AU Xera!!! and AU exarch garrosh!!!

[Aucald]

What did the frostwolf orcs do wrong to Yrel? Nothing. But they stood in her way, so she had to deal with them. We all make our choices. The frostwolves chose pride over unity, and they paid for it. Yrel gave a choice, Grommash never did.

Now that Draenei is united under the High Exarch, the old cultural divisons have been destroyed, and Draenei and orcs are one in the Light, do you really think that future generations will label the annihilation of the frostwolves as an atrocity? No. It will only be considered as an unfortunate but necessary act to ensure an era of everlasting peace and serenity on Draenor.

As I understand the problem, AU Draenor is drying up or dying in some manner and both sides blame one-another for it, with no real conclusive proof as to who is responsible or why. Yrel and the Lightbound blame the Mag'har for doing *something* to be causing the issues, and Grommash blames Yrel and the Light for it. We're never actually shown who or what is responsible for what seems to be happening to their world.

That having been said, the fanaticism of the Draenei and their desire to forcibly "convert" unwilling Mag'har to the Light is detestable on the face of it - all conversions by the sword generally are. Just like Xe'ra's decision to try to detain Illidan and force the Light upon him, altering his destiny and taking from him his free will was detestable. The Light shouldn't be forced on anyone, and any agent of the Light who would be so zealous as to try and do so is an individual worthy of stopping.

[Rhlor]

if that happens can the horde get red eradar?

vulpera!!!!!

[Deleted]

AU Draenor is drying up or dying in some manner and both sides blame one-another for it

Most likely a result of Grommash burning and chopping the nature of Draenor to build his industrial war machine, and the vile Gul'dan single-handedly turning Tanaan Jungle into a toxic wasteland.

I fail to see how Yrel and her Draenei harmed Draenor in any way. Have you seen Shadowmoon Valley and Talador? Those places were pristine, pure, beautiful, they were paradise sanctified. Before the Iron Horde war machine, built upon industry (industry = bad for the world) started taining them too.

That having been said, the fanaticism of the Draenei and their desire to forcibly "convert" unwilling Mag'har to the Light is detestable on the face of it

You might consider it evil, but if Yrel manages to heal the world, and ensure generations of peace between Draenei and orcs, In the Light, will it still be evil? Or just an unfortunate event to forge good?

Remember, we are not talking about Death. The Light brings emotions of joy, serenity and harmony to those touched by it. Unlike undead, who are tormented by pain, suffering, and shame.

Just like Xe'ra's decision to try to detain Illidan and force the Light upon him, altering his destiny and taking from him his free will was detestable.

Xe'ra was misguided. She was granted visions of Illidan destroying the Legion under the guidance of the Light, so she believed that Illidan had to give in and embrace the Light, as the lives of trillions of innocents across the cosmos depended on it. The Light chooses one path and shuns all others as lies. As the Prime Naaru, Xe'ra was the greatest and most ancient embodiment of the Light in the cosmos. As a result, was Xe'ra truly evil, when that was just her nature? Was Xe'ra evil, for acting in what she thought were the cosmos' best interests?

Perhaps, if Illidan had done as the Prophecy of the Child of Light and Shadow demanded, the Age of Demons would have truly been ended, and now there would be peace across the cosmos. Instead, Illidan defied the prophecy and so the Age of Demons did not end (they are still a plight to all worlds), and Sargeras is merely imprisoned, bound to return and unleash his wrath on the cosmos, now greatly weakened with the fall of the Prime Naaru (the supreme ruler of the Golden Army).

Sacrifices had to be made. Illidan always imposed his will upon others, justifying his actiosn by saying that they were "necessary", and he had a hero's end. But then Xe'ra merely applied Illidan's same logic, and she is a villain?

Besides, Was it not detestable to watch Illidan sacrifice his own fellow arcanists for the "greater good" and enslave the innocent broken on Outland? Karma.

