[Megathread] Fallout 76

[Eleccybubb]

Holotapes is just fucking lazy.

It's literally journals that have been in games like these for years. Both written and spoken.

I don't get how that's better than having NPCs to engage with.

A good game would have journals and NPCs to interact with.

- - - Updated - - -

So...did anyone watch that dank memeage on the livestream? Saw a handful of clips and holy hell did Bethesda waste a lot of money on one of the cringiest marketing stunts I've seen in a while.

Friend at my house was watching it.

From what I could hear from my room I almost threw up.

[Nerovar]

People actually care about this shit game?

[Reinaerd]

Gaming as a service in order to shovel mini transactions and payed "mods". All whilest at the same time delivering an empty boring world,
full of repetative "find person who will be lying there dead on the floor and play his holotape"
rinse and repeat shite with the occasional radiant quest shat into it.
running on an engine so old is technically a geriatric and will dribble of your harddrive at 28FPS on a titan1080TI.

changing a single line client side of a text file allows you to speedhack, so you know shit's valid, unencrypted ftw.


Also fuck tod howard, and all the autistic bags of human suck that think he's the next best thing since sliced bread.

[Deleted]

So...did anyone watch that dank memeage on the livestream? Saw a handful of clips and holy hell did Bethesda waste a lot of money on one of the cringiest marketing stunts I've seen in a while.

I avoided it because of Rick and Morty. Being that it had to do with Rick and Morty, I fully expect it was cringy as hell. Ninja obviously didn't help either.

this shit game

Also fuck tod howard, and all the autistic bags of human suck

I guess these are more examples of that "constructive negative feedback" that we're supposed to take seriously. You'd think there'd be some rules against posting comments like these.

[Endus]

But I mean, of course people are going to call downloading the entire game client three, four, five days in advance (before physical copies are even delivered mind you), a "day one patch", just because some shitty blog rag posted an uninformed blog article about it.

Oh, and of course pointing out facts and reality makes me a "fanboi" and a "shill". Obviously.

Not to mention the whole "bigger than the base game" nonsense, which is thoroughly unsurprising if the Beta had content that was not included, particularly ATOM shop purchases (which seemed really thin, and this is a big reason I didn't spend any during the beta).

The 54GB is the base game.

[Reinaerd]

I avoided it because of Rick and Morty. Being that it had to do with Rick and Morty, I fully expect it was cringy as hell. Ninja obviously didn't help either.




I guess these are more examples of that "constructive negative feedback" that we're supposed to take seriously. You'd think there'd be some rules against posting comments like these.

no rules against being a giant pussy either, or you'd be banned for life.

Oh and the reason for the "fuck tod howard" he's primadonna upper-manager larping as a petite rock-star.
He's like jobs, only he had the common decency to stick to herbal tea and croak.

Post constructively. -Infracted. Lucetia

[Gurluas]

I for one actually enjoyed the game.
Joining the Enclave was pretty awesome. If you create a character, and get immersed as that character in the setting you'll have an authentic Fallout experience.
The lack of dialogue is annoying but you get over it, and the story is designed so your character's feelings aren't ignored. Plus it's fun to build your own base.

[Endus]

Here's my argument if you are so confident I don't have one;

- Lack of NPC's and meaningful story - in a FALLOUT (a long standed rpg title) game takes away one of the most interesting parts of the fallout universe. The world, the world and the environments that we know from fallout might still exist, but without people and stories you directly influence within that world - it just feels dead. You can't choose to help people, or hinder them. You can't find new people and stories, find interesting new characters etc, core parts of that fallout experience is just gone. So it's not an RPG.

There are plenty of NPCs, and plenty of story. You're just objectively incorrect on this. You might not like the story, but that's a subjective preference on your part, not an objective flaw in the game, and you need to stop pretending otherwise.

Also, you're defining "RPG" incorrectly. A great many highly-regarded RPGs have had negligible to zero capacity for the player to meaningfully affect the story. That's not what the term is about.

- PVP is optional - many people try to justify the fact it's not an rpg anymore by saying it's a survival game now, but what's the point of a survival game? You gear up, build a base, get supplies - reinforce yourself. Why? To defend against other players. NPC's are very early diminished as a threat, once you've established yourself the real threat is other players, look at games like rust for example. So if you can completely ignore other players, what even is the point in gearing up and trying to survive - if the biggest threat in the game (other players) isn't really a threat at all. So it's not a survival game.

And? It never claimed to be. It claimed to be a multiplayer Fallout with some mild survival components and occasional, optional PVP. Blaming the game for not fitting a genre it never, ever claimed to be is just . . . ridiculous.

