"Trials deserve loot too"

[FelPlague]

That's what I meant. You don't know how it is to play in a mythic progress guild and are for PL in every guild. I am also for PL, if I am like you only playing heroic I wouldn't even active two braincells about loot because heroic and normal is a face roll. But let people choose to play ML if they want to.

So many people saying the "progressed" and then at the end it's heroic progress.

Just because i dont have recent mythic kills doesent mean i dont know how to play in a mythic group... I was a big member in a full mythic group, just was in the second team as i ddint wish to go "full hardcore" i very much knew how many trials we had to go through and how we refused them gear for weeks.

Also to be honest minus 6 from everything i am not going to claim i got archimonde or mannaroth before legion when i didnt (i took a break) however my guild did and i was there to support them and help them with the process.

[Jtbrig7390]

But that's the whole joke. You didn't even step a foot in mythic and you want PL for all? Do you understand why people who are actually progressing mythic don't want PL?

Would you like look at the image one more time and take back this statement or would you rather I point out the thing you missed.

[FelPlague]

Like I say, x-realm mythic has been in since March 20th. Doing mythic now is a challenge. Coming back next expansion, is no challenge. Why even raid at all if all you do is RP? Just do LFR if you want to see the raid content. Why faceroll heroic/normal week in week out. What an utter waste of time.

6-9 hours is not massive at all. The fact that you pug says it all. For which I have no problem having the PL system in place, however it still holds no argument that an organised guild raid still can not have that choice, and if players do not like it, they can leave, just as much as if a pug used ML, people would leave that.

Anyway, thank you FelPlague. Your posts stand out as the epitome of those screaming for the removal of ML, the people who have little to no involvement in a guild, where they only join pugs for their own progression, and own loot. I am happy my guild where a group of 15-25 friends get together a few times a week to slay shit for the CHALLENGE, and for mythic, where we distribute loot to those who both need it most and would benefit the guild most, operating a level where we can see beyond the selfish mindset of I NEED THAT ITEM and IM LEAVING IF WE WIPE AGAIN.

I raid now because heroic is a challenge, it is not as much of a challenge as mythic, but it still is, and i do it because for example, heroic aotc mount, and did it a total of 5 more times to help out friends who needed a "carry" to get them in "hey i have it, im above the min ilvl, this guys with me, he doesent have it, but i know he can do it, and hes just abit under the min ilvl...."

also i dont agree with the removal of master looter as a whole, im sure blizzard could do ALOT better, i am just glad that the days of shitty "trial" manipulation and loot councils whoring loot is over.
Hell i was the benefit of a whoring loot council back in wotlk, and it allmost caused a divorce because of it, a story i will tell only on request.

[Scroff]

Personal loot is going to be a mess for my guild. We'll have probably 3-5 people asking if anyone needs item X, and then we'll have an average of 3-5 people per item responding in raid chat, and one person finding out that they missed out five minutes later. It's going to take like 10 minutes to sort out items. >_<

Everyone who has an item they want to be redistributed trades it to your ML who then assigns it as before - will be slower, but not outrageously so

[Deleted]

Jtbrig isn't pretending

[Stockers]

I raid now because heroic is a challenge, it is not as much of a challenge as mythic, but it still is, and i do it because for example, heroic aotc mount, and did it a total of 5 more times to help out friends who needed a "carry" to get them in "hey i have it, im above the min ilvl, this guys with me, he doesent have it, but i know he can do it, and hes just abit under the min ilvl...."

also i dont agree with the removal of master looter as a whole, im sure blizzard could do ALOT better, i am just glad that the days of shitty "trial" manipulation and loot councils whoring loot is over.
Hell i was the benefit of a whoring loot council back in wotlk, and it allmost caused a divorce because of it, a story i will tell only on request.

Well glad we agree on something, we always include "trials" as much as we call, and their trial is usually just the 2 raids a week we have, plus a few +15s. But of course if that super epic titanforged to shit DPS trinket drops that our long serving warlock has been after and still wearing their dungeon blue, then its a no brainer.

But all these "you're on trial for a month and get no loot"... I'd be like, nah mate im outter here, gonna find a guild that isn't full of mongs.

It all comes down the guild, and how reasonable they are, and how much you are willing to accept.

[Deleted]

I raid now because heroic is a challenge, it is not as much of a challenge as mythic, but it still is, and i do it because for example, heroic aotc mount, and did it a total of 5 more times to help out friends who needed a "carry" to get them in "hey i have it, im above the min ilvl, this guys with me, he doesent have it, but i know he can do it, and hes just abit under the min ilvl...."

also i dont agree with the removal of master looter as a whole, im sure blizzard could do ALOT better, i am just glad that the days of shitty "trial" manipulation and loot councils whoring loot is over.
Hell i was the benefit of a whoring loot council back in wotlk, and it allmost caused a divorce because of it, a story i will tell only on request.