[KrakHed]

Hamfisted writing at best. Suddenly naaru are fanatic zealots who force the Light onto others? Lol ok

The Legion is gone. There's now power vacuum to exploit. If the Light doesn't do it first, someone else will.

[Rend Blackhand]

So many people missing the point, saying that the draenei are being good because orcs fought a war?

Ok lets do it this way:

-The Iron Horde did not manage to massacre shit loads of draenei like the original Horde. There were no bloodbaths at Karabor and Shattrath, the iron horde lost! Still thousands of draenei all over shadowmoon and Shattrath fell to the Sargeri that were inside the draenei the whole time.

-This scenario is 35 years after WoD, this means that a large chunk of all Orcs alive at the time were not alive during WoD and are therefore not responsible for any iron horde sutff.

Lastly, and most importantly, there is not a single NPC with any throwaway lines mentioning getting revenge for the WoD draenor war. The Lightbound and High Exarch Yrel ARE NOT seeking revenge, they are religious Light fanatics with a simple message for any Orc or Ogre: Convert or die.

They mention Orcs who have converted to the Light and how they force it upon others. This is why they are bad guys. They are forcing their religion upon people who do not want it and they are murdering any who resist.

[Rhlor]

AU Draenei was openly attacking and dragging orcs off to convert them, our LF draenei seem to be fond of war and not into "convert or die"

they do not seem to be against xera forcing illidan

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Yeah that would be especially hillarious.

I would like to be one more step in the evolution that the society of quelthalas is having to be more focused on the light and could create interesting discussions between them and the maghar

[Aucald]

Most likely a result of Grommash burning and chopping the nature of Draenor to build his industrial war machine, and the vile Gul'dan single-handedly turning Tanaan Jungle into a toxic wasteland.

War machine against whom? The Mag'har had no one left to war against at the resolution of WoD - though they're warring with the Lightbound now, the genesis of the conflict seems to predate that somehow. Gul'dan's corruption of Tanaan might be an issue, but what we see of the action in the recruitment scenario happens in Gorgrond.

I fail to see how Yrel and her Draenei harmed Draenor in any way. Have you seen Shadowmoon Valley and Talador? Those places were pristine, pure, beautiful, they were paradise sanctified. Before the Iron Horde war machine, build upon industry (industry = bad for the world) started taining them too.

I'm of a mind that neither party is ultimately responsible. I think the AU continuity, like all "false" timelines branching from the primary "real" timeline is simply collapsing into itself - whatever Garrosh and Kairoz did to harden that timeline into realness is fading, and the timeline itself is simply fading away and taking the world with it. Essentially, the Mag'har and the Lightbound are fighting over something neither party caused and neither can truly fix - escape from Draenor (as the Mag'har themselves did) is the only solution. If Yrel and her Lightbound don't also find a way to leave the collapsing timeline then they'll be swallowed up by it as well.

You might consider it evil, but if Yrel manages to heal the world, and ensure generations of peace between Draenei and orcs, In the Light, will it still be evil? Or just an unfortunate even to forge good?

Perhaps Yrel does mean to heal the world - but enforcing peace at sword-point is a flawed and short-term approach that only guarantees later opposition by those whose hands you've forced. Doubly so if you also try to strip a people of their free will in the process. Essential slavery is not a valid means to bring about a lasting peace, it only ensures the subjective peace of the slavers.

Remember, we are not talking about Death. The Light brings emotions of joy, serenity and harmony to those touched by it. Unlike undead, who are tormented by pain, suffering, and shame.

The Light is not the sole source of joy, serenity, or harmony - the Warcraft universe is a place of many powers seeking many things. Some good, some evil, some indifferent, and some altogether strange.

Xe'ra was misguided. She was granted visions of Illidan destroying the Legion under the guidance of the Light, so she believed that Illidan had to give in and embrace the Light, as the lives of trillions of innocents across the cosmos depended on it. The Light chooses one path and shuns all others as lies. As the Prime Naaru, Xe'ra was the greatest and most ancient embodiement of the Light. As a result, was Xe'ra truly evil, when that was just her nature? Was Xe'ra evil, for acting in what she thought was the cosmos' best interests?

