Officer Involved Shooting (again)

[RickJamesLich]

I could be wrong, but I am fairly certain that procedure is to insure that someone in that condition is not going to harm the population. Or just arm all the police with big butterfly nets and get them psych degrees so that they can capture and rehabilitate people on the spot. All for terrible pay and tough hours. Or, people could take personal responsibility for their actions. The scenario started with the suspect taking drugs ( as I understand it ). Whatever happened to him after that is caused by that first decision. Whether it be getting into a deadly altercation with police or walking in front of a train.

I'm mixed on this, between the drugs, attacking the cop, and taking the weapon, this guy is pretty much signing his own death warrant. Anyone would realize you're putting your life in grave danger after doing all of that.

At the same time, I feel at *that* very second they didn't need to shoot him. Like if he was going to try to escape into the building, I could understand shooting him in that scenario as he could take a hostage or just put some innocent person's life in danger. But at that very moment he was just slowly walking away, I think the cops could've waited a little longer before shooting. Or maybe just fire one shot here? I dunno, I know for the cops being put in this type of situation has to be awful and most people, even police, are not going to be thinking rationally after just getting attacked by a criminal who just assaulted someone else earlier.

[Dacien]

I could be wrong, but I am fairly certain that procedure is to insure that someone in that condition is not going to harm the population. Or just arm all the police with big butterfly nets and get them psych degrees so that they can capture and rehabilitate people on the spot. All for terrible pay and tough hours. Or, people could take personal responsibility for their actions. The scenario started with the suspect taking drugs ( as I understand it ). Whatever happened to him after that is caused by that first decision. Whether it be getting into a deadly altercation with police or walking in front of a train.

I'm not going to deny that this guy played a huge part in his death. His decision not to comply, and whatever other decisions he made that caused his behavior contributed to his death.

But the bottom line is that these officers were armed and were in control. I can't account for every possible permutation of events, civilians getting involved, actions taken by the suspect, any of that, but what I see is two armed cops aggressively engaging an unarmed suspect without additional backup, and when that went south, they shot him to death.

That simply can't be the best we can do.

[Dextroden]

If that's true, if he truly is crazed and erratic, maybe the best course would be to tread lightly. Approach the suspect with care and caution. Be professional and calculated. Call for backup. Contain him. You have the guns, he doesn't.

No they don't. Still being called murderers for even going through all non lethal moves. And since you can't shoot them, guess what you have to do to cuff/grab/taze/mace someone?

Move in close. Unless, again, you have the secrets to psionics locked up with you.

[Dacien]

No they don't. Still being called murderers for even going through all non lethal moves. And since you can't shoot them, guess what you have to do to cuff/grab/taze/mace someone?

Move in close. Unless, again, you have the secrets to psionics locked up with you.

They shouldn't be called murderers. That part of the video bothered me a lot. For everything I've said, and I know this will sound crazy, but I wholeheartedly support cops. The people they arrest and who are ultimately put in prison, people don't realize the kind of good service to all of us that cops out there are performing.

I just look at this video and wonder what we can do better.

[Dextroden]

They shouldn't be called murderers. That part of the video bothered me a lot. For everything I've said, and I know this will sound crazy, but I wholeheartedly support cops. The people they arrest and who are ultimately put in prison, people don't realize the kind of good service to all of us that cops out there are performing.

I just look at this video and wonder what we can do better.

I don't buy that. You've essentially said "I'm not calling it unjustified, but..." multiple times now and keep saying "What can we do better" to imply he did wrong.

When people are shown cops going through hoops NOT to shoot and then talk about cops shooting first (*cough*Heladys*cough*), you stop trusting people want an end to police brutality and just hate cops.

[Dacien]

I don't buy that. You've essentially said "I'm not calling it unjustified, but..." multiple times now and keep saying "What can we do better" to imply he did wrong.

I'm not going to call it unjustified because of all the aspects involved in this shooting. We can't see if the guy obtained the baton and lunged, we can't see what went down the moment of the shooting. I can't make that call.

What I can see is all the aggressive behavior by the officers that doesn't seem to be necessary. I see a lot of things that may need evaluation, things that we can maybe take a look at and ask, "How could this have been done better? How could we have done this in a way that wouldn't have resulted in a dead suspect?"

When people are shown cops going through hoops NOT to shoot and then talk about cops shooting first (*cough*Heladys*cough*), you stop trusting people want an end to police brutality and just hate cops.

I can't speak for anyone else, I just cannot accept that two armed officers can't manage, through backup or tactics, or a combination of both, to apprehend an unarmed man without killing him first. A man who at no time approached the officers.

[Dextroden]

I'm not going to call it unjustified because of all the aspects involved in this shooting. We can't see if the guy obtained the baton and lunged, we can't see what went down the moment of the shooting. I can't make that call.

What I can see is all the aggressive behavior by the officers that doesn't seem to be necessary. I see a lot of things that may need evaluation, things that we can maybe take a look at and ask, "How could this have been done better? How could we have done this in a way that wouldn't have resulted in a dead suspect?"