Fallout games are great for their really unique settings, themes, characters and stories - but fallout 76 has barely any of that. The fact the world is dead empty aside from enemies and players just feels like everything you do has no substance - what is the point? Where is the satisfaction meant to come from? What's the start point? How do you finish? After the novelty of running around picking up loot you've seen before (since nearly all of the weapons etc were from fallout 4) with your pals runs out (and trust me - it will) - what is the point in fallout 76? It's a non-game, it's insulting this is what a AAA studio comes up with and expects people to pay money for. It's a joke.

Are you seriously trying to claim that because Fallout has no engaging infinite endgame, it's a "non-game"? Literally no Fallout game has offered that. It wasn't offered, here. It's a crazy thing to blame the game for not containing.

Also, "nearly all the weapons were from Fallout 4"? Most of those were from Fallout 3. And most of those were from Fallout 2. You've identified that it's part of a series and is sticking with its setting, and somehow that's bad?

And another thing. The interface system from fallout works fine in a single player setting - since, y'know - you can freeze the game at will. Can't do that in a multiplayer game. Plus you have the watered down version of vats that's just aimbot and really boring. Everything about this game is so meh or just flat out bad. It's insane a game like fallout 76, and a game like red dead redemption 2 can both be considered AAA titles when one may as well have been made by an indie team it's that sub-par.

The interface works just fine. More engaging now that it doesn't pause time magically, if anything. You need to be sure the area's clear before hacking or picking a lock. You can't rely on VATS as a pause button which makes you effectively invincible.

The VATS isn't "watered down". You need a perk to target limbs, is all, and there's no slowdown component, which makes it more complex and challenging to use, not less.

Plus you have the whole host of server problems. The problems just never seem to end with this game do they?

The server problems, in the beta, which they expressly said they would be stress-testing the servers in, which might cause outages?

Mmkay.

Expect that’s a matter of opinion, I as many others have played the game and didn’t find it engaging at all, it’s a search that you know that you’ll fail from the very start, since, we know there ain’t human NPCs, on top of it,

This isn't a problem with the game. This is a problem with your metaknowledge, due to one offhand comment by the devs.

[Reinaerd]

Pipe guns , homemade guns are fallout 4 only, and those are the ones most commonly seen.
kill 8 mutants, loot 1cap 1 hunting rifle 5 ammo, weird eyeball, exact same amount of every single mutant.
it's lazy, its boring, it is extremely repetative.


It's a cashgrab, on an ancient engine, because gaming as a service has been proven to be a cashcow, not to mention all the ingame shit you can sell for real life cash to the idiots whom the PR is tailored to.

Also its bethesda, none of their FO / Morrowind games have ever functioned properly without modder intervention.

same for the 76 version, widescreen fixes thanks to modders.

And ive purchased prett much every bethesda game, because the story made up for the flaws
( well untill fo4 that was a dumpsterfire )
and my gaming started with the purchase of the very first fallout. So yeah, to watch them milk it, like blizz does with diablo, kinda leaves a sour taste.

[dope_danny]

Holotapes is just fucking lazy.

It's literally journals that have been in games like these for years. Both written and spoken.

I don't get how that's better than having NPCs to engage with.

I always remember back in uni while getting my degree the film prof surprised us by whipping out an xbox 360 to load up bioshock as "one of the ways plebians need to be told rather than shown like children", which seemed a bit harsh, but he highlighted a scene in bioshock everyone whos played it knows. A broken 'new years 1959' sign barely hangs over a scene of long concluded chaos. furtniture upturned, a dead body in the corner, bullet holes and blood everywhere and more.

Then you pick up a 1950's magic holotape bunkum piece where a character says she is alone on new years and oh no, someone went crazy and the party ended in violence.

Then the professor said "if you dont think your audience can tell that from the mise-en-scene, the entirety of the scene around them either you think they are dumb as a box of rocks or the writer is. Its had its effective moments like Resident Evils itchy tasty but by and large a lot of games only use notes because of bad writing like a support frame because on its own the main story would fall apart under the slightest scrutiny.

Making the entire story holotapes? well thats a new one.

[Puzzony]

Even if we look over the 'interesting' storytelling, the archaic duct tape engine, and the obvious imbalances in the gameplay (not to mention that cringeworthy menu system), the game still suffers from critical issues, like no anticheat and file verification, and they have said they will fix it sometime AFTER launch...
For a game like this, even a week is more than enough to be utterly destroyed by 'hackers' (can't even call the modifications hacks because that would imply you have to bypass some kind of defence to change your stats).
Also as it turned out, there are some people who have completed the main story during the few beta hours, and launched some nukes, and they are in full X01 set, so they werent even rushing naked and with a pipe pistol.