Refusing to accept Illidan's own decision, his own choice about the way he wished to live his life, and trying to force her version of what was right unto him despite his objections is pretty much an active evil. Xe'ra's "nature" isn't really an issue in this equation - her actions make her no different than someone like Gul'dan forcing Fel infusion on another person against their will. I also truly doubt having powerful individuals enslaved to the Light would ever be in the cosmos' best interests.

Perhaps, if Illidan had done as the Prophecy of the Child of Light and Shadow demanded, the Age of Demons would have truly been ended, and now there would be peace across the cosmos. Instead, Illidan defied the prophecy. and so the Age of Demons did not end (they are still a plight to all worlds), and Sargeras is merely imprisoned, bound to return and unleash his wrath on the cosmos, now greatly weakened with the fall of the Prime Naaru (the supreme ruler of the Golden Army).

Impossible to say, really. Sargeras could be sealed away for all time, he could escape, he could theoretically be redeemed by his brethren and re-enter the universe as a force of good. We don't know what we don't know.

Besides, Was it not detestable to watch Illidan sacrifice his own fellow arcanists for the "greater good" and enslave the innocent broken on Outland? Karma.

Indeed it was - but that does not make it right to have it done to Illidan either. "Karma" isn't an axiomatic reaction of the universe that makes an individual suffer the ills they enact on others, it is the weight or burden of their actions that decides their ultimate fate. In Illidan's case, said fate is to be trapped in the Seat of the Pantheon and contend with Sargeras forever. Xe'ra's actions on Argus are just as detestable as Illidan's were during the War of the Ancients - even if they were intended for the greater good they were still detestable.

[Deleted]

Finally, Velen, Samaara, Maraad, Ga'nar, Ner'zhul, the innocent people of Karabor, Shattrath City, Tuurem, Embaari Village, Teluuna Observatory, Temple of Sha'naar, Nethergarde Keep and Okri'lon Hold have all been avanged. They can rest in peace now, knowing that the monster who ruined their lives has paid for his countless atrocities.

On behalf of everyone who has suffered at the hands of Grommash Hellscream, Thank you, Yrel, and thank you, Xe'ra. Justice is scarce in the cruel world of Warcraft, but this time, justice has been done.

What kind of justice is that, to punish people from an alternative universe for deeds of the other universe? This is bullshit. It's like you being executed because some of your distant relatives had committed a crime.

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vulpera!!!!!

I would rather have red eredar. They are kinky. :3

[Rhlor]

What kind of justice is that, to punish people from an alternative universe for deeds of the other universe? This is bullshit. It's like you being executed because some of your distant relatives had committed a crime.

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I would rather have red eredar. They are kinky. :3

vulpera for ever!

[Gramlen]

You might consider it evil, but if Yrel manages to heal the world, and ensure generations of peace between Draenei and orcs, In the Light, will it still be evil? Or just an unfortunate event to forge good?


Xe'ra was misguided. She was granted visions of Illidan destroying the Legion under the guidance of the Light, so she believed that Illidan had to give in and embrace the Light, as the lives of trillions of innocents across the cosmos depended on it. The Light chooses one path and shuns all others as lies. As the Prime Naaru, Xe'ra was the greatest and most ancient embodiment of the Light in the cosmos. As a result, was Xe'ra truly evil, when that was just her nature? Was Xe'ra evil, for acting in what she thought were the cosmos' best interest?

It's interesting how you can replace 'Yrel' and 'X'era' with 'Sargeras' and the reasoning barely changes.

The only difference between the Lightbound Orcs and the Orcish Horde is that a Naaru didn't bleed to put them in chains.

[Phantombeard]

Lightforged Garrosh seems... ridiculous to me.

