Why are people so much against basic balance changes?

[Deathknightish]

People really throw a hissy fit when you suggest making specs like feral, balance, retribution, shadow etc. more balanced than the non-existing meme specs that they were back then.

I used to play a druid in Vanilla, and there wasn't any doubt about it, feral plain out sucked. I strongly remember doing about 60-80 DPS in Molten Core, while pure damage dealers did 2-400 at the start. It just wasn't competitive at all, neither was balance, which didn't have Moonkin form until 1.12 (?)

Why are people so against making all terrible specs viable? Not top of the top. Viable, acceptable.

Lets pretend that Blizzard never released any expansions. Do you think they still wouldn't aim for balance changes, even after 1.12, to make everything enjoyable and playable?

I honestly wouldn't mind balance changes, as long as everything still fit within Vanilla rules. Just tweak the numbers a little, don't add any new skills or anything, just a flat increase on whatever needs it to make every spec viable.

[NihilSustinet]

Honestly i dont even care at this point. with launching at 1.12 they have already killed any chance of having anything close to an authentic vanilla experience. Might asll well balance all the classes, put in LFR, make it BFA with vanilla content for all i care.

[Echocho]

They are probably DPS Warriors all of them :P
Other changes they're fine with like bigger servers and dynamic respawns which is a bit hypocritical imo.

[seleri]

Because then it isn't classic. Once you start tweaking numbers, it ripples out. The only change to Classic WoW should be the addition of battle.net chat, and even then I hope they make it so you can't talk to people that are playing on the opposite faction on Classic.

[Lolsteak]

Because that's not what Vanilla was, What's up with you people trying to hijack this for some "Classic Lite" abomination?

[Molis]

I want the people clamoring for Vanilla to live through all the pain from Vanilla.

Every shitty spec
Every hour farming Black Lotus
Every day farming for a mount.

[Kralljin]

Fixing the dps issue would require fixing the mana issue for most hybrids.

You could have bury those solutions deep down in tree to block potential hybrid builds, even then, a healer that does not oom as hard as a regular healer might be simply more valueable than a "true healer".

Then you would have to take a look at the numbers, the potential hybrid builds, certain set bonus impacts and so forth, Vanilla had a lots of nooks and crannies to squeeze out dps.

If a 5% buff to LB / Wrath / Starfire / SW:P / Mind flay would solve those issues, i wouldn't care, but the issues are simply not number related.

You would also have to discuss what kind dps dicrepancies are acceptable, which aren't and so forth.

[Deficineiron]

the short version is almost no one trusts blizzard to do the most subtle fix/tweak possible to address an issue. they (we) expect blizzard to come in with a chainsaw and their retail notions and butcher the classes.

someone (vaelorian?) posted a list of very subtle fixes for ret paladins. It was all minor number stuff mainly in talents that in aggregate would make them a lot more viable and iirc fix the oom issue. it is unthinkable to me that blizzard would ever settle on so subtle a solution.

[Craaazyyy]

im not against it

but the thing is, if they were to make some kind of changes they will most likely fuck everything up, cuz its Blizzard, they always find a way to fuck things up

[Saft]

I want Classic to be as untainted as possible but I would at the very least accept some tuning to get more classes and specs on par with others. If they start actively changing spells' functionality, move around talents which some classes admittedly need I believe the line has been crossed and anything becomes subject to change.

[Sastank]

Vanilla wasn't balanced. Balancing things changes the experience. People want Classic to experience Vanilla was it once was. See the problem with balance now?

[Deleted]

Becouse change will always trigger another change? When you balance class you also have to rebalance raids, dungeons, world, pvp. When you balance this suddenly you have to look at all other specs and cyrcle continues. And after few monhts here we are with classic LFR. So no thanks. And btw this myth about useless specs is really just myth. You can play w/e you want. Hell most players will never get into raids anyway so playing different spec in world, dungeons and pvp is totaly viable.

[crusadernero]

Fix nothing. If people want the true feeling of classic, Blizzard should give them just that.

And BTW - balance? wow has never truly been balanced between classes :P

[Deleted]

Honestly i dont even care at this point. with launching at 1.12 they have already killed any chance of having anything close to an authentic vanilla experience. Might asll well balance all the classes, put in LFR, make it BFA with vanilla content for all i care.

Yeah lets have druids completely and utterly useless by starting with 1.0. Let's have talents that make you fall slower or turn you into a goldfish. 1.0 literally had talents like this you know.

At least with the 1.12 we have the best AUTHENTIC patch for balance. You're just another doomsayer that has no clue what the best thing to do is. In all honesty 1.12 is the best option for vanilla because classes were authentically "balanced".

[AwkwardSquirtle]

From what I can gather, it's because specs aren't how the game worked in Classic. You weren't a Demonology warlock, you were a Warlock. Specialisation meant what it says-you could specialise a bit into an area, but it wasn't a sub-class like it is now.
Looking at Demo as an example, the concept of a demonology warlock is meaningless, since it has no offensive spells. The tree buffs your demonology spells, but that's just your stones and demons. If you put all of your talent points into demonology, every spell you cast during the fight would be destruction or affliction unless your pet died.

[zoddzero]

The only change Classic really needs is the introduction of Dual Talent Specialization. The balancing can be saved for TBC servers.

[Deficineiron]

The only change Classic really needs is the introduction of Dual Talent Specialization. The balancing can be saved for TBC servers.

for someone who liked to play around with different specs, the respec cost became a game-dominating issue pretty quickly. this is one of those issues I think there is no question blizzard will modify.

it is one of the few changes I would argue actually improves gameplay, though it is a qol in the sense that you no longer spend time farming or doing whatever for gold to try that next iteration of a spec idea.

[Deleted]

because vanilla wasnt balanced. These days balance means everyone is close to each other in damage/healing. In vanilla other classes brought the damage while some others brought something else. Sure some of the specs brought close to nothing but everyone still had their place in something.

[thebryan]

Honestly i dont even care at this point. with launching at 1.12 they have already killed any chance of having anything close to an authentic vanilla experience. Might asll well balance all the classes, put in LFR, make it BFA with vanilla content for all i care.

That seems like a over reaction doesn't it?

[TJ]

Honestly i dont even care at this point. with launching at 1.12 they have already killed any chance of having anything close to an authentic vanilla experience. Might asll well balance all the classes, put in LFR, make it BFA with vanilla content for all i care.

No they haven't, stop overreacting.