Classic update. It will be on 1.12 and it will be on battle.net :)

[liljc711]

Since we know where they are at as far as data conversion fix. Where does this put them as far as a timeline goes to have classic live? 1 year or 2 years from this point?

[Kralljin]

Since we know where they are at as far as data conversion fix. Where does this put them as far as a timeline goes to have classic live? 1 year or 2 years from this point?

Wouldn't surprise me if they come around with a release date on Blizzcon.
So perhaps late 2019 / early 2020, they probably sync it with the downtime from BfA to the next expansion.

[Akka]

You are reading between the lines. They didnt say that.
They said that the way they are engeniering it (computer mambo jambo) would leave transmog and achiev out because its missing the data. It's a technical thing.
They said at no point the "direction of the game".

I explicitely spelled out why it was significant nevertheless. You missed the whole point.

[arkanon]

@Perkunas

See? I told you.

"similar conveniences that do not affect the core gameplay experience." could mean a million different things for many different people. Is subjective.
I told you if you make a thread in MMO-C asking if transmog/LFR changes gameplay you will see a million people saying "it doesnt".

I see ONE person. A million is not that close to "one"

[The Stormbringer]

Still after transmog, achievements, and a collection system for our mounts, pets, etc.

Something something no changes something keep it vanilla something something?

[arkanon]

I'm still against it. When you were creating groups for even pick up/alt raids, they have been organized by guilds or individuals with reputation.
If a player had a bad reputation or Raid Leader then these would not end up being in the group or being finalized (because RL was known ninja for example).

In LFR you end up with random people with someone having to be THE LEADER etc. to make it work (often such groups failed).

Everything was community (server reputation) based. It was awesome and it gave that extra feeling of lack of anonymity and bonding with other players.
When you were unknown and given a shot, you were being looked at and made a rep for yourself. You were not only working on your gear but on reputation as well.
From such Community based raids there have been some guilds and bonds with people made.

When we ran Alt raids and needed randoms we had some "friendly" people who were unlucky with gear and we would invite them, or even cycle out (ourselves) later for them to just give them spot for a boss so they would get the chance for gear. We did that for good and skilled players, who not always had the gear.
At times (had them on flist) we would even whisper them if they want to join a boss or something as we are on it but it would result in them being locked and doing just that one boss.

Perkunas did add few valid points actually as well to this.

I hope these do make valid points for you why I'm such a 'no-no' for LFR (even without xrealm) and xrealm in gendral.

ps. I still keep in touch with quite a few people from Vanilla/TBC times and attended quite a few guild parties as well.

This whole "server reputation" bullshit again. Just absolute bollocks. "but it happened on MY server." no, it didnt. its just a handful of players who are so arrogant they honestly think anyone knows them or that they have this really amazing reputation. It just never happened. On any even half decent realm, a player could form a raid, ninja loot, and the next day, start forming another pug, and they would fill the group again. Sure, some people would hoot and holler in chat about them being a ninja, but the group would still fill up, and the content would be cleared.

[ProfessorTjc]

IMHO I think they should only allow 8 debuff slots on anything from Blackwing Lair and before until they release the Zul'Gurub raid which is when they upped the debuffs from 8 to 16. At least make the beginning raids semi difficult by removing something that was there from the beginning.

Like others have stated, beginning raids are going to be a joke with the class talent revamps + 16 debuff slots.

[MoanaLisa]

Everything was community (server reputation) based. It was awesome and it gave that extra feeling of lack of anonymity and bonding with other players.

It's curious how someone who gets to know three or four dozen people on a realm that likely had thousands of players thinks this. I don't doubt that keeping cred among your peers was important but 'your peers' is a highly flexible thing. For my own part I remember that my own realm back in the day was dominated by a couple of guilds that competed fiercely against one another mostly by accusing each other of being ninjas in public chat channels and attempting to get them driven off the realm.

No thanks to that. You want a great community where reputation matters? Start a guild that expressly is about all of that.

[Jastall]

BWL will be incredibly easy if it's on 1.12.

I feel that's the main "issue" people will end up having, raids like MC/BWL among other things were nerfed both directly and indirectly many many times before 1.12, they're all pretty much a joke and you should steam roll it with a semi-competent raid group.

Not like it would have been much different without nerfs. Now that people know every single trick to these fights they will fall over as soon as the raid is geared enough.

[Whitedragon]

incorrect. you obviously never played vanilla on launch. wrath baby detected.

I did and it was dam easy to farm up the fire res gear needed for MC. It was decently challenging to get gear for BWL, and AQ and NAX where cluster f***s but they would happen later anyways and when you know whats coming it's a lot easier to pre plan gearing for it.

Scoff all you want, but by todays standers if we had a dedicated group pushing to clear something it most definitely would be cleared first week. turns out people have gotten much better at the game over the years. Any boss that would escape this is something that was way over tuned to begin with, and I doubt people would be as accepting of impossible bosses now a days.

[Echocho]

Like others have stated, beginning raids are going to be a joke with the class talent revamps + 16 debuff slots.

They will be a joke because of the class talent revamps, not because of the debuff limit. Especially in MC when warlocks suck to begin with the shadow weaving buff won't provide much benefit and all the other debuffs are very minor but if you have an example of a debuff that does major damage feel free to share.

