I dont understand the pro rep grind arguments

[HuxNeva]

People are angry because content that is being touted as part of a NEW expansion, is being time-gated behind content from a prior expansion. It's really not as hard to understand as you people pretend to make it out to be.

If Blizzard is going to sell something as part of a new expansion and wants to fucking time-gate it, then they should time-gate it behind the new expansion content, not use it as a bludgeon to make people play content that is now for all intents and purposes over to pad their stupid wall street metrics.

The 'new' expansion isn't out yet. This is the pre-order access, so for now this is Legion content. Who knows what the requirements will be in 4 to 8 months time? Maybe you'll get 30K rep just by doing the small intro scenario, or maybe they'll drop all rep requirements at launch.

[Deleted]

So stating the obvious it seems the wow community is very conflicted, the title isnt very objective but whatever

First argument; «We’ve known for months». That assumption relies on that datamining is suposed to be 100% acurate all of the time. It also assumes that literally everyone checks mmo champion.

The acomplishment argument. So, in addition to having to pay 40 bucks, i have to spend countless hours grinding, forget that, i cant grind cause of timegates.. This means i probably have to buy more subscription. Lets say it takes 40 hours. Know what else took 40 hours to unlock? DARTH VADER AND LUKE SKYWALKER. Feeling that sense of pride and acomplishment PvE’ers? Ironic, since they probably are the same people that was against the credit grind in battlefront 2.

I worked hard for it, its unfair if its handed out free agument: i can buy a level boost, is that unfair aswell?

«You pay for access, not to be given things a free. they might aswell sell mythic titanforged gear» argument. There is a difference between power and cosmetics. You dont become a better player or become stronger from looking different. Some might bring up racials, but come on, lightforged has the shittiest racials ingame. Maybe better than escape artist but thats about it. You can buy mounts too. Whine about that

Remove the timegate, not the repgrind. If youre so opposed, tell me why my arguments are so bad and wrong

It's content to do - It's really the same as grinding transmog gear etc., why must I be limited to killing LK once per week per character? Why make a timegate on those cosmetics?

[tangers58]

Some people just don't understand, that obsoleted time-gated rep grind - isn't "playing the game". Some people don't understand, that game isn't solid - it consists of several mini-games, suitable for different kinds of players. Some players like rep grinds, some, like me for example and many others, hate them. We like another content. Otherwise we wouldn't pay for this game and play it. And when one content starts to be gated behind another one - it's just pure greed nonsense. Players want subraces, but don't want to jump through arbitrary hoops to get them, as it happens with flying.

P.S. Now you can feel, how pro-flyers feel, when they're forced to do arbitrary nonsense, including worst things in a game, like time-gated rep grinds, to get feature, they like.

If you don't want to do the work, you are quite free to play the old races and shut the fuck up. kthnkbai

[WskyDK]

I don't like that allied races are locked behind rep, and a tiny ass quest.
I get that their intent is for us to play the game to unlock the races, but grinding to exalted even after you've completed the entire appropriate faction question isn't necessary. This is compounded by the fact that ~six months into BFA they're going to have to get rid of the legion rep requirements anyways.

Tl;Dr make the appropriate faction main storyline mandatory, and make the quest to actually unlock the allied races considerably longer than the almost non-existent they are now.

[Deleted]

I don't like that allied races are locked behind rep, and a tiny ass quest.
I get that their intent is for us to play the game to unlock the races, but grinding to exalted even after you've completed the entire appropriate faction question isn't necessary. This is compounded by the fact that ~six months into BFA they're going to have to get rid of the legion rep requirements anyways.

Tl;Dr make the appropriate faction main storyline mandatory, and make the quest to actually unlock the allied races considerably longer than the almost non-existent they are now.

Why? Exalted makes perfect sense from a lore/story point of view as well as from gameplay point of view.
Also it gives new players something to do - Allied races are 100% cosmetic, it's hardly different than farming old content.

[Witchblade77]

Thankfully addressed, in that all WQs for elite rares give Argussian Reach rep now, as well as quests like the pristine argunite giving something like 1000 of each rep.



You already have to have a level 100 player to level a DH and 60 to level a DK for example. Those are gated classes.

every expansion comes with character boost nowadays. so they are gated by a few minutes it takes to decide which class to boost first.

I don't like that allied races are locked behind rep, and a tiny ass quest.
I get that their intent is for us to play the game to unlock the races, but grinding to exalted even after you've completed the entire appropriate faction question isn't necessary. This is compounded by the fact that ~six months into BFA they're going to have to get rid of the legion rep requirements anyways.

Tl;Dr make the appropriate faction main storyline mandatory, and make the quest to actually unlock the allied races considerably longer than the almost non-existent they are now.

I agree with this. completing storyline makes sense. rep grind? not so much. and yes i have all reps already at exalted/quests completed, this is off putting for someone who may be new or coming back after not playing for a while, drawn in by the advertisement only to be told, oh yeah... even though these races are part of the sales pitch, you cannot actualy acess them for a while. need to do some mindless time gated grinding first!

