The problem is that this doesn't show evolution. Only "mary sueness". This is a manuver i would expect only elite elven warrior/maybe elite blademaster to be able to pull off. Meanwhile anduin does that effortlessly while never being shown as any combatant. In a full plate. That he should, by all means of logic, be barely able to move in. Thats precisely the problem with his character.
Anduin is written pretty flawed actually, just because he is being put in the spotlight doesn't make him a Mary-Sue, he cannot fight and is a bit of a wimp to be honest. He still is struggling with the leadership role and is seen constantly questioning himself and his ability to lead. There's really nothing to say he is a Mary Sue, if anything he's just a boring, bland character, Mary-Sue's try to at least have something outrageous about them to try and make him appealing. Anduin is just a goody good guy. Which is not the best thing to want to see written.
If anything Anduin is too flawed.
Anduin has never been an interesting character either, I cannot name a single book or comic where he was remotely interesting to me. He isnt a Mary-Sue, just boring.
There is a big hole or gap right now that I am waiting for the book Before the Storm to fill in, and find out how Anduin changes as a person when war is give to him. I didn't read the spoilers or the preview so no spoiling me please
Last edited by Orby; 2018-05-24 at 12:42 AM.
I love Warcraft, I dislike WoW
Unsubbed since January 2021, now a Warcraft fan from a distance
I agree it doesn't show evolution very well - that's what it is meant to do, but it's not wholly successful in its execution. As for being able to pull off the move in full plate, well, this is WoW and Paladins, Warriors, and Death Knights pull off dexterous moves like this all the time even though they're wearing a hundred pounds of heavy metal. Perhaps you can chalk it up to the Light giving him a temporary boost in strength - or that the metal alloys used in WoW just don't weigh the same as real-life steel does. WoW just isn't meant to be realistic, so all of these things should be taken with multiple grains of salt.
As for "Mary Sue-ness," this term has been stretched and warped so much it is almost has no intrinsic meaning left to it. Even a bad character, if you want to call Anduin such, isn't necessarily a "Mary Sue" just because it is badly written. Being a "Mary Sue" is an entirely different charge altogether.
"We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead
So why be a mary-sue about it? You're trying to make way too much sense of fantasy in a videogame. Blizz writing has never made sense on your level of standards and requirements. It's an old medieval fantasy setting and none of your modern terms will ever fit or make sense to any of the characters. Of course the main characters are going to wear plot-armor. This is just weak drama over nothing.
If you knew the candle was fire then the meal was cooked a long time ago.
He's perfectly fine as a head of state for Stormwind his youth and more importantly naivete are what invalidate him from being the leader of the Alliance. Tyrande, Genn, Velen and Jaina should not be his counsel, they should be the ones running the war. They are the ones who know the true nature of the Horde and won't make concessions for foolish idealism. Or shouldn't; too much of that has already gone away. The fact Tyrande let's Saurfang live is weakness embodied. Varian vowed to end the Horde should they pull their crap again. Here they are pulling their crap again. I don't see Anduin having the guts to end the Horde. Anduin is not experienced to lead battles, believes in foolish idealism in the face of bloody warfare and his naivete is a direct consequence of his youth.
But Anduin isn't mature. He still clings to idealism without an ounce of temper from reality.The point was that youth doesn't disqualify him for some strange reason, especially not in a setting where it seems expected that teenagers don the mantle of maturity much earlier than their modern-day equivalents do.
Not just people, but the Horde specifically. The Horde is an existential threat to the Alliance and he fails to realise this, his entire motivation seems to be to try and 'prove to the Horde' that the Alliance isn't a threat to their survival, and he doesn't seem to care how many night elves, worgen, draenei, dwarves and kul tirans have to die for his idealism. And I'm fine with him being written as such without idiots like Shandris Feathermoon saying the lives of her people aren't any more relevant to her people's survival as a human. That is where I get salty about how awful the story is going. The rest of the Alliance leaders just bow their empty heads and say 'yes my king, my life for your ideals'. If Tyrande, Genn and Jaina tell him the Horde needs to be ground into the dirt, he will tell them all about how wrong they are and why. A lecture from a teenager is the dumbest crap, we already saw enough of that idiocy in the real world. Why write it into here?As for him being naive, I actually agree - it's really the central character fault he possesses that everyone seems to trip over in the rush to plaster "Mary Sue" over his oddly-proportioned face. Anduin is the consummate peacenik, taking the throne from even Jaina in his unwillingness to recognize that sometimes people are just malevolent and have no higher calling other than to move or extend hardship and conflict.
