New York City to Sue Oil Companies for Contributing to Global Warming

[Deleted]

Didn't we agree its climate change? Its snowing in sahara atm

[Zmaniac17]

Well I'd imagine it's hard to go with the idea of global warming when it's provable that the earth is still far cooler now than it has been in the past entirety that we've been able to observe.... globally.

Global warming causes climate change. When the Earth's temperature rises it causes different and more extreme weather patterns. The idea that the Earth has been warmer in the past disregards what conditions were like in the past. Many of the plants and species that exist today were not around then. To put it simply the animals and plants of today would not survive in climates that existed in the past.

Much of the concern about global warming has to do with the rate at which it is changing. With such a fast dramatic change many or most species may not survive without the thousands or even hundreds of thousands of years they usually get to adapt to new climates.



This chart is a bit hard to read but it was the best I could find on quick notice. The timeline is changing from millions to thousands on the X axis so it makes the spikes over millions of years seem very quick in comparison to later in the time line. It's interesting to look at the Earth prior to 500 million years ago as well. Life can survive in extreme environments. It's really a question how you want to live and what you want to survive on Earth. Prior to 2.5 billion years ago the atmosphere was made up of methane and ammonia. But there was life!

[Deleted]

New York always had bad ass majors in the past but now somehow got this guy into office. Wtf happened?

[Eldar45]

One of the things that is really annoying about analogies is that people who are intent on missing the point, like you, will find one detail and pretend like it's a big deal without explaining why that should actually affect the analogy. Analogies, by their very nature, are comparing similar aspects of things that are not the same.

I will say, however, that gasoline and oil are also public health hazards in addition to being vital to civilization.

The Point
_________
Your Head

The reason why Tobacco companies got their butts handed to them by the courts is because Cigarettes are not necessary or needed, they are just dangerous. The same thing most likely won't happen to Oil companies as a whole, even if NYC is trying to.

Basically what some other posters has said is true: If NYC tries to get restrictions on Oil companies, then the oil companies will boycott. CO2-less energy needs to really become a thing before Oil and Coal can be done away with.




In other-words, your analogy doesn't really reflect on the situation at all.

[Flarelaine]

Quite frankly, I don't give a shit about that and neither do most people who rely on cars for personal transportation. The fact is, I need to be able to get around from point A to point B, and the only way to do so quickly, efficiently and reliably (and affordably) is cars. Cars require fuel. Nothing can change that fact. So until such a time comes that something as reliable and cheap as a car that runs on fuel comes along, I will continue to purchase gas for my car as a necessity of life.

What oil companies have claimed about global warming is completely and utterly irrelevant and does nothing to change the realities of my daily life.

You could already have cheap and reliable electric cars... except oil companies have been busy buying up all the patents relating to that. I saw a study a few years back that said ChevronTexaco was sitting on the largest collection of them.

[rda]

For those new to the topic:

1. This isn't the first such lawsuit, this is part of a bigger picture which includes lawsuits in California, etc.

2. Exxon and several others have been trying to sit on two seats regarding global warming for years, because the projected / partially implemented regulations were hitting their competitors (= coal) more. They are learning their lesson now and are already countersuing.

3. The lawsuits will pretty much certainly end with nothing, they are just there for virtue signaling. It was more interesting before when the accusers were trying to say that Exxon knew about the terrible, terrible effect of CO2 on the climate yet continued their evil, evil practices of selling people fuel, but this seems to have ended.

[Noradin]

So what you're saying is I can't drive anymore and I have to use corn to power my house? Wtf liberals.

Yes, you have to feed corn to your hamsters, all the grain is reserved for alcohol production :P

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Well I'd imagine it's hard to go with the idea of global warming when it's provable that the earth is still far cooler now than it has been in the past entirety that we've been able to observe.... globally.

Do share your sources...

[Dug]

Do share your sources...

Don't bother it's a bullshit argument from the start. The earths climate has in fact been much hotter WAAAAAAAY back in the day before humans and they'll just say "Yeah but earth survived see!!" when nobody is arguing that the planet is going to blow up due to a few degree increase.

[matt4pack]

NYC would be one of the major casualties if sea levels rise rapidly. Sure they might be able to adapt architecturally and build a maritime metropolis, but I imagine that would be ridiculously expensive and extremely strenuous for everybody involved.

And New York city consumes more resources then about anywhere else. It's a city of 8 million people.

So they are more responsible for their supposed plight then anyone.

[ManiaCCC]

oil companies have known about the issue for decades but refused to deal with it. glad we see actions against them

But what action they could do what wouldn't cut their profit hard?

[unbound]

If I were CEO of one of these oil companies, I would immediately cease and desist with all shipment and sales of any oil-based products to the greater NYC area and advise the CEO's of the other companies to do the same. After all, NYC clearly doesn't want to contribute to global warming, so they should be just fine without any access to gas or fuel, right?

