Why are you afraid of RNG?

[Pandragon]

I see alot of posts with ppl saying it's too much RNG, RNG this, RNG that.
RNG is a huge factor of RPGs and i have no problem with it at all, so im just wondering, why are you afraid of RNG?

I mean, take Diablo 2 for example, people are still hunting that perfect rolled item, it adds replayability etc.

Imagine if you run into an instance/raid and get fully geared instantly for example, why would you want to go back there again if you didnt know you could get an upgrade, even if it's a very small chance? Are you just bored of gaming? Bored of the game? Why?

The difference between WoW and Diablo. You can farm for that perfectly rolled item, where in WoW, if you get a bad drop you have to wait a whole week to try and get it again.

[Volitar]

There is RNG and there is RNG ad nauseam. The normal RNG that was in the game from the launch of the game until Throne of Thunder worked just fine for most people. They don't even report active subscribers anymore just time spent ingame. Feels like they are doing everything possible to make people play as much as possible, every aspect of the game is an RNG headache.

[IceMan1763]

Finally, why is getting the gear the only fun you can have? The game should feel fun to play by itself, it should be rewarding before any rewards come into play. The rewards reinforce the feeling of accomplishment, but the fun shouldn't come from it. If it does, then the game isn't very good.
RNG certainly doesn't make it more fun. A progressive rewarding system is more rewarding and flexible than having to do a specific dungeon multiple times until what you need drops. According to the OP, that is fun. I disagree. I like my effort to be adequatly rewarded, not be a freaking roll of the slot machine.

Spot on. I could care less about the gear except that in WOW, improving your gear is a necessary element to being able to beat the NEXT boss. That's the only real value it holds in my eye. The exciting part is actually KILLING THE BOSS.

When improving your gear is necessary to progression but you have a gear system so laden with RNG that an upgrade can come from literally anywhere, you actually encourage behavior in game that almost everyone considers boring like, for example, rolling multiple 110s to try to get a good set of legiondaries or feeling like you need to do each raid at every difficulty to maximize your rolls on the slot machine. QOL in WOW was SO much better when LFR really couldn't provide any upgrades for a Mythic or Heroic raider (especially after the raid has been out for a few resets). That's why high end raiding is a ghost town in WOW now... the dev team doesn't just ignore long lasting QOL issues like split raiding, but they introduce systems THEY KNOW FOR A FACT will cause problems for high end raiders and then tell those same raiders "just ignore these new features they're not that impactful lul nubs". It's such a condescending and toxic attitude for the dev team to have... just sidestepping addressing REAL problems with their systems by saying "it's not (or won't be) a big deal".

[Enchant]

It pisses me off more than actually being afraid.

[Fabinas]

Afraid? No

I just hate spending time and not getting a fixed reward for it. Even a fractional one.

I also hate gambling.

[Multitorix Davlen]

I see alot of posts with ppl saying it's too much RNG, RNG this, RNG that.
RNG is a huge factor of RPGs and i have no problem with it at all, so im just wondering, why are you afraid of RNG?

I mean, take Diablo 2 for example, people are still hunting that perfect rolled item, it adds replayability etc.

Imagine if you run into an instance/raid and get fully geared instantly for example, why would you want to go back there again if you didnt know you could get an upgrade, even if it's a very small chance? Are you just bored of gaming? Bored of the game? Why?

Its not that people are afraid of RNG, its that in a game where RNG should only affect a few things - its bleeding into others that are not fun interactions. Its not a matter of being bored either. Its frustrating when you do difficult content and it just never drops. The difference between d2 and WoW is much of the grind in d2 isnt hard, where as to get good quality stuff in WoW it has to be the difficult content. The effort vs reward is significantly different between the games

[gobio]

Why use the word afraid? Am I supposed to say I am not afraid, or am I? Deep down we are all afraid of the unknown...

Are you Dr Phil or something? F off.

[Denarius]

Not afraid, but disgusted by the insane amounts of multiple RNG layers.

Classic WoW: exactly 2 layers of RNG - item drops (yes/no) & you win the roll / get the item by loot council or DKP (yes/no)
.

Zhevra Hooves, Raptor Hearts... ~shudders~

[Kikazz]

I see alot of posts with ppl saying it's too much RNG, RNG this, RNG that.
RNG is a huge factor of RPGs and i have no problem with it at all, so im just wondering, why are you afraid of RNG?

I mean, take Diablo 2 for example, people are still hunting that perfect rolled item, it adds replayability etc.

Imagine if you run into an instance/raid and get fully geared instantly for example, why would you want to go back there again if you didnt know you could get an upgrade, even if it's a very small chance? Are you just bored of gaming? Bored of the game? Why?

Replay-ability for the sake of replay-ability, breeds boredom, and in my opinion is the reason in sub decline,
RNG is fine, when it is contained and isnt over the top stupid.

Farming 1 boss for 11 years who has 6 items on his loot table for 1 item, that never drops.
thats not fun, and just annoying.

Why play something over and over and over again to get nothing, for the sake of just playing it.

i dont pay a sub to farm the same thing 52 weeks a year to not get what i want, its counterproductive and i can spend my money elsehwere,

With Legion it went overboard with RNG, thats why people are upset.

[lockybalboa]

Because it NEVER favors me

[Alkizon]

I agree with the TBC part, Wrath would have been fine as well if they hadn't put Tier on the vendors imo, but TBC felt like that nice balance of having some RNG in gear from drops, and the ability to gain something if you earned it and hadn't gotten anything better. I think eventually they went overboard and made it too easy to get gear from vendors, so they did a 180 and eventually stripped almost everything good from those vendors/reps.

