Legit Tol barad is horrid

[Raelbo]

1. no, i wouldent because i would understand it has nothing to do with content, and has to do with the whole defender wins by default concept.

False. The defender still has to work to earn the win. If he becomes lazy or complacent then there is a decent chance he'll lose.

2. again the only reason i mention his level is because idk if you have been reading the thread, but even after mentioning he is 86 people still think i lost to him because i could not kill him... so i have to mention the level or else people just think i lost in a 1v1 battle got killed and now im mad.

Yes, I have read the entire, tiresome thread....it's pretty obvious why you're mad, because you can't accept that even though you did everything you could, you still didn't get your reward. Welcome to real life.

3. yes a winner and a loser is good, of corse you allways will. but a rigged system is not good. its like entering a duel then as soon as you enter the referee goes "OK RED WINS now duel!"

Yes, I get it, you needed your opponent to mess up if you wanted to win. That's how the fight works 1v1. It doesn't change the fact that you're acting like a sore loser.

4. correct there s other ways to get gear, dont get this point

No, that's not what I am talking about. I am saying that you entered a PvP event expecting it to be about who is better at PvP combat. However in this case the contest was never about combat prowess.

4 (secondly) uhh what? "easier to defend as 1v1" no you literally cannot lose if you are defending 1v1 ,it is not "easier" it is "garunteed"

False. I assure you that it is very easy for someone to lose as 1v1 while defending if you don't know what you're doing, play stupidly etc. To win you have to still pay attention, commit to stay to the end, not afk, and adapt to what your opponent does. Lastly, you have to hope that no one shows up to help your opponent because then you lose. Sure, if you do these things right and you luck out and no one else arrive, you should win. But the fact that it is contingent on these things defeats the notion that is "literally guaranteed"

5. so the attacker even if better in every single way to the defender is now REQUIRED to get another, well the defender is not required, do you see how utterly stupid and unfair that is? that the attacker is required to bring 2 people to win, wel lthe defender is only required to come alone to win.

What is utterly stupid is your incessant whining about this. What is unfair is your expectation that because you are higher level, have better equipment than someone else, that you should be able to dominate them in every single aspect of the game.

TB is fair because you'll have just as many opportunities to solo defend against and frustrate a solo attacker, regardless of the gear and/or pvp combat skill differential.

6. i use it because the whole concept of a "default winner" is stupid and just feels utter shit, for example what happens in current warsong gulch, you get a point and your winning yeah! 1/0 the other team ties the game near the end and win? but wtf they tied the game, how is that fair? oh wait it isnt and that sucks, it encourages just stupid plays and feels shitty for the team that lost cause they got the first score, but nope their fucked because of that.

I call that getting outplayed. Does it suck? Yup. But like I say, if you want to compete with other players, you need to learn how to accept defeat. EVEN IF THE GAME WAS NEVER WINNABLE.

There will be other opportunities. Things will balance themselves out. You'll get your rewards.

Move on. Right now you're only getting yourself worked up.

[FelPlague]

False. The defender still has to work to earn the win. If he becomes lazy or complacent then there is a decent chance he'll lose.



Yes, I have read the entire, tiresome thread....it's pretty obvious why you're mad, because you can't accept that even though you did everything you could, you still didn't get your reward. Welcome to real life.



Yes, I get it, you needed your opponent to mess up if you wanted to win. That's how the fight works 1v1. It doesn't change the fact that you're acting like a sore loser.



No, that's not what I am talking about. I am saying that you entered a PvP event expecting it to be about who is better at PvP combat. However in this case the contest was never about combat prowess.



False. I assure you that it is very easy for someone to lose as 1v1 while defending if you don't know what you're doing, play stupidly etc. To win you have to still pay attention, commit to stay to the end, not afk, and adapt to what your opponent does. Lastly, you have to hope that no one shows up to help your opponent because then you lose. Sure, if you do these things right and you luck out and no one else arrive, you should win. But the fact that it is contingent on these things defeats the notion that is "literally guaranteed"



What is utterly stupid is your incessant whining about this. What is unfair is your expectation that because you are higher level, have better equipment than someone else, that you should be able to dominate them in every single aspect of the game.

TB is fair because you'll have just as many opportunities to solo defend against and frustrate a solo attacker, regardless of the gear and/or pvp combat skill differential.




I call that getting outplayed. Does it suck? Yup. But like I say, if you want to compete with other players, you need to learn how to accept defeat. EVEN IF THE GAME WAS NEVER WINNABLE.