That would be literally the dumbest thing they could do. Not only would that give further credence to the notion that corporations are, basically, evil; it also hurts their bottom line long-term as countries realize "F*ck! They could do that to us for any reason they want!", so there would be even more investment in alternative energy.

Keep in mind that solar power is now cheaper than oil in many countries already. In places like the US, both solar and oil are subsidized, but the best analysis removing the effects of subsidizing shows that solar is notably cheaper ($0.029 / kWh) than most forms of fossil fuel ($0.06 / kWh for coal; $0.05 / kWh most oil; and some small scale natural gas as low as $0.03 / kWh).

[ManiaCCC]

Don't bother it's a bullshit argument from the start. The earths climate has in fact been much hotter WAAAAAAAY back in the day before humans and they'll just say "Yeah but earth survived see!!" when nobody is arguing that the planet is going to blow up due to a few degree increase.

It is not about blowing up the planet, it is about creating global humanitarian crisis, if "few degree" increase will actually hit threshold (around 3 IIRC). It will be relatively slow process (in our lives) but it could easily lead to civil wars, anarchy and millions if not billions of dead people.

Not even mentioning how it will impact animals.

[Altrec]

Companies knowing about a problem and then intentionally misleading the public is a major reason why Tobacco ultimately got fucked by lawsuits to the tune of billions.

And guess what oil companies have done? Intentionally misled the public about Global Warming. It's pretty sad; you got lied to and now you're writing vindictive fantasies because you still believe the lies.

There is a big difference between those two. People don't need to smoke, but oil is rather important for society to function. Whether climate change is real or not, and whether the oils companies lied or not is irrelevant to the fact we still need oil.

[Beazy]

NYC would be one of the major casualties if sea levels rise rapidly. Sure they might be able to adapt architecturally and build a maritime metropolis, but I imagine that would be ridiculously expensive and extremely strenuous for everybody involved.

NYC has been doing this for decades. They use garbage and compact it into a land fill that is in the water, creating new land. Its pretty epic if you check it out, those yankees are resourceful as fuck.

[Deleted]

Companies knowing about a problem and then intentionally misleading the public is a major reason why Tobacco ultimately got fucked by lawsuits to the tune of billions.

And guess what oil companies have done? Intentionally misled the public about Global Warming. It's pretty sad; you got lied to and now you're writing vindictive fantasies because you still believe the lies.

Then ssue them for misleading the public because that'd make some sense. It's the publics responsability to not be fucking retards. You can't blame the oil companies for people letting this shit happen. The people use the oil. The people are the reason oil is being extracted to begin with. This is absurd. It's like suing sugar companies for you being fat. It makes no fucking sense.

[Dug]

It is not about blowing up the planet, it is about creating global humanitarian crisis, if "few degree" increase will actually hit threshold (around 3 IIRC). It will be relatively slow process (in our lives) but it could easily lead to civil wars, anarchy and millions if not billions of dead people.

Not even mentioning how it will impact animals.

Well yes this is in fact what most people are arguing but "skeptics" love to cherry pick editorialized bullshit from non scientists just cashing in for click bait for ad revenue. So instead of talking about the real affects climate change will bring we talk about shit like "we're literally all going to die says *random tabloid*"

[Hellrime]

I assume the brainless idiots in NYC will turn towards anyone who owns a vehicle next, right? I love how little progressives truly understand about the world. Yes, oil and gas are a cause for global warming, everyone knows that. However, to sue the companies for a product that you willingly used is absolutely absurd. This is honestly on par with the crusade against guns, in that people think the manufacturer is responsible or the gun itself instead of the person doing the shooting. Take some responsibility for your actions.

[rda]

Keep in mind that solar power is now cheaper than oil in many countries already.

A solar plant needs a similarly sized traditional plant as a backup. The backup plant also has to be running not much less hotter than the working solar plant to avoid prolonged outages when it will actually come to backup. The savings of emissions from all these cool-sounding energy sources like solar and wind only exist in material amounts if you discount those backup plants, if you count the backup plants in, the savings are pretty abysmal.

The best current bet that reduces emissions is nuclear.

(I realize the above is very schematic, but I don't have the time for several pages of text, this is a summary.)

[Lokryn]

I still wonder to this day how the fuck people go through the mental gymnastics when basically everyone agrees CO2 (and others) are green house gasses, humans emit a fuck ton through energy production and use and our agricultural practices. Common sense would say most of that is probably excess when added to the natural cycle and yet they still deny they have any influence. I guess dinosaurs were flying around in private jets and burning hella coal back in the day too

Most people don't give a shit about climate change. They are much more concerned about their immediate needs (like family, jobs, etc.). Until climate change comes along and slaps them in the face, it will continue to be this way unfortunately.

[matt4pack]

Most people don't give a shit about climate change. They are much more concerned about their immediate needs (like family, jobs, etc.). Until climate change comes along and slaps them in the face, it will continue to be this way unfortunately.

Almost no one really gives a damn about climate change beyond virtue signaling unless they actually live in something like an earthship home, grow their own food, and don't travel.