[Flarelaine]

Another fear I have: If they're willing to do this with Races... What happens when they decide to gate a Class behind a Reputation grind?

What is there to fear about it? Everyone will just have to decide whether they want it or not.

[iDielord]

The rep requirements for Allied Races are fine, they aren't even grinds. WoD's were grinds.

Speaking of which, any Draenor races that require reputation to unlock... I have the rep at exalted already, but THOSE are the ones I think shouldn't have reputation requirements. Those reputations were disgusting.

Oh, no mate. Doesn't work like that. There is full thread of people saying that you need to play to unlock this races YOU'RE PAYING FOR TO ACCESS.
And you know, i've played WoD for full length, and i have all WoD reps at exalted. So if its ok for people to say, that i shoud somehow grind Legion content, people shoud grind Draenor rep too, seems completely fair to me.

I really, really don't understand how there is full thread of people saying that grinding PREVIOUS expansion content is ok to access expansion content you've just payed for. They never did that. So i'm not in a mood to play WoW right now, but i definetly want to play BfA, but somehow i will be locked out from content i will be PAYING for. As a player that raids mythic when i'm actively playing, i hope the next expansion content will be locked behind killing the last Mythic boss of previous expansion, will be so much fun.

[gobio]

You know you instantly lose the argument when you have to slide to stretch to the recent most outrageous example to trick people into siding with you.

"LETS SAY 40 hours to unlock a race" is a pure lie. That guy has no credibility.

[iDielord]

You know you instantly lose the argument when you have to slide to stretch to the recent most outrageous example to trick people into siding with you.

"LETS SAY 40 hours to unlock a race" is a pure lie. That guy has no credibility.

OPs argument is completely invalid, you're right here. BF2 outrage was not about Vader being locked behind grind, it was about a fact you can bypass that grind paying money in a full priced game.
But the point is still stands. There are TONS of people that skipped Legion or dropped it after some time(i'm one of them, didn't have time to raid in ToS since job changes in life, so somehow i have Nightfallen and Highmountain at exalted ofc, but i'm playing alliance, and i have no access to Void Elfs and new goats since i hadn't played in 7.3). I want to return at BfA release, but i can't access a feature that was announced as BfA feature(no, its not Legion content as people here say, its EARLY ACCESS to an Expansion feature, you can read that right at pre-order page). If it's patch content, then it shoudn't be announced as BfA feature, and require you to pre-order. I will still subscribe like a month or 2 prior to expansion, if no changes will be announced, to get rep, but i won't enjoy this shity thing at all.

[Deleted]

And you know, i've played WoD for full length, and i have all WoD reps at exalted. So if its ok for people to say, that i shoud somehow grind Legion content, people shoud grind Draenor rep too, seems completely fair to me.

All four of the Legion reps can be done in a week with a variety of playstyles. For the WoD reps you have to kill 1.000.000 level 100 mobs.
Not quite the same.

[kary]

All four of the Legion reps can be done in a week with a variety of playstyles. For the WoD reps you have to kill 1.000.000 level 100 mobs.
Not quite the same.

2/3 of the tanaan jungle reps are quest reps. saberstalker rep was a grind (to revered) with a lot of incentivized things.
try again tho

none of the "grinds" had anything behind them other than mounts and tabards

[Deleted]

2/3 of the tanaan jungle reps are quest reps.

I meant the non Tanaan ones.
Try again tho

[Blamblam41]

I don't understand complaining about something I don't understand.

But hey, Blizzard decided to make it this way, and I accept it. If I choose not to accept it, I have the free will to cancel my subscription and play something else.

Ahh yes, the "I'll accept it because if I don't I won't get the proper dosage of dopamine" excuse.

Please, go on and on about your free will though, I'm waiting.

[kary]

I meant the non Tanaan ones.
Try again tho

I like how you managed to ignore 90% of the post to attempt to sing your fucking retarded song. let me quote myself

2/3 of the tanaan jungle reps are quest reps. saberstalker rep was a grind (to revered) with a lot of incentivized things.
try again tho

none of the "grinds" had anything behind them other than mounts and tabards

and fwiw, they aren't even comparable because reps in WoD were intended to be optional, and had no effect. Legion reps were designed to be integral to the experience.

[LanToaster]

If you have 10 characters, 1 token WQ can give you 5000 rep in 1 day....

Thats the only valuable thing I´ve read about the Rep Grind discussion.

Because for many people, the problem is not that they have to "Do stuff", its that they cannot do it at their Pace. You get a handfull of WorldQuests for your Character, and thats it. Some people can only play on Weekends, so for them it takes them the same amount of weeks, it takes others of days.

But that advice is a good one. Blizzard should´ve included that in their Guide.

[kary]

Thats the only valuable thing I´ve read about the Rep Grind discussion.

