Othmar Garithos VS Nathanos Brightcaller

[Aquinan]

Inb4 Garithos returning in BfA.

He's dead isnt he?

[Syegfryed]

You are assuming this about his class, nothing else :^)

im not assuming

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Lord_Garithos_(Warcraft_III)

. The use of a paladin spell perhaps suggests the traditional D&D background for a dark knight of being a fallen paladin.

Still, your are not reading what I write.

and you are not writing what i said

You still went ahead, and mentioned him being a skilled fighter - even when I had said so myself, implying I hadn't thought of this. Again, read what I write.

Again im not saying that, i said he didn't archive the high rank just because of his father name

A paladin is a cleric who also have had training in combat. Since they cant specialize they are a jack of all trade between a cleric/priest and a warrior. Not saying they are necessarily weak, but they didn't spend as much time learning to fight as a warrior. Sure, he has Holy Light that 1) needs to be casted first, where he needs to concentrate 2) I highly doubt Nathanos would die from a single Holy Light spell. If he did, dealing with the scourge would had been no problem what so ever :^)

so you don't know very much about paladins, gotcha

I want you to take a good look at the first post I made in this thread. The fact he is on horse back, makes him less of a competent fighter, because its difficult to properly fight that way.

you also don't know how mounted combat work

If you can't read what has been written, I will just ignore you, because it will be a waste of my time

sure, i also will ignore you, because to much bias, not gonna waste my time too

[Deleted]

Paladins don't have an edge in general against mightier undead. The Forsaken deliberately created Lightslayers to counter, assassinate and kill Scarlet Crusdae paladins and crusaders. And these Lightslayers were damn good and effective at it. They were also Undead. If Nathanos has these abilities, he probably knows anything he needs to know to negate Garithos' Light abilities or has a way to work around them.

[Syegfryed]

He uses shadow magic to empower his attacks, can cause magical fear in others, has access to poison arrows, and of course is an expert shot and not to bad in melee either.

How is that stuff not effective against Paladins? Maybe not as much as with other classes yes, the poison at least. But Nathanos is a proven, skilled, expert combatant.

Garithos is a guy using his dads name. I do not doubt he was likely skilled, but from what we have available regarding him? He's at most an above average knight.

shadow/death magic are not good against Paladins, not even poison, as far i remember paladins can heal and cure all those diseases and poisons, Paladin is a OP class with not much weakness

And again you can't archieve the leadership of the alliance just by dad's name, when her father name was not so important like others.

[Deleted]

im not assuming

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Lord_Garithos_(Warcraft_III)







and you are not writing what i said





Again im not saying that, i said he didn't archive the high rank just because of his father name






so you don't know very much about paladins, gotcha


you also don't know how mounted combat work



sure, i also will ignore you, because to much bias, not gonna waste my time too

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_knight here you go buddy
and maybe you should do your research :^)
If you don't think nobility doesn't help you achieve ranks, you are an ignorant.

I agree Xendral

[Syegfryed]

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_knight here you go buddy
and maybe you should do your research :^)
If you don't think nobility doesn't help you achieve ranks, you are an ignorant.

I agree Xendral

wowiki in 2018 omegaLUL

but do yourself a favor and read what you post, cause is right there

IconSmall Garithos Garithos - Held the dark knight class in The Frozen Throne. Strangely he has a generic mix of abilities from the Paladin, Tauren Chieftain, and Mountain King hero units. The use of a paladin spell perhaps suggests the traditional D&D background for a dark knight of being a fallen paladin.

[Deleted]

wowiki in 2018 omegaLUL

but do yourself a favor and read what you post, cause is right there

Yeah, why not? You just used it yourself to quote moron~ :^)
It's suggested, nothing more. The warcraft universe and the D&D universe are two seperate things. In the exact same article. it even says it might just be a unique title to Garithos, but you left that out obviously, you want your babe, Garithos, to win that much? :^)

[Syegfryed]

Yeah, why not? You just used it yourself to quote moron~ :^)
It's suggested, nothing more. The warcraft universe and the D&D universe are two seperate things. In the exact same article. it even says it might just be a unique title to Garithos, but you left that out obviously, you want your babe, Garithos, to win that much? :^)

you want to ignore he use paladin skills thats ok, you can stick with your headcanon

[Toppy]

shadow/death magic are not good against Paladins, not even poison, as far i remember paladins can heal and cure all those diseases and poisons, Paladin is a OP class with not much weakness

And again you can't archieve the leadership of the alliance just by dad's name, when her father name was not so important like others.

I suppose if you're talking about a bubble where the paladin just instantly counters anything coming their way if its undead based.

But Lordaeron falling in the first place counters this. The first half of the undead campaign counters this. Paladins have a SLIGHT edge against undead. If it was this big major thing then we'd have examples of it, but we dont. The only thing coming close was the Ashbringer.

[Syegfryed]

I suppose if you're talking about a bubble where the paladin just instantly counters anything coming their way if its undead based.

But Lordaeron falling in the first place counters this. The first half of the undead campaign counters this. Paladins have a SLIGHT edge against undead. If it was this big major thing then we'd have examples of it, but we dont. The only thing coming close was the Ashbringer.

not bubble, its more about healing and "purging" diseases and poisons, it was a common thing.

if i remember one of the skills of paladins in war 3 was exactly the bubble, so yeah was a thing, but Garithos avatar alone could be enough

I believe paladins have big edge against undead, not slight, at least in the game mechanics on the campaign, the horde in the second war only get some chance with the Death knights against the first paladins

And again, we are talking about a open directly fight, or is what i assume about this battle, there is no ambush, surprise attacks or other things Nathanos could use as advantage.