There will be other opportunities. Things will balance themselves out. You'll get your rewards.

Move on. Right now you're only getting yourself worked up.

1. well yes if he just fucking afks yeah, but literally all you need to do is rez and walk to a base you win
2. yeah because good game design is allways the real world right? It is good game design to make your charecter just RANDOMLY die for no good fucking reason well doing literally anything, good game design 101.
3. if someone else made this thread i would agree with them, even not losing because i just noticed how bullshit this is.
ive now won it 4 times in a row, yet im still here defending my point arnt i?
4. i would be fine with losing to the 86 if it was about ANY SORT OF SKILL
but that i lost simply because it was rigged from the start to force me to lose...
5.that is a stupid argument... i think i am about done i am tired and off work today so...
6.what is unfair is that the game decides from the start, it rigs the match, it decides" OK here is two players, horde defending, alliance attacking... Horde wins! Alright now fight!"
just because i can do it (and have now for 3 matches) does not mean i suddenly think it is fine and balanced...
LOL OUTPLAYED? HOW CAN I BE OUTPLAYED IF I CANT EVEN PLAY!? ok yeah on the ignore list.

Yeah tieing a red boxers hands and legs together, chaining him to the ground, then letting the other boxer win, and the red boxer got "outplayed"

[Deleted]

i mentioned that because the concept is just trash that even more skilled, geared, leveled, and experianced, you CANNOT WIN 1v1.
that is what my intention was.

That's the problem, if that is what you are saying then you ARE saying his level matters or rather you think it SHOULD matter when it does not.

It's a shame because the content was one of the better PVP areas in my opinion because of it. It didn't matter that I was crap at pvp, I could still contribute.

Making it so both factions can do the quests, or making it just flop back and forth so you do it each other hour... instead of going hours or days without your faction capturing it.

So you agreed with my second paragraph then. Stop talking about the player level, ignore anyone who asks about it, and it will go away, and then you can focus on the fact you feel with a lower attendance the zone doesn't work very well and requires changes to make it work.

Of course then you'll just have to contend with people telling you that the content is old and not worth what would be seen as a waste of resources just so someone could get access to old aesthetic items. But that is a different kettle of fish.

[FelPlague]

That's the problem, if that is what you are saying then you ARE saying his level matters or rather you think it SHOULD matter when it does not.

It's a shame because the content was one of the better PVP areas in my opinion because of it. It didn't matter that I was crap at pvp, I could still contribute.




So you agreed with my second paragraph then. Stop talking about the player level, ignore anyone who asks about it, and it will go away, and then you can focus on the fact you feel with a lower attendance the zone doesn't work very well and requires changes to make it work.

Of course then you'll just have to contend with people telling you that the content is old and not worth what would be seen as a waste of resources just so someone could get access to old aesthetic items. But that is a different kettle of fish.

I liked wintergrasp much better, and im still so sad they never remade it. hell the art of it and the "ariel pvp combat" on the wotlk box is what sold me on buyying my own account so i could play more then when my brother was at his friends.

and again i would love to not talk about his level but it is more of a point that your loss has nothing to do with skill, gear, or level.
and also to try and deter the "you got killed and now your mad, git gud" group, but even then people are still popping in "then just kill him, you win wtf git gud"


and also if not for them having gone back and change galakras, Soo bosses, icc bosses, then i would say "prob never happen" but they have done this for old raids, so why tol barad, and maybe wintergrasp well they are at it?


I am fine with a level 86 beating me, as long as i had a chance to fight back
but wit hthe current system it makes it rigged from the start, it is entering a boxxing match to hear "OK red, against blue, blue wins, now fight!"

[Dovashy]

You're absolutely right. Timers on each point should be adjusted so max level characters can cap them immediately. Anyone lower than max level should receive a stacking debuff that reduces their movement speed until they're unable to move, and should have random npc's that follow them around, mocking them for even trying to impede the majesty of such glorious high level characters. Each point would also have guards that mimic the person's item level and health, making anything short of a full raid group of lowbies to even think about trying to have any semblance of balance. All so you can get those shiny tokens!

