Where's the hype before killing Villains?

[Deleted]

And having 1-5% of the population ever see the bosses is somehow superior? We wouldn't have raids without LFR, cause Blizz flat out said that in classic/BC numbers they weren't worth making for the cost to make vs the participation.

Do normal or HC. Lfr is just bad

[cparle87]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/content...ine-Blue-Posts

Ion said it during an interview with him. He's the except if you don't wanna check the link.

"LFR justifies the creation of more raid content when millions of players are able to see content. Only a few thousand people actually saw Kel'thuzad, but millions saw Deathwing. The reason Mists of Pandaria is starting with 18 bosses and adding larger raid tiers than we have had previously is because many players are going to see the raids through LFR."

So yeah. Without LFR starting in MoP we would've had smaller raids, likely fewer raids. For all the raging and whining that people do against LFR, without it raiding today would not be as good as it is.

It's simple business strategy. If something isn't proving itself to be worth its cost to make, it'll be scaled back until it is.

[Deianeira]

Sunwell mediocre

Said no one ever

Also the intro villa. For BFA is already pretty much Prophet Zul whos been around between 4.1 and throne of thunder

I think Sunwells ending and not just the ending of the fight but all through the fight was perhaps one of the best moments in WoW .

[Otimus]

Well when you can kill them in LFR it kinda makes all threat seem less scary.

With good writing and gameplay, you could build up an open world solo questing enemy to be an epic and memorable encounter.

Blizzard's problem is they seem incapable of creating enjoyable gameplay without raid restrictions enforcing group based difficulty. Like, they seem incapable of making the game difficult or interesting in any other fashion. ....and they don't seem to be able to write epic new content.

Even if you never fought him, the story behind the LK was epic and interesting. Even if you go back and one shot him, it's STILL epic and interesting. Difficulty and ease of accessibility really has nothing to do with it.

[Eazy]

I know it obviously better then you and you know what? I am so much better then you I dont have to make qq threads that belong into your blog, not here because all you wanna do is bitch and show that you have no clue about lore (or give a fuck right cause its better to complain that way?).

Of course darling. Whatever makes you sleep better at night.

Sunwell mediocre

Said no one ever

I'm sorry but you misunderstood me, I meant his presence in TOS compared to the one he had in Sunwell(which was superb actually).

[cparle87]

Do normal or HC. Lfr is just bad

Classic/BC didn't have normal or heroic either. You had one locked size and one locked difficulty, and if you weren't good enough you didn't get to see the content. Check my post in reply to Sencha. LFR is responsible for us having the raids we do have these days.

[Deleted]

Classic/BC didn't have normal or heroic either. You had one locked size and one locked difficulty, and if you weren't good enough you didn't get to see the content. Check my post in reply to Sencha. LFR is responsible for us having the raids we do have these days.

Wotlk didn't have LFR either and is also consider the best (or second best) expansion.

[ddengster]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/content...ine-Blue-Posts

Ion said it during an interview with him. He's the except if you don't wanna check the link.

"LFR justifies the creation of more raid content when millions of players are able to see content. Only a few thousand people actually saw Kel'thuzad, but millions saw Deathwing. The reason Mists of Pandaria is starting with 18 bosses and adding larger raid tiers than we have had previously is because many players are going to see the raids through LFR."

So yeah. Without LFR starting in MoP we would've had smaller raids, likely fewer raids. For all the raging and whining that people do against LFR, without it raiding today would not be as good as it is.

It's simple business strategy. If something isn't proving itself to be worth its cost to make, it'll be scaled back until it is.

Simple, but not exactly long term I'd say. They could always shove a mini-scenario or even some text into the game and make the payoff come within several days, but I think the way they do it really doesn't build up the hype. They fail to make you REALLY HATE the guy or make the player take them seriously. These potential villains often receive the goofy treatment at some point which wrecks their credibility. Blizzard will eventually run out expansion main villains if it continues this way.

Examples for good build-up (within their self-contained expansions):
Deathwing - The cataclysm stuff was good, wish he did more within the storyline.

Examples for Bad build-up:
Arthas - Endless mocking of the player. If he actually did do stuff to the things the player cares about..
Kil-jaeden
Sageras

[cparle87]

Wotlk didn't have LFR either and is also consider the best (or second best) expansion.

