G'huun complaints incoming

[Gaidax]

G'huun Normal is quite surely overtuned. First of all coordination required is IMO more than should be expected at such difficulty.

[Varolyn]

Just look at previous raids, hundreds of guilds clear entire heroics on the first day previously.

It wasn't like that for HFC and BRF though, and even SoO. Those raids it actually took a fair amount of time for guilds to clear heroic, even if some guilds were stalling on Arch to get split runs in. In fact i'm kind of glad were getting a more challenging end boss for the first raid as Xavius was a joke and disappointment.

[DaHomieG]

So first yall was complaining that dungeons/raids are too easy and you want more BC/WotLK-esque difficulty. Now that they ramped up the difficulty and actually made boss fights challenging you guys are complaining that it's too hard? So what the fuck do you guys want at this point? No wonder Blizzard is tired of you motherfuckers seriously yall cant make up your minds it's pathetic.

[Toisha]

So first yall was complaining that dungeons/raids are too easy and you want more BC/WotLK-esque difficulty. Now that they ramped up the difficulty and actually made boss fights challenging you guys are complaining that it's too hard? So what the fuck do you guys want at this point? No wonder Blizzard is tired of you motherfuckers seriously yall cant make up your minds it's pathetic.

Sounds to me that LFR was designed specifically for these people. Normal too hard: Go down to LFR.
If they removed LFR, these people would complain that they never get to see the content because it's too hard.

[Tech614]

I don't think it works like that on live. We tried it and it didn't work (the person with the debuff could not "catch" the ball). As far as I know the 5 min debuff is applied once the orb you are interacting with reaches the basket. So a pair can pass back and forth on the current ball, but once you have the debuff that you are out of commission for helping.

If it doesn't work like that on live then it's a bug/oversight.

The fight would almost be impossible on 10 man, and yea there have been encounters that are really hard with only 10 in the flex era but not almost literally impossible. Sure maybe some really good players could prob eventually figure it out and get it down anyways, but that's not the kind of players lower raid sizes are targeted at anyways.

[Osmeric]

Sounds to me that LFR was designed specifically for these people. Normal too hard: Go down to LFR.

They tried that before. It doesn't work. LFR is not a good experience for F&F guilds. That's why Flex (now called Normal) was introduced.

[Deleted]

G'huun Normal is quite surely overtuned. First of all coordination required is IMO more than should be expected at such difficulty.

Finally it is no longer enter raid, receive loot difficulty.

[Jastall]

It feels like a Heroic boss in a Normal disguise. Our 30 man raid smashed everything before him with one wipe on Mythrax due to a sphere hitting like 10 people at some point. The slug forced us to downsize the group because doing it with 22 raiders and 8 socials was a total clusterfuck. We absolutely didn't have to do this with N Archimonde, Gul'dan, KJ or Argus. He's vastly harder than anything leading up to him, by an order of magnitude rarely seen in Normal bosses.

Of course, once we only had raiders he died easily, but this is not a very pug friendly boss at all, and normal is supposed to be pug friendly. I'd personally just lower Blood Plague's damage on Normal and make the Blood Feast add a bit less deadly. And I predict that the Power Matrix mechanic will be as much of a pain in the ass as Blackfuse's conveyor belt was in pugs.

[Saverem]

Fight is quite unforgiving, even on normal mode. I see a lot of complaining in the future over it, for the groups that manage to squeak by MOTHER and Mythrax. I suppose after xavius I was expecting a bit more of an easy road, but they cranked that difficulty dial quite a bit higher for an intro raid.

I'd be very surprised if it doesn't get nerfed by next reset. N is supposed to be scrub friendly, and there are literally top 100 guilds wiping on him.

[GreenJesus]

I want to remind you that Normal mode is intended to be tuned for Friends and Family guilds, where you are expected to progress, but also expected to not have to bench your friends or family. They tried making LFR be for F&F guilds in MoP and it did not work. Tuning up Normal a tad at the start of WoD also failed.

Don't worry it will be a lot easier when people get welfare epics and titanforges. Family and friends guilds aren't supposed to finish normal day one.

[prwraith]

It feels wrong the level of coordination needed for G'Huun on normal. It would be one thing if only the initial ball carrier got the Debuff. But everyone in that ball carrying chain (let's say 2 people minimum, 3 people max) gets the debuff? And you have to do this how many times?

that's obnoxious.

There are quite literally mythic raid fights that require LESS coordination than G'Huun. I'm fine with the challenge, and we'll down it but I hardly expect your average normal guild to pull this shit off. Hell we steamrolled the whole instance on opening night except this boss. It's CLEARLY overtuned.

