To you, is Vanilla shallow or complex?

[Kynario]

Title: Is Vanilla complex or shallow in your eyes?

To some, it’s a completely barebones and shallow version of the game, lacking many fundamental elements added on in the later expansions (like achievements, various QoL changes like the mount tab and autoloot etc). Basic kill quests, horrible itemization, simple boss-fights (mechanically) and so on...

To others, it’s an immensely complex game with long lost RPG elements.

People seem to be really divided on this. I wonder why.

What’s your thoughts?

[Akurenia]

I played a Frost Mage and primarily raided Molten Core so PvE wise it was incredibly shallow for me. All I did was use frost bolt and nothing else because that was the optimal rotation outside of making mana gems and spamming buffs.

Ran a PoM/Pyro build for PvP so I could one shot even grand marshal's of certain classes every 3 or 5(?) minutes. Simple but surprisingly fun, I far enjoyed the PvP over PvE but I'd still argue it was pretty shallow despite the fun factor.

[Queendom]

To others, it’s an immensely complex game with long lost RPG elements.

Because it was 14 years ago, Warcraft 3 was fresh, for most of players it was the first ever MMORPG and the it had a colossal impact. All of these "long lost RPG elements" were just in players heads, not in the game. You cannot recreate the same atmosphere and feeling just by dropping 1.12 servers (or, in this case, by any means). The time has passed, the game moved on, all that left is just nostalgia feeling.

[MoanaLisa]

Complex but accessible in its time. Shallow by today's standards. I don't consider shallow to necessarily be bad but the game has gathered considerable depth since then. More than anything vanilla is out of touch with gaming standards today. For some that's a bonus and that's OK.

[Akka]

It's shallow raid-wise, it's complex dungeon/leveling-wise.
It's shallow when it comes to boss abilities, it's average+ when it comes to player's stat (would be "complex" if there was more possibility to tweak the stat like in TBC, but not yet).

More than anything, it's immersive and meaningful (what you do in retail is usually either irrelevant, or mode irrelevant very quickly, while Vanilla had a much slower pace which made nearly everything you did relevant to the game).

[callipygoustp]

Somewhere in between.

[Aeula]

A shallow ocean.

A huge, wide open world and reasons to see it. But there's not much depth to it beyond that.

[Cracked]

Let's just say that the complexity of vanilla wasn't in the gameplay.

But there was just so much stuff to explore and learn about the world, that's what made it complex and great.

Which is why I'm not going to play classic. I "won" the game when I learned almost everything there was to learn about the game.

[Acidbaron]

Compared to other mmo's out there mechanically shallow, hence its appeal to a wider audience beyond the warcraft IP.

[MyndZero]

It's shallow raid-wise, it's complex dungeon/leveling-wise.
It's shallow when it comes to boss abilities, it's average+ when it comes to player's stat (would be "complex" if there was more possibility to tweak the stat like in TBC, but not yet).

More than anything, it's immersive and meaningful (what you do in retail is usually either irrelevant, or mode irrelevant very quickly, while Vanilla had a much slower pace which made nearly everything you did relevant to the game).

I would say it's immensely more complex with players stats. First off, there is more stats, just period. Secondly, all the different types of stats and the ones that are good for your class factor a lot into what you use. In WoW nowadays and in BFA going forward, ilvl is king. This is not the case in vanilla, you could be running gear since before raids came out even while raiding, not because new loot hasn't dropped, but that the stat bonuses on that gear is just way better.

[Deleted]

More than anything, it's immersive and meaningful (what you do in retail is usually either irrelevant, or mode irrelevant very quickly, while Vanilla had a much slower pace which made nearly everything you did relevant to the game).

This largely sums up my view on the subject.

Clearly, today's game is substantially harder on an individual-performance basis. But the original World of Warcraft was a legitimate role-playing game, and I think the current version has lost that aspect.

[Kynario]

Let's just say that the complexity of vanilla wasn't in the gameplay.

But there was just so much stuff to explore and learn about the world, that's what made it complex and great.

Which is why I'm not going to play classic. I "won" the game when I learned almost everything there was to learn about the game.

All I really did was spam Frostbolt, that was pretty much it. One “core rotational” spell. Only when I played an sPriest did I play more of a complex rotation, admitting even with that I mostly just relied on DoTs + wand. I think the complexity definitely came from not understanding the game, getting into the lore, the sense of community within a realm, and exploring the immense world - which at the time blew my mind.

Otherwise, in my eyes, and modern-day standards, it couldn’t be more barebone. Of course, there are a few RPG elements that I’d like back in the game, but running on foot to level 40 in a world I’ve already explored and done all the quests in... not for me. But to each their own.

[Deleted]

Those who say that vanilla is shallow, then current WoW does not even exist because it features even less gameplay mechanics than vanilla - if you will say otherwise to this, it means you don't know what you are talking about and your opinion is invalid.

[Deleted]

I would say it's immensely more complex with players stats. First off, there is more stats, just period. Secondly, all the different types of stats and the ones that are good for your class factor a lot into what you use. In WoW nowadays and in BFA going forward, ilvl is king. This is not the case in vanilla, you could be running gear since before raids came out even while raiding, not because new loot hasn't dropped, but that the stat bonuses on that gear is just way better.

That is also called "bad itemization". Such as no "spellpower" on mage tier 1 set, so mages ran around with the Stratholme hat and other hodgepodge of gear.

[deniter]

The way i see it, current wow is a series of shallow pools of water. They are more in numbers than in vanilla, but they are not connected to each others in any way. In vanilla there were both shallow and deep pools of water, and they all formed a network that was connected with pipelines and canals.

[Deleted]

Title: Is Vanilla complex or shallow in your eyes?

To some, it’s a completely barebones and shallow version of the game, lacking many fundamental elements added on in the later expansions (like achievements, various QoL changes like the mount tab and autoloot etc). Basic kill quests, horrible itemization, simple boss-fights (mechanically) and so on...

To others, it’s an immensely complex game with long lost RPG elements.

People seem to be really divided on this. I wonder why.

What’s your thoughts?

Shallow and convoluted, with very poor class balancing and overtuned raid content.

[Khaza-R]

Mechanics were shallow

Class design was shallow

Character progression was much more complex

Shallow isn't always worst however. I actually prefer Vanilla's rather simple PvP

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Its the type of thing, to me, that people use to create arguements over what is better when in fact its just opinion. When really it is neither shallow or complex. It is just vanilla. If you like vanilla then you like vanilla. If you want something different you have something different. Only people with problems really worry about which is better and why.. on both sides..

[3DTyrant]

Looking back on it by today's version of WoW, it's very shallow.

[Deleted]

the only good thing in vanilla was the community aspect.