This whole "server reputation" bullshit again. Just absolute bollocks. "but it happened on MY server." no, it didnt. its just a handful of players who are so arrogant they honestly think anyone knows them or that they have this really amazing reputation. It just never happened. On any even half decent realm, a player could form a raid, ninja loot, and the next day, start forming another pug, and they would fill the group again. Sure, some people would hoot and holler in chat about them being a ninja, but the group would still fill up, and the content would be cleared.

The server reputation wasn't as much of a server reputation as it was elitism. Me and my group of friends play with a player we consider bad and we won't play with him again, this doesn't mean that nobody else will. If someone ninja loots there's no huge bulletin board where their name is displayed, the only time it becomes server wide reputation is when you do it consistently in all the groups you join.

[klaps_05]

I don't think their announcement rules out progressive content patches. Just that balance and class design will use 1.12 as the starting point.

Classic servers is a one-off project as once its setup, its done. they most likely will just deploy 1.12, with all content available immediately. This works because all content is technically not available immediately due to attuments, gear requirements, etc. so you have to naturally progress through it.

[Vineri]

Couldn't they just retune MC and BWL? Keep the mechanics the same, just touch up the numbers a bit so they are somewhat of a challenge in a world where people do MC with DM/ZG gear available.

I think you overestimate what WoW players can do. Blizzard tried a challenge - Naxxramus. If didn't go very well. Actually it still doesn't go well on servers elsewhere. It's fun, but it requires pretty much every member to be geared.

No room for slack.

None. Zero.

Naxxramus is real.

[Vineri]

I mean I did MC a few times, was not a regular raider, it was extremely easy outside Ragnaros (and even he was not much of a challenge). If people have access to DM, ZG and heck, Dungeon set 0.5 (it was very good for some classes). Starting at 1.12 is a change from Classic for those early raids but with a tiny bit of tuning up it doesn't have to be.

MC =/= Naxxramus ,, not sure what you are getting at?

[ldev]

They will not make any gameplay changes.

I'm sorry, but 7.3.5 client with classic azeroth map and classic skills is just a skin, totally not classic. "No gameplay changes" lmao.

[Deleted]

Doubt the AV stuff happens. People who think they will keep absurd things like endless AV are fooling themselves.

Endless AV is literally the only reason I'm interested in classic servers. What would be the point in changing it? It's not like live AV is very popular and if you dislike the endless matches you can just play any of the other battlegrounds.

[Vineri]

People will not start at Naxxramas, this is supposed to be an alpha experience so people will want to progress through the raids. That means they will cruise through MC since it will be even easier than it is supposed to be due to much superior access. What are YOU getting at?

Beefing up the difficulty is not a very good solution. Blizzard tried this with Naxx; it flopped.

You want to increase the difficulty .. see Naxxramus in original WoW to know how that turned up.

edit:
people stopped participating when difficulty was high.

[Brubear]

no one is talking about releasing versions of the actual client, just the talent/spell values. they all exist in a table. not that complicated to convert.

I know you're already banned and this has been addressed, but this right here shows you're being willfully ignorant and have zero knowledge of how tables/databases work. They even explain it pretty clearly in easy-to-understand ways for people who don't understand databases in the post. As someone who has had to help go through an 80,000 entry dataset and help parse it so it would be able to fit into a relational database (which is what Blizzard is having to do) I can confidently say you have no fucking clue what you're talking about.

If the example of how they were storing spells is even remotely close to some of the other methods that were likely used in Vanilla, then converting it all to a more secure and up-to-date system is a massive undertaking that will take many thousands of manhours just to parse the data alone.

[Echocho]

If the example of how they were storing spells is even remotely close to some of the other methods that were likely used in Vanilla, then converting it all to a more secure and up-to-date system is a massive undertaking that will take many thousands of manhours just to parse the data alone.

It's a massive undertaking that's for sure. Depending on how quickly they were able to get started and how complicated and time consuming the rest of the stuff is I guess we could get a beta around christmas, it's not outside the realm of possibility. Before august 2019 I most definitely would expect a beta though.

[Ukon]

1.12 ruins raiding for the first few raids, it creates catchup gear that was never there

What catch-up gear? Are you refering to the dungeon tier set recolors? This is something that is serverside, not client side. So this is something that might not be there on release of classic.

it alters the feel and flow of the game even if they gate and add raids progressively. Everything will be cleared the very night it releases (I expect this anyway from most guilds) for all guilds.

Why would it be any different if we had an earlier patch instead? Players in general are better now than back then. So I would be surprised if people just went and forgot everything (like how to look up boss fights).

And there probably would be some people making or porting stuff similar to deadly boss mods etc.

And by the way, as it said in the post. There are lots of stuff that are stored in the database and not on the client. So the game client being at patch 1.12 does not mean that everything will be as if it was patch 1.12... Like NPC's and such that werent there in the beginning when MC was out, can be added in later etc. Without a patch being released, since the models etc are already in the client.

The people who wanted the game before it was a carnival ride will not be getting that experience. I have little faith they will do this right. Classic was a dream that will probably be dead on arrival.

You don't have to be negative until you've tried it after it's been released.