Disclaimer: I'm not asking for a nerf, WE can do it. But I hardly expect a normal guild to pull this off.

[Soluna]

So first yall was complaining that dungeons/raids are too easy and you want more BC/WotLK-esque difficulty. Now that they ramped up the difficulty and actually made boss fights challenging you guys are complaining that it's too hard? So what the fuck do you guys want at this point? No wonder Blizzard is tired of you motherfuckers seriously yall cant make up your minds it's pathetic.

Imagine if it's not the same people who complain about these things. I know, it must be mind blowing for you...

[Deleted]

oh no, challenging content, sounds horrible, this is the all fun removed xpac, challenging content can be considered fun, we cant allow this

[Jastall]

G'huun isn't an Old God

Technically no, but for all actual intents and purposes he is. He spreads his influence in a similar way, seeks to corrupt the world as they do, and is served by at least one C'thraxxi who traditionally serve Old Gods. His fight is obviously designed as a call back to Old Gods, what with tentacles everywhere or the Gaze of G'huun that he stole from Yogg.

[prwraith]

oh no, challenging content, sounds horrible, this is the all fun removed xpac, challenging content can be considered fun, we cant allow this

You are, misunderstanding the concern. And contributing nothing.

[Beet]

I want to remind you that Normal mode is intended to be tuned for Friends and Family guilds, where you are expected to progress, but also expected to not have to bench your friends or family. They tried making LFR be for F&F guilds in MoP and it did not work. Tuning up Normal a tad at the start of WoD also failed.

And does that mean the raids need to be so easy they’re clearable in one day? Because her sure wouldn’t be fun for me if I still raided in a friends and family guild. Which I used to back in Cata when they first introduced ten mans. It’s nice to have a few weeks at least of something to work towards.

[prwraith]

And does that mean the raids need to be so easy they’re clearable in one day? Because her sure wouldn’t be fun for me if I still raided in a friends and family guild. Which I used to back in Cata when they first introduced ten mans. It’s nice to have a few weeks at least of something to work towards.

Difficulty is fine, but you can hardly say it's not overturned when guilds who routinely clear mythic steamroll an entire instance only to wipe on G'huun repeatedly due to mythic level mechanics...in a normal.

Again can we kill it? Yes and we will. Can an average guild? No. You should not need to be a mythic level raider to finish a normal raid. That's a clear tuning problem.

It all comes down to that ball debuff, if it worked as it did on Beta it would be fine. But putting a 5 minute debuff on carriers, so you effectively need something like 6-8 special teams of people to navigate this area per fight is a little much for normal.

[kamuimac]

So first yall was complaining that dungeons/raids are too easy and you want more BC/WotLK-esque difficulty. Now that they ramped up the difficulty and actually made boss fights challenging you guys are complaining that it's too hard? So what the fuck do you guys want at this point? No wonder Blizzard is tired of you motherfuckers seriously yall cant make up your minds it's pathetic.

2 completly different crowds.

1st is mythic raiders who live and breath with wow and lets be honest - anything is extremly trivial for them

2nd people who will come crying here in 2 max 3 days saying how blizzard severly overtuned normal and mythic + and that there is no point being subbed in such overtuned content.

blizzard as always made mistake listening to first crowd and it will end in disaster and milions leaving game - thats why they are desperate and you can see it with them already putting free 340 catch up gear on week 4 of expansion and speeding up warfronts progress for fractions (free 370 gear).

[AmilAsphoron]

Traditionally, the last boss of normal is slightly harder than the first boss of heroic. G’huun is wayyyyy harder, which is okay for me, but maybe not what others were expecting or want. I do think that the G’huun is a poorly designed flexible encounter though. It is incredibly more difficult with a smaller raid than a big one and the mechanics are definitely based on the Mythic 20man size.

[kamuimac]

Difficulty is fine, but you can hardly say it's not overturned when guilds who routinely clear mythic steamroll an entire instance only to wipe on G'huun repeatedly due to mythic level mechanics...in a normal.

Again can we kill it? Yes and we will. Can an average guild? No. You should not need to be a mythic level raider to finish a normal raid. That's a clear tuning problem.

It all comes down to that ball debuff, if it worked as it did on Beta it would be fine. But putting a 5 minute debuff on carriers, so you effectively need something like 6-8 special teams of people to navigate this area per fight is a little much for normal.

what is so annoying is its so painfully obvious what they should have done on normal - dont put that debuff. nobody would complain and 2 competent people could carry the raid then.

and i bet you right now they will remove this debuff by the end of this reset from normal because it has no place in content for casual crowd.