Sarcasm aside, this conversation is just....wow. Though it's interesting just how adamant you are about there being a problem. Don't see you flipping this around though, as if it's really /that/ important it's worth noting that you only need to capture it ONCE. Just having ownership of the place will make it impossible for someone else to 1v1 it from ya until you're done with it/can't defend it because you're not playing. I highly doubt this lowly level character is on all the time, you're just looking for something to complain about.
If all else fails, you can always bribe someone with gold, or help them in other ways. Crazy thought, I know....but it's not that hard.

[Daedius]

OP... if you're desperate enough, and haven't spent your 110 boost, you can make a character on a realm that consistently has Tol Barad up for your faction and farm with it there, or alternatively make a group with that character [or anyone of that realm] parked in Tol Barad via premade group finder and have the char you're currently using to phase realm to that realm that has Tol Barad up.

[Teri]

At least it's not an RNG mount, you can get it over time 100% guaranteed. solo.


Tokens from hellfire towers are worse since they actually require others to cap them back.


Spirit shards from Terrokar are even a worse currency since CRZ broke them, and won't drop them at all anymore.

[FelPlague]

You're absolutely right. Timers on each point should be adjusted so max level characters can cap them immediately. Anyone lower than max level should receive a stacking debuff that reduces their movement speed until they're unable to move, and should have random npc's that follow them around, mocking them for even trying to impede the majesty of such glorious high level characters. Each point would also have guards that mimic the person's item level and health, making anything short of a full raid group of lowbies to even think about trying to have any semblance of balance. All so you can get those shiny tokens!

Sarcasm aside, this conversation is just....wow. Though it's interesting just how adamant you are about there being a problem. Don't see you flipping this around though, as if it's really /that/ important it's worth noting that you only need to capture it ONCE. Just having ownership of the place will make it impossible for someone else to 1v1 it from ya until you're done with it/can't defend it because you're not playing. I highly doubt this lowly level character is on all the time, you're just looking for something to complain about.
If all else fails, you can always bribe someone with gold, or help them in other ways. Crazy thought, I know....but it's not that hard.

skipping the first pargrapgh cause well
1. you need to capture it once, per day, per charecter.
2. as i have said in many posts and will say again, i want a system that either allows both to do the locked quests, or make it easier to capture so that it simply flips back and forth, alliance horde alliance horde alliance horde, so you can do your quests every other hour.
3. you only need to do the quests once per day so... i dont get what your talking about into "having opwnership will make it impossible" blah blah...
4. i complained because of the low level because for example the very next one had a max level 110 hunter, i still insta killed them, but they still defended, because as i have again pointed out many, many, many times, the level does not matter, the skill does not matter, could be a level 1, or a level 110, the BG in a 1v1 scenario, gives the defenders the win garunteed.

- - - Updated - - -

OP... if you're desperate enough, and haven't spent your 110 boost, you can make a character on a realm that consistently has Tol Barad up for your faction and farm with it there, or alternatively make a group with that character [or anyone of that realm] parked in Tol Barad via premade group finder and have the char you're currently using to phase realm to that realm that has Tol Barad up.

Sad thing is told barad seems cross realm so idk mate.

- - - Updated - - -

At least it's not an RNG mount, you can get it over time 100% guaranteed.

yes, that being 40 days if you never own tol barad, then another 35 days for the next mount, then another 40 days for the pet, then another 14 days for the weapon, another 14 days for the next weapon, another 8 days for the tabard, 8 days for the pet, then 10 days for the final pet.

[Teri]

yes, that being 40 days if you never own tol barad, then another 35 days for the next mount, then another 40 days for the pet, then another 14 days for the weapon, another 14 days for the next weapon, another 8 days for the tabard, 8 days for the pet, then 10 days for the final pet.

Still much better then many RNG drops out there.

Also you don't have to do it all on 1 character, split progress and buy the smaller stuff on alts.

[Pandragon]

Uhh no he is doubling my time.
i get 7 tokens a day, i need 200 for the mount
now if you control tol barad you get another 7, meaning if i can get tol barad i can half the days i need to reach the mount.
however because a level 86 mage is able to stop a level 110, i can only get 7.

Uhh no. You normally get 7 from the peninsula, then if you win you get another 7 from the prison. That is cutting your time in half. If he stops you from getting the prison dailies, you just get the normal 7. Doubling your time means he would have to take the 7 you normally get,. and cut those in half, which he can't do.