I'm still waiting for the Alliance to round up and massacre families of civilians in a horde village, plague bomb an entire town reducing the inhabitants to sludge, kidnap and torture refugees for the hell of it, burying horde up to their necks in the dirt then caving their skulls in for the hell of it, raid a Horde town and leave the corpses strung up, or nuke a city out of existence. I keep hearing how the Alliance has it's 'evil' the most you can see is 'Jaina was mean to some blood elves' and 'REMEMBER TAURAJO'. Well Garrosh was mean to some night elves and REMEMBER SILVERWIND REFUGE.He reminds me of a passage I once read about another fantasy human king: "the man couldn't recognize evil if it were dressed in all black, jumping up and down on his bed while clutching a bloodied knife and screaming 'I am Darkness personified.' A significant character flaw, even for a human." Personally, I think neither the Horde nor the Alliance are monoliths - you can find evil and good among them, they don't have moral uniformity of any kind. I grow more and more convinced that Sylvanas, for example, is pretty much evil in her orientation - perhaps not irredeemably so, but nearing the threshold of "redemption = death." I don't think the same thing of Baine, Lor'themar, or Rokhan however.
The Alliance has never done anything outside of some standard combat with military targets and it's pathetic that we keep hearing 'good and evil on both sides'. When a bunch of night elves decide to leave the corpses of Orc civilians impaled on the roadway to Azshara as 'new trees in Ashenvale' or dwarves get ahold of the Forsaken non-combatants and play a game of how much molten iron can the creaking corpse take before it conflagrates, then maybe you can start having 'both sides are good and evil' conversation.
Last edited by Blizzard Moneybot; 2018-05-24 at 01:02 AM.
Fuck you, Give me Money- Bli$$ard
Jaina, Moira, Velen, Bolvar, Baine, Genn, and many B-list and minor characters fawn over him. It’s through the entire game and his lore. They treat him like the coming messiah or savior of all that is good.
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Legion? Wotlk? MoP? Those expansions had A & B Tier writing. Things were realistic, the plot armor was low and the plot was most imortantly: unpredictable.
"You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."
Well yeah the truth is that he is a 19 year old kid and is a wimp. Up until MOTP he was a complete wimp and he is still a wimp in legion. Honestly his accomplishments are nothing compared to other older characters who actually destroys unworldly demon kings and void lords, saving the entire planet.
He only got his crown due to his lineage and that's what happens in medieval fantasy world anyways.
better than Sylvanas "there is no joy in this curse" Windrunner killing undead who wish to be with their families.
Oh really? I’m pretty sure she never intended for Varian to die after saving his life -three- times in less than an hour and also wishing him good luck after being thanked by him. She even mourned his death as she sailed off and prepared for the blame of his death.
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High King wasn’t anything established until Mists of Pandaria: Landfall. It should NEVER be a hereditary title. If anything Genn, Jaina, or Velen should’ve been left in control of the Alliance or better yet: Be an actual ALLIANCE.
"You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."
Its not just Anduin, the entire alliance is getting white washed.
Greymane was a ruthless seclusionist until recently he become a heart warming uncle figure for Anduin. Jaina is getting a comic to describe how her poor Theramore's (which was pretty much a military outpost used to launch assaults against the horde in their own territory) destruction is such a sad thing, which makes her actions understandable. No more will she watch from the sides, or be naive about peace, she will righteously cleanse the evil horde of the earth.
But is the horde evil? Of course it is! Forget the broken shore and warchief cinematics where Sylvanas looked like the mantle of warchief was a new beginning and growth of her character, being restless she begins to burn down entire world trees, launch chemical warfare on her own troops, and personally see that the new magic gold is used in creating a conflict that throws the entire world into war.
Ohh we forgot the main point. Anduin. The boy that literally cannot do anything wrong, at an age of 19 he have only a little lack of sleep to burden him while governing an entire empire, and is respected by peers many times his age for his diplomatic wisdom. Anything he does is sanctioned by the wickedness of his enemies, and never is he thrown into a dilemma where he have to choose between lesser evils. Also apparently have the superpower to know if an action is objectively evil as the first and only person in the whole world.
Truly excellent writing, not even i could have imagined this level of lingual expression.
Last edited by mmoc8c93e36b48; 2018-05-24 at 01:26 AM.
Wait really? So there is a power that can actually decide which thoughts are universally a "good" and "evil" thing. I did not know evil could be an objective thing. I did not know he got such power from that bell. Also i can read that without the mallet the bell is actually the opposite, anger and hate. Ohh well.
So he doesnt just have plot armor, he also have moral armor?
i invite all of you, that makin pew pew about mary sanduin, to join horde for 1 day.
i will tell you about our great lore and our great leaders, while we sitting at a camp fire:
- about an idiotic cow, watching his fathers death while doing nothing.
- about a small fat greedy ashole, with no real role in game.
- about a cool troll, sitting on a throne for one expac, doing nothing, then died.
- about an one eyed cool bro stereotype, that have 2 lines of text every 2 xpacs.
- about a fucked up titts bitch, that half the ppl dont like, while you have to do her stinky jobs.
and you whine about anduin ? muhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.