But I don't know that these Lightforged are really heroes in any capacity. They're on a holy crusade, more like what X'era tried to do to subjugate Illidan on Argus than anything else. They're definitely the bad guys here lol, zealotry of the Light is just as dangerous as zealotry of the Void.

That being said, it's really interesting storytelling and I REALLY hope we see more of it.

Illidan stormrage is a abomination. He had his pure elf DNA manipulated and corrupted by fel and was given the chance to make whole again and didn't. He chose darkness over light. He should be discarded as the filth he is.

[Vonazak]

Don't allies consistently tell Orcs that off-world invaders can't make good territorial claims?

I am 100% horde, but also i like crusades and Yrel yelling "lux vult" and smashing heretics heads whule riding a gundam warframe its a big turn on for me

[Rhlor]

the territorial claims are stupid.

with that logic Nzoth is the true ruler of azertoh

[Poppets]

The territorial claims are even more stupid when people claim the Orcs ruined Draenei lands. Lol. The Draenei even took over the nicest areas of Draenor.

Also weren’t the Trolls and Aqir the first natural inhabitants of Azeroth?

[Velshin]

What did the frostwolf orcs do wrong to Yrel? Nothing. But they stood in her way, so she had to deal with them. We all make our choices. The frostwolves chose pride over unity, and they paid for it. Yrel gave a choice, Grommash never did.

Now that the continent of Draenor is united under the High Exarch, the old cultural divisons have been destroyed, and Draenei and orcs are one in the Light, do you really think that future generations will label the annihilation of the frostwolves as an atrocity? No. It will only be considered as an unfortunate but necessary act to ensure an era of everlasting peace and serenity on Draenor.

They never stood in her way they just refused to blindly follow the light. Is that wrong?

I can understand if Yrel had some grudges toward Grommash and his former Iron Horde but the Frostwolves? yeah there is no justifying that sorry I know you are fan of her but still what she did is so wrong and no one can deny that surely not even you her fan right?

[Hallowseve17]

I assume that Yrel controls all of Draenor now. She already had Shadowmoon Valley and Talador under her command, but now that she defeated the mag'har (and gained the trust of many), the botani and the ogron, Gorgrond, Frostfire Ridge, Tanaan Jungle and Nagrand should also be hers to command (I am sure that whatever is left of the leaderless Gorian Empire poses no threat to her). Which would leave only the Spires of Arak. But since the Arakkoa are fierce enemies of the orcs, and revere the sun and its light, an alliance between Yrel and the Arakkoa is very likely to have happened off-screen.

Honestly, Yrel is superbly amazing. From a nameless slave, to the ruler of an entire continent. And in just 30 years!

Nah, Yrel's gone so crazy that even the botani and saberon got the hell out of dodge and came to Azeroth. She controls nothing but her Lightbound draenei and orc puppets.

[LazarusLong]

Really. Remember when the Naaru were essentially just vulnerable fairy-esque creatures that were considered innocent and easy to exploit? Now they have motives and goals, incredibly lame and terrible.

It seems that a lot of the youngsters didn't watch Babylon 5. Naaru is basically The Vorlon.

[Vincell]

Illidan stormrage is a abomination. He had his pure elf DNA manipulated and corrupted by fel and was given the chance to make whole again and didn't. He chose darkness over light. He should be discarded as the filth he is.

Sure, maybe. But Blizzard is very much making it clear that the Light is not "pure good" anymore than the Void is "pure evil." They have decided that's the story they wanted to tell.

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Sounds to me like you're a fucking heretic.

Also friend:

No u

[Ashnazg]

Nah, Yrel's gone so crazy that even the botani and saberon got the hell out of dodge and came to Azeroth. She controls nothing but her Lightbound draenei and orc puppets.

Just leaving this out there:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvffWwNXnPs

Yrel in all her glory, purging heretics.

[Rhlor]

Just leaving this out there:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvffWwNXnPs

Yrel in all her glory, purging heretics.

Xera vult hahaha