Legion is over... What to kill, what to keep?

[TheVaryag]

This week's patch effectively concludes Legion which, for me, was a pretty solid expansion. It had some really good bits, and some really disappointing bits, but it was much closer to Wrath and Mists than it was Cataclysm and Warlords.

But here's the question:

If there was one thing you wanted to keep for Battle for Azeroth, and one thing you wanted to kill, which would they be?

For me, it'd be:

Keep: World Quests.

I think these reinvigorated the world, and provided some steady content for more casual players with an aspect of progression throughout. It needs tweaked and developed, but I think it's really strong.

Kill: Mission Tables.

Honestly, it needs to go. It's had its time, it adds nothing of value to the game whatsoever (save as a poor gating mechanism), and is in fact an annoying design crutch that needs to be rubbed out. You think we want it, but we don't.

Over to you!

So hard to choose what not to keep... among the victims being Mythic Keystones, World Quests, bad lore, short patch cycle... If forced to choose I suppose It has to be

Kill World Quests - feels like a lazier, more efortless version of any normal quest blizzard makes to then make Into a constantly repeatable quest, making every quest you do never have meaning, the rewards are meager, enough to keep you going like you're gambling but not really, although the feeling of wanting more Is there despite the small amount, the reward Itself Is another disasteour entirely. Daily Quests still feel superior and with the emissary system could be really good.

And

Keep Emissary system - with some tweaking It can work wonderfully with daily quests.

[Deleted]

Keep: M+
Delete: Mission tables

I dont get all the mission table hate...great rewards for no effort, can even do it from a phone app. People are crazy.

Because it's a boring facebook game which has no place in a video game? I haven't used it for a year, haven't even unlocked the missions from Argus, I'm well aware of all the extra AP, gold and even gear I miss out on, but I just can't stand that sorry excuse for content. If it was exactly like pet battles, meaning it had no power reward to it other than progressing to other missions, meaning no gold, no AP, no gear, I would have no problem with its existence in the game.

[Echocho]

Kill multiple difficulties, titanforging, random sockets & mission tables.
Keep everything else.

[Deleted]

Kill multiple difficulties, titanforging, random sockets & mission tables.
Keep everything else.

I'm curious, which difficulty would you keep?

[Crackleslap]

Keep: World Quests, better version of dailies, albeit very similar.

Kill in a fiery passion: Artifact power. That shit is beyond dumb. Super obnoxious having to find these shits in my bags taking up all the bag space and super tedious. Also kill artifact weapons in this form FOR GOOD. Also kill Legendaries.

Why the super fucking obnoxious achievement just to fly? I joined this expansion late (few weeks ago), everyone else is flying and im being ganked to oblivion because i can't fucking get away. T'is bullshit.

[Echocho]

I'm curious, which difficulty would you keep?

Maybe somewhere between normal and heroic, with optional hard modes for the prestigious.

For dungeons, just mythic and slap on the + system.

[Deleted]

Keep - all the secret goodies (Lucid Nightmare, Kosumoth, etc)
Kill - Not too sure how to word it, but the lack of continuity of zones for Legion. I enjoyed all the zones the first playthrough, but the fact there seemed to be no connecting tissue between them I didn't really like. I felt you could have literally removed any zone from the Broken Isles and the story wouldn't really be affected in the grand scheme of things (bar getting the item at the end of the zone).

[Clockwork Pinkie]

Keep: World quest
Kill: Rewards from World Quest. Basically, the idea of still getting rep after you're exalted is nice, but surely there's another idea that won't have me stuck in these zones for the rest of my WoW career trying to obtain the actual goodies from said bags. Add a token to the bag that'll let me buy the rewards that come from the bag (mainly the mount).

[Zka]

I agree to OP. WQs are great, mission tables are terrible. These things belong to facebook games.

[Deleted]

Keep:
- WQ and Mythic +

Redesign:
- Artifacts (similar system but without the AP farm and with actual choices instead of farm until all is unlocked)
- Profession items (craft more powerful items - on par with heroic raids, the system that was used for crafting legendaries but much more dynamic like every time you starting crafting an item it sends you to different dungeons / raids to gather some special crafting items and also have them drop in Mythic +, cause fuck running normal Arcway, Cos and NH over and over)
- Missions: Have a small pool of missions available (1 that rewards gold, 1 for an item etc.), can only send 1 at a time, takes longer to complete like 1 week, and requires the player to gather some stuff to prepare for sending the mission.
- Honor system and PVP

Remove:
- Legendaries, or at least if they really want to have legendaries have then Mists / WoD system.

[Pua]

... What about it is failed this expansion...?

It literally does exactly what they said it'd be doing. And "objectively bad design" doesn't ring true, seems highly subjective to me...

It's not subjective.

The mission table competes in the same space with other endgame reward vehicles, but is laughably out of sync with regard to the risk/reward ratio. It's much too lucrative given that it's entirely passive and requires no game play whatsoever on the part of the player. Blizzard also recognises this, given that Argus saw progression missions that rewarded... More missions. It's become the ultimate self-licking lollipop, and exists only to justify its own existence.

This is a purely objective assessment.

How is that type of bonus a bad thing?

It has a negative impact on the in-game economy, along with the other points mentioned above.

I have one thing to kill and that is the profession system as it is. Primary and secondary.