[RapBreon]

In normal circumstances a level 86 can never fight back, even if he's head-and-shoulders your superior. This is a very rare flipping of the script, quite refreshing to be honest. Additionally, you still do have room to solve the problem, you just can't brute force it. Few things I can think of;

1. Wait the mage out, once he's done you're free. Unless, he's targeting you specifically, but then that's just kinda hilarious on his part;

2. Ask for help from friends of even trade-chat; and

3. Failing that, PAY for help. I'm sure you can find 1 or two people to stand at a capture point for some gold.

All three options are easier for you to execute than Blizzard ever fixing a system 3 expansions old and essentially end with you demonstrating your 'superior experience and skill'. Minus, maybe them just making the mount easier to get in general.

[FelPlague]

Still much better then many RNG drops out there.

Also you don't have to do it all on 1 character, split progress and buy the smaller stuff on alts.

because of the rep requirment aswell
you need to buy atleast 2 things on a charecter (except the mounts)
so even then it is
40 days for one mount
35 days for other mount
14 days per weapon (can do 2 on 1 toon)
8 days for tabard, 8 days for pet(toy sorry), 10 days for pet (can be done on another toon)

meaning 4 toons, 40 days 1, 35 days 2, 28 days 3 (for 2 weapons) and 26 days 4.
that or you can cut that down by 66% if you do the daily tol barad quests.

[Danvash]

Maybe you need a different strategy if you're facing just one person in that BG. Get him on a 2 min res timer, then start capping. I guarantee you wouldn't be losing to a level 86 if you were following him around to stop him from recapping.

[Jujudrood]

TB was meant to be a group PVP event, not a solo one, so even though it's crappy, it's working as intended.
Now, that said, it's also several years old and essentially dead (aside from mount farmers such as yourself), so removing the 'ownership' thing wouldn't be awful either.
Just have it swap hands every 2-4 hours, whatever seems fair, then everyone can go do their dailies and be happy.

But, it's also not the end of the world because those items aren't going anywhere.
Sure, 7 a day is kinda sucky, but really, it takes like 10-15 minutes to do them (maybe more, maybe less, haven't farmed the place since 100), so you will get them eventually.
There's no prestige to be had or anything, and still it's on rails and guaranteed after X tokens (based on item you want) as opposed to, say, a 1% drop from an old raid.
So, overall, it's not THAT bad.

[FelPlague]

Maybe you need a different strategy if you're facing just one person in that BG. Get him on a 2 min res timer, then start capping. I guarantee you wouldn't be losing to a level 86 if you were following him around to stop him from recapping.

but then how do i cap to win? also the ghost rezzes much faster then 2 minutes...

- - - Updated - - -

Uhh no. You normally get 7 from the peninsula, then if you win you get another 7 from the prison. That is cutting your time in half. If he stops you from getting the prison dailies, you just get the normal 7. Doubling your time means he would have to take the 7 you normally get,. and cut those in half, which he can't do.

6 from the normal dailies

(the three is from the "win today" quest)

first time this demon hunter has ever done tol barad

so 6 from the normal dailies
12 from the tol barad winning dailies.
so not 5-13
but literally 66% more.

also every time you win 3 of the quest change so you can get another 3 commendations.

[svetlio]

because of the rep requirment aswell
you need to buy atleast 2 things on a charecter (except the mounts)
so even then it is
40 days for one mount
35 days for other mount
14 days per weapon (can do 2 on 1 toon)
8 days for tabard, 8 days for pet(toy sorry), 10 days for pet (can be done on another toon)

meaning 4 toons, 40 days 1, 35 days 2, 28 days 3 (for 2 weapons) and 26 days 4.
that or you can cut that down by 66% if you do the daily tol barad quests.

Next time dont skip expansions and your all fine

[FelPlague]

Next time dont skip expansions and your all fine

Yeah you are right man, im so sorry that i didnt play when it was current, urg im such a fucking idiot to not ave played during cata and done tol barad...

[Deleted]

so a level 110 getting beat in pvp by a single level 86 is good gameplay by your logic?

I think its pretty funny for an outsider to hear that
But if it was me...i would be extremely mad

[Dovashy]

It's faction based. If /your/ faction already controls it, guess what? That makes you the defender. If you're defending, then they can't take it from you without *gasp* outnumbering you! It's basic math. Two is more than one, ergo two should defeat one. You're complaining that you should automatically win because you're bigger and stronger than he is. Skill and strategy goes out the window for this sorta thing. It's old content, Blizzard is never going to make it worthwhile to do just because you want some mount you could've gotten years ago when it was current.

[ZaneBusby]