The worring thing about this is because there is some abuse everyone must conform to a sort of diktat from blizz. It's NOT an ealthy response from them, i mean what's next? PPl are gonna complain they dont get invited in raids so then they will introduce a feature were if you made a raid group the first to click enters automatically so that everyone has a "fair" chance to get invited? I dont agree that trials "deserve" loot and nobody said they dont in principle, it's a case by case scenario and a hyerarchy more than a you dont period issue, as usual this days we cant face or solve the problems like normal democratic humans that are allowed to decide and make mistake but we must conform to a"equality at all costs" socialist bullshit idea

- - - Updated - - -

Well glad we agree on something, we always include "trials" as much as we call, and their trial is usually just the 2 raids a week we have, plus a few +15s. But of course if that super epic titanforged to shit DPS trinket drops that our long serving warlock has been after and still wearing their dungeon blue, then its a no brainer.

But all these "you're on trial for a month and get no loot"... I'd be like, nah mate im outter here, gonna find a guild that isn't full of mongs.

It all comes down the guild, and how reasonable they are, and how much you are willing to accept.

Yeh like the foundations of humans democracy and meritocracy. I mean how ppl can argue that someone who just entered in ANY human organization deserve the rewards in THE SAME manner of the ones who founded it and made it successfull in the first place is absolutely MIND BLOWING to me.

[potis]

Yeh like the foundations of humans democracy and meritocracy. I mean how ppl can argue that someone who just entered in ANY human organization deserve the rewards in THE SAME manner of the ones who founded it and made it successfull in the first place is absolutely MIND BLOWING to me.

In WoW its sense of entitlement with the easy explanation of "Its not real".

Despite the fact many examples were given as to how its exactly the same thing with an intern in a long standing company, people just dont get it.

If for any reason it somehow affected them, like someone literally came to their job and said "Half your salary is mine because the government said so and you cant do anything about it", they would be crying dear murder.

They arent getting it because it does not affect them thats all there is to it.

Its like the passive hate for rich people.

or the excuse of "Its just a game" when they are horrible at moving pixels with their mouse.

[Deleted]

In WoW its sense of entitlement with the easy explanation of "Its not real".

Despite the fact many examples were given as to how its exactly the same thing with an intern in a long standing company, people just dont get it.

They arent getting it because it doesnt affect them.

If for any reason it somehow affected them, like someone literally came to their job and said "Half your salary is mine because the government said so and you cant do anything about it", they would be crying dear murder.

Yeh the "not real" argument is so bullshit i cant wrap my mind around it. Like the ones playing the game are not humans but some kind of robots.

[Scrysis]

Everyone who has an item they want to be redistributed trades it to your ML who then assigns it as before - will be slower, but not outrageously so

We used RCLootCouncil for loot. It would display all the items you were eligible for, and if you wanted one, you would choose a custom option (we had things like Main Spec, side grade, off-spec, 2-piece, 4-piece) and you had the ability to include a note that would indicate how good the stats were to you. It would convey all of that information back to the Master Looter as well as the ability to look at the item that you currently have equipped in that slot.

So as an example, suppose we had a cloth cloak that four people were interested in. For one person, it's a side grade because it's a reroll. For two people it's a regular upgrade, and for one person it completes a four-piece bonus. With the addon, he was able to quickly dismiss the reroll as not significant, and then prioritize the four-piece bonus as the bonus gives it extra weight.

Just handing all of the items to the raid leader isn't going to fix the issue. Doing all of that evaluation by hand is going to be too long and time consuming. We'd have to have everyone link their current items and a note, and then he'd have to stop and sort all of that out manually. He'll have to stop and read each one, and try and make sure he has the correct response with the corresponding item. And if we were to trade it to him, he'd have to wait for everyone to trade him each respective item. It IS going to be outrageously longer.

[potis]

Yeh the "not real" argument is so bullshit i cant wrap my mind around it. Like the ones playing the game are not humans but some kind of robots.

Was editing, as i said, its because it does not affect their "safe space".

Its how the Homo Sapiens works.

[Deleted]

Was editing, as i said, its because it does not affect their "safe space".

Its how the Homo Sapiens works.

The fun fact is that id does infact affect it they just seem to ignore it. The shift in the playerbase attitute towards raids that happened because various brilliant blizz changes affect everyone but often they just ignore it or blame it on "the market has changed" or some half hassed analysis of the problem.

[potis]

The fun fact is that id does infact affect it they just seem to ignore it. The shift in the playerbase attitute towards raids that happened because various brilliant blizz changes affect everyone but often they just ignore it or blame it on "the market has changed" or some half hassed analysis of the problem.

It does not affect them directly which is all that matters.

People can not see long term, most people dont have the brain capacity to do so, and they do not understand how one change can affect everything long term.

Now add the fact that its a game, and it becomes even worst.

You cant change Humans, only fear changes Humans, and there is no fear involved in "non-real" things.