I can't speak for anyone else, I just cannot accept that two armed officers can't manage, through backup or tactics, or a combination of both, to apprehend an unarmed man without killing him first. A man who at no time approached the officers.

Probably because, once again, you have to walk into close proximity to do ANYTHING. INCLUDING TALKING TO THEM. And let's go down the list.

1. Multiple cops. Yeah, they're not being called brutal for going more than two on one. (Btw. Have you never lost a fight?)

2. Guy walks off and attacks someone else with the space they gave. Guess they're at fault for that now since they're supposed to prevent that.

3. Taken down without gun fire. It's still being called brutality because they used force to stop him. Because the same logic that makes every shooting a murder makes every contact brutality.

Cops are fucked, no matter what. And while I'd like things to improve, it's never going to at this rate. Not with every motherfucker who has an opinion on how to train cops but too cowardly to actually go to cops to provide their miracle methods or become the best cop in the universe they'd claim to be.

[Masark]

Too many in this thread think that 'freedom' means they don't have to be responsible for their actions. It's not so.

Many in this thread think that killing the mentally ill is a great idea.

http://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/...205121339.html

The scenario started with the suspect taking drugs ( as I understand it ).

Nope.

I'm mixed on this, between the drugs

You're already wrong before you even finish your first sentence.

[Tiwack]

Another idiot dead....I'm not surprised. When are people gonna learn... fucking hell.

Suicide by cop is a thing and sometimes that's not even the goal for mental people acting up off their meds...

[Tabrotar]

Many in this thread think that killing the mentally ill is a great idea.

http://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/...205121339.html



Nope.



You're already wrong before you even finish your first sentence.

So are the mentally ill now out of any jurisdication?

Because that´s what you´re saying: He was mentally ill so all of his behaviour is to excuse he didn´t do anything wrong he can´t help it...

[zhero]

I've worked in the nursing field with people high on shit & people who were just flat out crazy and combative. As a male, I was expected to help subdue them. I've been bit, hit, kicked, slapped, spit on, had things thrown at me, and scratched to the point I was bleeding.

could any of them have been desperate enough to steal a weapon from you to kill you to get away?

[Themius]

Its really hard to teach how to deal with the unpredictable

it has already been said but cops around the world deal with it... cops around the world also have significantly longer training periods.

[schwank05]

Race really isn’t relevant.

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That’s not how murder works.

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Yes, didn’t a man just get away with shooting a cop who shot at him first?

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Why would you think you need a father figure to tell you not to attack police?

Proven fact that kids Especially young men that grow up in a single parent home, and with femanazis pushing for single parenthood and saying men are the scum of the earth that black single motherhood has increased from very low in the percentages to over 70% now. Men without a Father figure are much more likely to grow up to be criminals and break the law. Men learn how to be men from their father, if you don't have one you learn from your "friends" and he never got sat down when he was growing up by his dad who told him how shit works. be respectful, obey the law, and be a good father. I man cannot learn this from his mother as much as people want to believe it's true, its not.

[Kuntantee]

Only American police handcuffs corpses.

[RickJamesLich]

You're already wrong before you even finish your first sentence.

How does being on drugs excuse assaulting police officers?

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Proven fact that kids Especially young men that grow up in a single parent home, and with femanazis pushing for single parenthood and saying men are the scum of the earth that black single motherhood has increased from very low in the percentages to over 70% now. Men without a Father figure are much more likely to grow up to be criminals and break the law. Men learn how to be men from their father, if you don't have one you learn from your "friends" and he never got sat down when he was growing up by his dad who told him how shit works. be respectful, obey the law, and be a good father. I man cannot learn this from his mother as much as people want to believe it's true, its not.

your full of crap for a few reasons. first off you say that single mother hood has increased and that causes an increase in crime, yet crime has been falling for years.



https://www.brennancenter.org/public...rends1990-2016

second off men have been growing up without fathers for thousands of years as the men go off to die in wars leavings there sons to be raised by there wife's. if not having a father caused men to become criminals who cant obey the law human society would have never gotten any where as men have been constantly been leaving there kids fatherless after wars.

[Unholyground]

Why does this always come up. Please do not shoot me in the leg. Upper right chest if you must, but not the leg. I'd like to live through the experience.

Terrible idea, harder to do, harder to train for, and way more that can be permanently damaged or result in death.

Well they should not have guns if they cannot shoot with pinpoint accuracy in every situation.

[Masark]

How does being on drugs excuse assaulting police officers?

And there you go again.

Read the link in my previous reply. He was not on drugs.

[Pooti]

Ok so he was not on drugs. His family with all the time to protest and get attention after his unfortunate death should have been doing more while he was alive. Did the police just show up or were they called in to deal with him? If you know someone is mentally ill calling the police to help is not the answer. The police are trained to deal with criminals.

[prwraith]

Well they should not have guns if they cannot shoot with pinpoint accuracy in every situation.

I'm sorry what? Do you know how guns and body mechanics work? Let alone everything that plays into perfect accuracy