Because for many people, the problem is not that they have to "Do stuff", its that they cannot do it at their Pace. You get a handfull of WorldQuests for your Character, and thats it. Some people can only play on Weekends, so for them it takes them the same amount of weeks, it takes others of days.

But that advice is a good one. Blizzard should´ve included that in their Guide.

It's less "blizzard punishing people who want to do things at their pace" and more "we don't want people to die grinding" and "rewarding people who have been playing"

There are gear catchups for cyclical players. You can play with your friends, you just don't get everything

[kyoloco]

ugh i skipped argus entirely because of no flying

im going to go thru depression just to unlock the alliance allied races...

[Deleted]

And I don't get why you complain, if you don't even play the game.

Honestly, this time I am 100% on the side of Blizzard. First, the "grind" is mostly done when you complete the storyline while questing. With the extended Storyline in Suramar, you get the reputation done and even get a mount. Argus storyline is even for 2 factions. And you are showered with reputation there. The weekly gating on all storylines is also removed by now, so you can just get through them, and not forced to wait a WEEK like people who have actually been playing, and who did not have as many reputation catch-up things implemented as you have now. Honestly, complaining in this case is disgusting. You already have it easier.

Of course, if you don't do anything except playing WoW, then you will probably fall into a hole where you have nothing to do and cannot complete your goal. Guess what - this is the game since forever, except in cases where you got extremely lucky with a rare drop.

We have half a year before the next expansion launches. What do you expect to do, get your allied race character to 110 in a day and then unsub again? Why do you even want to play then?

- - - Updated - - -

I'm conflicted, but the main thing I don't understand is why you must pay $50 to gain access to quite a few of the allied races which were developed well before BfA was even close to release. Or for example, how a few of them are clearly just reskins with just minor model changes. I'm not against paying $50 to bypass the rep grinds and gain access to them immediately - but paying to unlock things you helped fund through the start of legion and before? It's not, it feels rather bad.

I mean seriously, why do people have to pay $50 to play as Higmountain or Lightforged Draenei? Or Dark Iron Dwarves? I understand paying for legion and getting access to these races -- or not at all once BfA is the only option available, but.. Yeah. They're reskins with some minor tweaks with racials, shouldn't those ones be free compared to Nightborne and Zandalari which are worked on? Granted, Nightborne were half assed and do have issues.

I paid for early access to allied races, for which I had all requirements done on at least 1 character (reputations even on a multitude), and an extra price to get a pet and cool mounts. I knew for weeks, what the requirements have been, and that I would only pay this money if I am 100% sure that I can play these new races when I buy the next expansion. I made sure that my alliance alt did the required Argus reputation grind, though it seems that this has not even been necessary.

I have a 60+ hours work week with commuting, spend time with friends and family, go to the movies almost every week, and have chores to do. I cannot say that getting the requirements on my Alliance alt was time-consuming. Not at all. Run your emissaries, do the questline, and do OH missions with tokens. Okay, I had a bunch of characters who could funnel some extra tokens to the new alt, but on the other hand, I only managed to get the lightforged armour perk on Argus, and not much more for the storyline. My main focus lies currently on the completing of the mage tower challenges, with 2 remaining. Still, I was safe after some weeks. This is not the end of the world.

[Wriz]

And I don't get why you complain, if you don't even play the game.

Honestly, this time I am 100% on the side of Blizzard. First, the "grind" is mostly done when you complete the storyline while questing. With the extended Storyline in Suramar, you get the reputation done and even get a mount. Argus storyline is even for 2 factions. And you are showered with reputation there. The weekly gating on all storylines is also removed by now, so you can just get through them, and not forced to wait a WEEK like people who have actually been playing, and who did not have as many reputation catch-up things implemented as you have now. Honestly, complaining in this case is disgusting. You already have it easier.

Of course, if you don't do anything except playing WoW, then you will probably fall into a hole where you have nothing to do and cannot complete your goal. Guess what - this is the game since forever, except in cases where you got extremely lucky with a rare drop.

We have half a year before the next expansion launches. What do you expect to do, get your allied race character to 110 in a day and then unsub again? Why do you even want to play then?

The extended storyline in Suramar puts you just over revered, nowhere near exalted.

Secondly, the issue for most is the timegating. The storylines in Argus don't even push you past honored I think (don't quote me on this) and from then on you can only wait until World Quests and Order Hall missions spawn. I'm sitting here with 20000/21000 and I probably have to wait for 2 more days for enough World Quests to spawn, or I might get a lucky RNG Order Hall mission to spawn (which usually take about a day to complete anyway). I don't really care as I'm really close to it now anyway, but I can only imagine how it must feel for people who are just past revered with no more storyline to play. Having to wait weeks for things to spawn just to enable you to get some reputation is silly.

Yes the reputation grind is REALLY easy, but it is impossible to do quickly due to the stupid timegating. At least give us a way to grind it.