Yeah, but it was the xpac that let you choose your size and later your difficulty so more people could see the raid. Before then it was one difficulty or nothing. Many more people saw Arthas than saw Kil'jaeden or even Illidan, but LFR helped even more.

- - - Updated - - -

Simple, but not exactly long term I'd say. They could always shove a mini-scenario or even some text into the game and make the payoff come within several days, but I think the way they do it really doesn't build up the hype. They fail to make you REALLY HATE the guy or make the player take them seriously. These potential villains often receive the goofy treatment at some point which wrecks their credibility. Blizzard will eventually run out expansion main villains if it continues this way.

Examples for good build-up (within their self-contained expansions):
Deathwing - The cataclysm stuff was good, wish he did more within the storyline.

Examples for Bad build-up:
Arthas - Endless mocking of the player. If he actually did do stuff to the things the player cares about..
Kil-jaeden
Sageras

Deathwing showed up a lot of times. At the start of the Hyjal storyline he appears and you literally watch helplessly as he summons Ragnaros and scorched the lower half of Hyjal into a smoking ruin. In Uldum he appears when Schnottz tries to execute you. And there's of course his and Alexstrazsa's duel in Twilight Highlands. He also showed up in a few of the levelling zones, such as the introduction of the egg that would become Wrathion.

Kil'jaeden I have to agree. He should've had some kind of presence on the Broken Shore.

Sargeras, well. What can you do with a planet sized demonlord? How could we encounter him or face him in any meaningful way. The size-of-a-planet thing majorly, MAJORLY impacted how we could interact with him.

[Deleted]

Exactly this is Hall of Reflection 5 man dungeon is so unique for me is one of the best 5 man dungeons ever because it was something fresh and unique all you have to do is just RUN (with Gandalf voice from the first Lords of the Ring the Fellowship from the demon Balrog).

This is why I think it would have been a creative idea to create a raid encounter where the Antagonist actually win against us and defeat us once and for all and maybe some kind of second thought or remorse will prevent him from finally killing us or something like that.

Yeah I thought the Halls of Reflection dungeon was great. It was pretty tough, great lore, great music and we didn't actually beat the villain. I kinda expected us to lose in the Legion expansion. We'd have to recuperate and find a way of ridding our planet of the Legion. But nope, apparently the Burning Crusade was no worse than every other threat that has faced Azeroth

[TheFirstOnes]

I mean...

...There's Sargeras...

Though, he didn't die.

But, we also have Kil'jaeden, Garrosh, Archimonde, Gul'dan, Xavius, Helya, and such.

[anaxie]

Of course darling. Whatever makes you sleep better at night.



I'm sorry but you misunderstood me, I meant his presence in TOS compared to the one he had in Sunwell(which was superb actually).

Sunwell was more epicbut that has to do with the journey these days.

Kiljaeden camt be this imposing figure when any competent person can steamroll him in the first day or 2 because of difficulties being a thing instead of like back in the day.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

To me, this is the expansion I've been the most hyped towards the bosses of honestly. They did a great job setting up ABT with those periodic cut scenes etc.

[anaxie]

Simple, but not exactly long term I'd say. They could always shove a mini-scenario or even some text into the game and make the payoff come within several days, but I think the way they do it really doesn't build up the hype. They fail to make you REALLY HATE the guy or make the player take them seriously. These potential villains often receive the goofy treatment at some point which wrecks their credibility. Blizzard will eventually run out expansion main villains if it continues this way.

Examples for good build-up (within their self-contained expansions):
Deathwing - The cataclysm stuff was good, wish he did more within the storyline.

Examples for Bad build-up:
Arthas - Endless mocking of the player. If he actually did do stuff to the things the player cares about..
Kil-jaeden
Sageras

He did do more

It was just tied into the legendary staff storyline and tiny bit of daggers

- - - Updated - - -

Haha, true. That's what LK was all about .. When next we meet ...

There's no hype these days because blizzard fails to develop characters properly. Arthas had a fantastic story from WC3 and it's a big part of the reason he was so popular. Same thing with Illidan in BC. You barley saw him at all in Outland, yet he was badass and people looked up to fighting him.
And then there's the bringing them back .. what satisfaction can there be in killing the same guy 2 or 3 times. It will be the same if we got to fight Lich King again. First time was , oh awesome, afterwards it's gonna be oh, lich king again.