[Deleted]

I suppose if you're talking about a bubble where the paladin just instantly counters anything coming their way if its undead based.

But Lordaeron falling in the first place counters this. The first half of the undead campaign counters this. Paladins have a SLIGHT edge against undead. If it was this big major thing then we'd have examples of it, but we dont. The only thing coming close was the Ashbringer.

You can't argue with him he is stubborn

[Highwhale]

I suppose if you're talking about a bubble where the paladin just instantly counters anything coming their way if its undead based.

But Lordaeron falling in the first place counters this. The first half of the undead campaign counters this. Paladins have a SLIGHT edge against undead. If it was this big major thing then we'd have examples of it, but we dont. The only thing coming close was the Ashbringer.

Do you realize that Scourge ruined Lordaeron only because Arthas killed his father and put kingdom in chaos?

Do you realize the most painful and damaging thing for undead is Light? The same thing paladins wield as weapon?

[Syegfryed]

Do you realize that Scourge ruined Lordaeron only because Arthas killed his father and put kingdom in chaos?

And because Arthas himself killed almost all paladins at that time

[Highwhale]

And because Arthas himself killed almost all paladins at that time

Yep. After that kingdom and its people were leaderless and in chaos.

[omeomorfismo]

how not? just being paladin show he is actually strong, but a "dark paladin" show he is something more, like the heroic class in the RPgs and its not easy to archive



And the area should be all lordaeron... we can even extend to other fallen human nations, you can't jut grind your way to the position of leader of the alliance just by father influence an not by his abilities


and i didn't said you said he was a weak fighter, i said he didn't archive the title if he was not high skilled.



you didn't took the information of how Garithos was basically a paladin, and how undeads are obvious weak against holy magic.

Both skilled guys, but Garithos have advantages who work especially against undeads like Nathanos, and we are talking about an open directly combat, who warriors with magic have advantages, in other situations Nathanos would obviously win, with an arrow in Garithos mouth

lol, by this way garithos is weak to weapons (or at least, a lot weaker than undead, by miles), nathanos is a fucking skilled guy with his weapons, both ranged and melee. nathanos win.

[Syegfryed]

lol, by this way garithos is weak to weapons (or at least, a lot weaker than undead, by miles), nathanos is a fucking skilled guy with his weapons, both ranged and melee. nathanos win.

How Garithos is weak to weapons, what is the logic behind this? when he is wearing a full bulky heavy armor and a massive shield with a 2H axe?

Garithos is skilled in melee combat, also is a paladin with holy magic, in an open close fight Garithos would win

[Notshauna]

shadow/death magic are not good against Paladins, not even poison, as far i remember paladins can heal and cure all those diseases and poisons, Paladin is a OP class with not much weakness

And again you can't archieve the leadership of the alliance just by dad's name, when her father name was not so important like others.

I don't really see any evidence that Garithos was by any means capable of these feats that you claim. He was successfully mind controlled by Detheroc (which is a form of shadow magic), and has never actively been shown curing diseases or so forth. Just because you can list Paladins doing something doesn't mean Garithos can do it (even assuming he is a paladin, and the Holy Light spell wasn't just added for gameplay reasons).

[Syegfryed]

I don't really see any evidence that Garithos was by any means capable of these feats that you claim. He was successfully mind controlled by Detheroc (which is a form of shadow magic), and has never actively been shown curing diseases or so forth. Just because you can list Paladins doing something doesn't mean Garithos can do it (even assuming he is a paladin, and the Holy Light spell wasn't just added for gameplay reasons).

having paladin spels implies he is some kind of paladin, like his class suggest a Dark night, in the vibe of "bad paladins"

being controlled by a dreadlord don't implies weakness when anyone could be mind controlled like him.

We must stick in what we know about him, and the only information are presented in war3 and in one Q&A, we can't just ignore or say is was just a "game mechanic"

[Deleted]

The Light itself is strong against the Undead and Demons. That is correct. Doesn't mean that a Paladin wins against any Undead, just because he can use the Light. The Paladin has to be strong enough in his beliefs and he has to control enough Lightpower to overcome the power of the Undead himself.

Nathanos is no cannonfodder Undead, but a higher, mightier Undead. So he might have necrotic and shadow magic who can counter the Light abilities of the Paladin.

If the Paladins would be an unstoppable force against Undead and Demons, Lordaeron would have never fallen. The Argent Crusade would have never been stomped on byy the Legion on the Broken Shore. And Nathanos is Sylvanas' most powerful servant and champion. You would think, that he has abilities to at the utmost least make him a big challenge for someone like Garithos.

"But oh no, my headcannon is superior, Paladins can use the Light and thus, Undead stand no chance. I don't care about details and arguments." Pointless to discuss this under these circumstances. But of course the others don't know the Lore...

[Notshauna]

having paladin spels implies he is some kind of paladin, like his class suggest a Dark night, in the vibe of "bad paladins"

being controlled by a dreadlord don't implies weakness when anyone could be mind controlled like him.

We must stick in what we know about him, and the only information are presented in war3 and in one Q&A, we can't just ignore or say is was just a "game mechanic"

I'm not suggesting it be ignored, I'm saying that just because he can cast holy light doesn't mean he can cast other holy spells. The game deliberately avoided classifying him as a Paladin and gave him a mixture of abilities from various different classes. It's a totally different thing to suggest that he can cure disease and poison.

As for the mind control point it wasn't a matter of proving he's weak to void/shadow magic, rather it does imply that he isn't strong against it. Someone who is strong against shadow magic should probably be able to break their mind control.