RNG isn't scary though, it just can get very frustrating at times, especially when it stacks like it has in Legion.

1.) Does boss drop item
2.) Does the item roll high enough
3.) Does the item roll with tertiary stats/socket

Eventually if you miss any one of those 3 it's return to 1.

It's more the stacking of RNG that is the problem, because I think most people that have played games at this point realize that if everything was certain it would be a very short lived product.

After playing for what 14 years now? Legion felt like they went too far on the RNG pendulum.

Precisely!
There is no even point to add something special. In some way, this is condensed truncated version of what my new friend wrote on eu forum. As I understand it, that topic duplicates current one.

[Destinas]

It's not a fear for me, it's disappointment.

I'll take, for example, pet content. With Wailing Critters, I can spend about half an hour doing that pet dungeon with the perfect pets, no trouble whatsoever. I've done it for many weeks, I know my way around there, and I know the strats. At the end I get the Damp Pet Supplies that can possibly have three pets - at the moment I'm only missing one. Each week I do it, and more often than not I do not get the pet I'm missing, or I don't get a pet at all.

Then, with the Deadmines pet dungeon, it is a certain amount of weeks (I believe, 6) in order to earn everything. Each week you get one token, and different pets are bought with those special tokens. You are given rewards, but only after effort is put in. There is also a goal that can be reached and worked toward at the choice of the player.

I don't mind a bit of RNG - it's fine to keep hope alive. However, using my examples, there's a chance that I could get the pet from Wailing Critters next week, or I could never get it at all, unless I spent upwards of 600k gold in the auction house (at times it has been ~2 mil). I don't mind, at all, putting effort or having a challenge. However, putting in effort and constantly being beaten down doesn't make for a fun, lucrative, or hopeful experience. I'd much rather have a system where I can earn things, rather than hope for things. That is the flaw with too much RNG.

[BuckSparkles]

I miss vanilla RNG. Seal of Command Windfury.

Made procs exciting.

[Ophenia]

RNG is fine.
RNG on top of RNG on top of RNG on top of RNG on top of RNG on top of RNG is not fine.

[Doffen]

Talking about RNG. Did a Falcosaur World Quest just now, and it had a relic as reward. When I was done I got the relic, but I got another relic as well. And it has happened two times that I have gotten two items looted from one Trilliax kill in Nighthold. Bug-rng ftw.

[Raelbo]

So basically you admit the system was by no measure a success...in fact I would think it's fair to say it was a MASSIVE failure and one of the most hated features of the xpac.

It was unsuccessful in that it attracted a lot of persistent and loud criticism from a vocal minority. That doesn't mean that the hate was justified or a fair reflection of the merits of the system.

The simple fact is this: People hate the system because people hate the system. The arguments against it are generally weak, but you know, once a mob of zealous fanatics gets an idea into their heads, reason, logic and rational thinking kind of fly out the window.

Yet you still say we're "moaning incessantly".

Well you are.

That's what tends to happen when you have a dev team like this one who flat out DOES NOT LISTEN to Alpha feedback, Beta feedback, or live feedback (at least until it's too late and it's the next xpac).

This is a senseless argument because there has never, in the history of this game, been a unanamous opinion on anything. It's very easy to be smug and say "Bliz should of listened" regarding an issue that you feel strongly about when it seems your opinion is vindicated. But with a million different opinions out there, odds are that they did listen to someone, just not you or someone who shares your opinion. That's what tends to happen when your feedback is shit and lacks logic reason and rationality. And sadly, it isn't even always good feedback that is listened to, it's often just the loudest.

That's why the game has been going downhill so fast.

Legion has been a massive success. So I think this assertion is unsubstantiated.

They are WAY TOO SLOW to recognize bad ideas and EVEN MORE SLOW to fix them. In this case, the "fix" for this awful system was just leaving it COMPLETELY out of the next xpac.

The shortcomings of the legendary system were fixed by the time the Nighthold rolled around, but the mob adamantly refused to give it the chance it deserves, because they'd already decided it needs to be crucified. Not really sure Blizzard had much of a choice on this.

I'm sorry, but I and many others won't support a game with a dev team that incredibly egotistical and inflexible.

And honestly, no offense, but don't expect people like me to shed a tear about that. The legendary system was a great feature of Legion which sadly got ruined by a bunch of loud and narrow minded people who turned it into a scapegoat for all their issues. You complain about the devs not listening, but a big part of the reason is that good feedback tends to get drowned out by loud feedback. The anti-legendary crowd gave a weak argument against legendaries during alpha a beta, and thus wasn't listened to. But instead of refining your argument you just started a virtual riot to get heard. Well done. You were heard. And the game is poorer for it.

[sibut]

By “afraid of” do you mean “annoyed by?” I think that’d be more accurate for me after hundreds/thousands of attempts for specific mounts.

[Nnyco]

people just goin haywire because they cant get their bis item and throw a fit on forum

[Nutrition]

Afraid and annoyed with are two different things.

Personally I would rather just deal with if the boss drops the item or not rather then wacky loot lotto Tuesday. At levels below mythic I imagine it shortens and cheapens the content as well.

[IceMan1763]

The legendary system was a great feature of Legion

I don't need to read or respond to anything else because you're clearly way past the point of no return if you can legitimately type something like this. You and the other white knight fanbois deserve the low effort money grab that BFA clearly is.