I do think they need to drastically review what they think professions should be doing. It's not just that they're laughably bloated, or that the fun has largely been taken out of them, it's that they wildly vary in value. Archaeology and first aid, for example, are practically useless nowadays while fishing and cooking can be lucrative. Even primary professions are out of whack given that tailoring and enchanting are effectively "free" from collection, while skinning is far easier to level than herbalism or mining.

They should really look at overhauling professions from the ground up. Whether they have a team capable of doing so is one question, while the reaction from a perversely change-averse community is the other.

[Golden Yak]

I liked pretty much all of Legion, I'm sorry to see artifacts and order halls go. About the only thing I'd do would be put a satisfying cap on artifact power and not simply make grinding gradually more unfeasible. I hope the fun parts of finding weapon appearances remain.

I'd certainly want them to keep World Quests, they were a good way to keep a zone relevant for a long time beyond its storyline completion. I'd also like to see something like the invasion events return.

[Aeula]

Kill: The leveling revamp

Keep: Mission tables (for the gold)

[Schmilblick]

Keep : World Quests
Kill : Garrison / Order halls / follower / mission table / bodyguards / Legendary system / Titan Forged

[Destinas]

Keep: Story & patch pacing (for the most part). Some patches, like the Broken Shore, were certainly awful, but others told a vivid and wide-reaching story that I enjoyed. I always had something to do, and something to look forward to.

Kill: Ridiculous RNG. RNG was tuned way too high for artifact appearances, pets, mounts, transmog, legendaries - everything. I didn't enjoy, say, going to do the Wailing Critters scenario, only to have a more significant chance to get nothing at the end. I didn't (and still don't) enjoy doing reps multiple times to get one mount from an emissary supply chest - I'm still missing stuff from Valarjar, Dreamweavers, Nightfallen, and Army of the Light. Legion's RNG actually made my morale hit rock bottom, instead of keeping me hopeful.

[Deleted]

This week's patch effectively concludes Legion which, for me, was a pretty solid expansion. It had some really good bits, and some really disappointing bits, but it was much closer to Wrath and Mists than it was Cataclysm and Warlords.

But here's the question:

If there was one thing you wanted to keep for Battle for Azeroth, and one thing you wanted to kill, which would they be?

For me, it'd be:

Keep: World Quests.

I think these reinvigorated the world, and provided some steady content for more casual players with an aspect of progression throughout. It needs tweaked and developed, but I think it's really strong.

Kill: Mission Tables.

Honestly, it needs to go. It's had its time, it adds nothing of value to the game whatsoever (save as a poor gating mechanism), and is in fact an annoying design crutch that needs to be rubbed out. You think we want it, but we don't.

Over to you!

Keep: M+
Kill: Legion type legendary system.

(Good try Blizz.)

[Deleted]

If I could wish for just one thing next expansion it would be Wintergrasp Mk2.

Half hour of pvp followed by a weekly raid with mostly strangers - loved it.

[KalaK]

Keep: WQ (they are a better iteration than daillys, i dont want to go back to the auto pilot of pandaria, pick these these these do that over and over again)
Kill: Super RNG (some rng is okay, i dont want a game full probabilistic, Maybe the pandaria upgrade could return to make daily dungeons relevant again)

[LiPiNo]

Keep: I would say World Quests, but since they're confirmed coming back, I'll go with the Obliterum forge. While I never really got any use out of it, a modification or two to a) make it easier/cheaper to upgrade items so it doesn't take a ton of dusted items to upgrade the main one to usefulness and b) allow the items to be upgradeable to a relevant ilvl (upgrading 10 times to 900 is useless when you can get a 910 item through questing in less time and without wasting a ton of materials). By making those changes, you can make crafting professions relevant again.

Kill: Requiring dungeon runs and PVP for professions. Maybe I could live with requiring a dungeon run or two for cauldrons, because those are raid items, so you should be used to grouping up. But why in the hell do I have to do an RBG (not even just a BG, but a rated one that requires me to be on a preconfigured team) to learn a new rank of a recipe? How is being good at killing other players equate to my being more proficient at making pants?

You need to know how much you can shit your pants when 3 warriors with healer in the back jump on your caster ass Then you know what is expected from these pants to handle = better recipies.
On serious note , i agree with professions - i cam back only 2-3 months ago and it just feels very wierd and obsolete to try and make new proffesions. The quests are wierd , and time/gold investments if you abadonded your main just feel too much for the benefit.

[Raelbo]

Ref the mission tables: Having huge benefits given to you for free isn't a reason to keep them. It's actually a reason to kill them, given that it's a problem with basic game design to deliver all reward for no risk. There's absolutely no game play in them, which makes them impossible to "enjoy" - they're merely used as a content gate or a loot dispenser.

They're a mini-game within the game. Their primary purpose is to give us the feeling that we have the backing of our class halls whom we command. Basically we're asking our subordinates to do stuff for us, and then they go away and do it.

I personally do enjoy it. It's a small diversion from the main game and is a form of progression in and of itself. Importantly, to a large extent, it doesn't require you to put a lot of effort into it if you don't enjoy it.

For this reason I am going to vehemently disagree with you that "They need to be gotten rid of". That seems unreasonable. By all means if you want to argue that maybe they to de-integrate them from the campaign a bit, that is understandable, but even then, I think that they're sufficiently unobtrusive that they don't really pose any real problem.

They need to be gotten rid of, and it seems they're being gotten rid of.

Hmm, not sure about that. I remember recently reading in a blue post somewhere that they're keen to keep the idea going, with some kind of mission table going forward.