So to sum it, villains that people get hyped over are the ones with a great background and pretty much pre-wow since wow is pretty shitty in this area.

You say lich king again.....

BOLVAR IS NOT AND WILL NEVER BE. ARTHAS

[Deleted]

Wrath of The Lich King is voted as the best expansion(wrathbabies, dklegolas, nostalgia, yeah, yeah) - on this forum, across the YT/official forums etc.

I remember when on the Blizzcon(not sure which year) people were doing interviews about the most Epic Moment in WoW most of the people said - Killing Lich King.(I agree btw)

The Lich King story was well written(Wc3:RoC/TFT). We knew about his past, we knew his intentions, we saw him in the quests, we knew what he's capable of. Stepping into ICC was like a gift you open after waiting for a long time.

We had a little build-ups for Lei-Shen and Garrosh and they were nice written characters. Not as much as Arthas, but still better than most of the bosses we have right now.

What's this thread about? Well, I'm no longer feeling that hype towards bosses in the game.

Kil'jaeden? What was that? One of the strongest beings in the whole Azeroth and he wasn't even the last boss of the Legion Expansion(he should be). Hype for him was build up since Wc3:TFT(and then in TBC) - and he ended as a final boss of the second tier in the medicore raid in a average fight(in terms of mechanics and visually).
Argus? Who the hell is that guy? Should I feel accomplishement after killing that no-body?
(I get that he's strongest guy that we fought with, but Blizzard just pulled a rabbit out of a hat - he's just a titan fetus we knew nothing about - they can do that with each boss we're fighting - Well, here's a Bongomambo a titan fetus from the planet Nathreza, he is going to kill this dimension with one of his attacks if you don't stop him!
The fight was awesome anyway(visually and in terms of mechanics)).

I fear that they're going to do the same thing with Azshara... and then with N'zoth next.

What do you think about it?

Comparing the mindset towards the game we had 10 years ago(during WotLK), to now, 10 years later...

Expectations expectations...

[Hctaz]

Do you think those 25 raiders would be able to fight the entirety of ICC and Naxx, and AN, and the countless undead killed across Northrend? Do you think they'd be able to beat Sapphiron and Sindragosa and KT at once? Or the San'layn and Blood Queen and Saurfang Jr.? It took 25 of them to beat any of the champions he had in ICC and Naxx.

He lost far, far more than he gained by letting the heroes chip away at his forces one by one. Including an entire army of Vrykul that were certainly stronger than those champions.

I think that the Lich King's power boost would be enough to where each one of those 25 raiders could go one-on-one with every single boss they've defeated in a raid and win. I think that those 25 players could, indeed, take down those three at the exact same time at that point. They would individually be stronger than any one of the Lich King's previous minions. And you have to remember that KT was once just a mortal mage, no stronger than you or I. His powers after he became a Lich were astounding. I imagine every spell caster would have been converted into a Lich of greater power, and every melee would have become some version of a Death Knight with their own unique skills in place still.

Do we know for sure? Probably not, but the fact that this was the Lich King's entire plan (and he's quite intelligent) leads me to make a pretty fair assumption.


And on topic: I don't like when the end game bosses are pulled out of their ass during the last patch. Archimonde was sorta pulled out of nowhere, but at least he was a pre-established lore character. Guldan had been in the WoD story from the very beginning, so it wasn't strange to see him doing some stuff in the end raid. Archimonde is a pretty fair extension of this. Garrosh was built up all expansion, and his character was something we encountered much earlier on.

They should have had Sargeras as the end boss in the form of a ritual he was doing to take possession of Argus' titan body. We know from lore that Argus was more powerful than all of the other titans except for possibly Azeroth. Those two being so powerful was why Sargeras wanted to corrupt them instead of simply killing them like he did with other titan souls. It wouldn't have been a crazy absurd stretch to say that Sargeras cast aside his body and had been attempting a ritual to transfer his soul into Argus' body (remember that Gul'dan was trying to do this very thing by using Illidan's body as a host for Sargeras to come to Azeroth). We would get to him before the ritual was completed so that Sargeras would not have his full power. Fight could have continued EXACTLY as normal, and a significantly smaller proportion of people would have been upset at the asspull that is Argus. We would have fought a weakened Sargeras inside of Argus' body with a weakened Pantheon helping us (as they already do), so we could have actually stood a chance against him.