[Deleted]

It does not affect them directly which is all that matters.

People can not see long term, most people dont have the brain capacity to do so, and they do not understand how one change can affect everything long term.

Now add the fact that its a game, and it becomes even worst.

You cant change Humans, only fear changes Humans, and there is no fear involved in "non-real" things.

I agree in part but even self reflection and analysis can do the trick not only fear (Even fi there is some fear involved in it). But yeh the fact that's a game makes it even harder there is no doubt about that

[Kuntantee]

it dose affect others actually, if you are really unlucky, you will just drag the grp/guild down due to poor gear whit this system

Except this hypothetically being unlucky is full of crap. You will get loot.

Tho, in my opinion, those who prefer to carry on with ML should have the option to do so. While I do not agree with the reasoning of OP, Blizz forcing this is a bad move.

[Deleted]

If your going to nation bash the rest of your post and anything fallowing up after just isn't worth reading.

Coming from the country specialised in that i found that sentence pretty rich.

In WoW its sense of entitlement with the easy explanation of "Its not real".

Despite the fact many examples were given as to how its exactly the same thing with an intern in a long standing company, people just dont get it.

If for any reason it somehow affected them, like someone literally came to their job and said "Half your salary is mine because the government said so and you cant do anything about it", they would be crying dear murder.

They arent getting it because it does not affect them thats all there is to it.

Its like the passive hate for rich people.

or the excuse of "Its just a game" when they are horrible at moving pixels with their mouse.

Someone that fucking get it, thanks the stars.

How many will call for that excuse when they are cornered ? the number of "lol it's just a videogame" excuse i've seen coming from terrible mouthbreather tier "players" is mind bending, even more when those same mindbenders will actively lose their shit on anyone not doing it by the books on others game like LoL or all the trendy newfagg tier shit like Fortnite/Pubg.

It does not affect them directly which is all that matters.

People can not see long term, most people dont have the brain capacity to do so, and they do not understand how one change can affect everything long term.

Now add the fact that its a game, and it becomes even worst.

You cant change Humans, only fear changes Humans, and there is no fear involved in "non-real" things.

Yep, hence why so many muppets in this thread on top of presenting little to no arguments just casualy circlejerk about how we got it in the ass and climax from it, like that one weeb crayon connaisseur just making the same "lol get on with it or quit it xoxo 11!!1" post over and over again.

What scare me the most is, on top of not wanting to change any shit in their way to proceed and interact with others Humans being (which is okay to some degree) they fucking rejoice on the misery of others, how fucked up are you when the rare kicks you get in your day are learning that someone that doesn't agree with you got the short end of the stick ?

Like : "give us your guns, you deranged lunatic, this is absolutely normal and healthy and for your own good !" ... "THEY DARE SEARCH OUR BACKPACKS IT'S VIOLATING THE CONSTITUTION REEEEEEEEEEEEEE" level of plain don't-deserve-to-breath-anymore retardation.

[8bithamster]

Hint, don't try to force your way of raiding on other people. Is that so hard to grasp or do you think you have some god given right that everyone has to follow your suboptimal way of handling loot for a progress guild?

says the one going "ehmagerd if you give lewt to others then <x>!" irony..

[Deleted]

says the one going "ehmagerd if you give lewt to others then <x>!" irony..

THen what? Nobody is asking blizz to remove PL or group loot or free for all.. Your argument is? Oh wait you dont have one

[SirCowdog]

This entire PL vs ML thing sets a bad precedent.

So some players QQ about not getting loot, and how Trials deserve loot too! What's next? Everyone deserves a spot on a raid, regardless of their skill or contribution too? If Blizzard doesn't trust us to handle our own loot, why should they trust us to form our own groups? Lets get rid of pre-made groups and put everything in LFR!

The entire concept of removing the consequences of the bad decisions of players by removing all ability to choose in the first place is deeply and fundamentally flawed. If you don't want to have your ability to get loot abused by groups using Master Looter, then STOP JOINING GROUPS THAT USE MASTER LOOTER. You don't tell everyone else that THEY can't use it just so you don't have to think about your decisions.

uhg.... /facepalm

[Deleted]

This entire PL vs ML thing sets a bad precedent.

So some players QQ about not getting loot, and how Trials deserve loot too! What's next? Everyone deserves a spot on a raid, regardless of their skill or contribution too? If Blizzard doesn't trust us to handle our own loot, why should they trust us to form our own groups? Lets get rid of pre-made groups and put everything in LFR!

The entire concept of removing the consequences of the bad decisions of players by removing all ability to choose in the first place is deeply and fundamentally flawed. If you don't want to have your ability to get loot abused by groups using Master Looter, then STOP JOINING GROUPS THAT USE MASTER LOOTER. You don't tell everyone else that THEY can't use it just so you don't have to think about your decisions.

uhg.... /facepalm

This exactly