.74

That's a much more realistic balance for BM, assuming your stats aren't poor. And my haste is worth more than it should be, as I have very low haste.

And for very geared afflictions, Your best stat 48+ vers 40+.

How geared are you? Your dps per point is very low.

[Onikaroshi]

which stat is it in ffxiv?

Tenacity, its the same thing, but relegated to tanking jobs only.

[Jastall]

Dang, I had forgotten about multistrike. I remember they were going through all these ideas and iterations for stat system reworks and had all these exciting ideas for new stats they could do. And in the end they came up with...versatility...literally the most boring, useless state in existence. I was both disappointed and sickened.

Personally I want hit and expertise too, but maybe that's just me.

The only three stats I ever hated more than Versa were Hit and Expertise, and Defense as well. Cap stats are worthless and stupid as far as I'm concerned. No stat should add literally nothing to your character once you hit an arbitrary threshold.

I do agree Versa is boring, but it's a tank and PvP stat first and foremost. They could perhaps have done it differently, but I understand why it's there. Maybe Blizz should just implement a fifth, more interesting stat, albeit exactly what it would be I have no clue about.

I didn't like Multistrike personally. First because it was a reskinned Crit, second because they stole Elemental's iconic Mastery to implement it, and third (which is a petty reason I know) because I like big numbers and seeing them eclipsed by some random who-the-fuck-cares Multistrike hit felt bad.