[Deleted]

For a game like this, even a week is more than enough to be utterly destroyed by 'hackers'

That might actually be true, and it's absolutely a valid concern. After all, we know full well that for example Rockstar couldn't do anything about hackers, GTA:O was ruined within the first five minutes it went live, and they've been completely incapable of doing anything about the situation in the past five years. The only saving grace RD:O has is that it's a console exclusive, so perhaps that will stop hackers from ruining it, as well.

As such, we can surely hope that Bethesda tries to do something about the bigger hacks in the game. One good thing about Fallout 76 as far as hacks go though is that you can just block a person, then even do a relog, and not have to put up with their shit any longer.

But, as said, it's absolutely a valid concern. We'll see how it goes.

[Endus]

Making the entire story holotapes? well thats a new one.

You apparently completely missed your professor's point.

"Show, don't tell" is a major component of fiction-writing. He was criticizing the writing of that particular tape, and pointing out that the atmospheric storytelling had already communicated that it was New Years and something went "bad". The tape repeating that particular bit of information is treating the player like an unobservant moron.

It isn't a statement against all such communication. That would require giving up all forms of dialogue or written communication, which is clearly ridiculous.

The point was about the content, not the medium.

[Puupi]

Is this Inception?

Endus being dope_danny's holotape.

[dope_danny]

You apparently completely missed your professor's point.

"Show, don't tell" is a major component of fiction-writing. He was criticizing the writing of that particular tape, and pointing out that the atmospheric storytelling had already communicated that it was New Years and something went "bad". The tape repeating that particular bit of information is treating the player like an unobservant moron.

It isn't a statement against all such communication. That would require giving up all forms of dialogue or written communication, which is clearly ridiculous.

The point was about the content, not the medium.

In other games maybe. In Fallout? 9 times out of 10 its

Holotape in ruined building full of ghouls: "boy the nukes sucked, oh people are ghouls now" which you are experiencing in the environment before reaching the tape.
Holotape in a shopping center full of raiders: "This place was nice, then raiders took over" which you are experiencing in the environment before reaching the tape.
Holotape in a vault: "This place seemed okay at first but was a dodgy experiment" which you are experiencing in the environment before reaching the tape.

I get you made it real clear this game is a strange 'down with the ship' and 'purge the nonebelievers' scenario for you for some reason but maybe fallouts holotapes ARE by and large lazy attempts at worldbuilding that just state the obvious and making them a replacement for npcs IS kind of a detrimental design choice when it wasn't a strong point in the fallout games WITH a full world of characters.

Were it the Elder Scrolls sure, a series where history is more than "war, then nukes nothing before it really matters" thats such a small period of time in comparison and there are hundreds of ingame novellas to describe religions, cultures and personal character histories? yeah sure. But holotapes in fallout has always been bad writing that treats the player like a fucking idiot. You cannot expect that to support a story alone. The best case is always telling you what you already know or just adding exposition to tell you things that happened that you missed and then you may as well play a walking sim like Soma.

[Deleted]

I get you made it real clear this game is a strange 'down with the ship' and 'purge the nonebelievers' scenario for you for some reason

What is strange is that people think there's some ship going down anywhere. Call it an echo chamber or a circlejerk all you like but all you need to do is pop by at r/fo76 and you'll find tons and tons and tons of people who can't wait to play the game, who are enthusiastic as hell to play it, after having played the beta. If there are tons and tons and tons of people who want to play this game, then who cares if there are also tons and tons and tons who don't (and, I don't think there are); even if it divides the playerbase in half, that's still half of the people who want to play it and who love it. Personally, I'll just wait to see some sales numbers before saying anything about how popular it will be beyond that. Also, if you want a different kind of circlejerk, or a circle full of jerks, you can go to r/fallout, and you'll find all the people pining over New Vegas 2 there, being bitter about anything and everything else.

Also, as far as "purge the nonbelievers" goes, man wouldn't it be nice if people who don't want this game stopped trying to do that in a thread for the game?

[unholytestament]

I had to laugh when I was essentially being taught how to make a decent camp with decent defenses by the audio logs of a guy who died because he failed to build a decent camp with decent defenses.

And then there's the superhero overseer we're following around who apparently has traveled the whole breadth of West Virginia in the few hours we slept in and was kind enough to leave audio logs about her trip and her pre-vault past along the way, most in their own Vault-Tec audio log cases that could probably hold dozens of logs but only has one each time you come across them.

I pre-ordered the game. I played the beta. I had a lot of fun. I plan to continue playing upon release. The writing in this game is still REALLY bad.

[For_The_Horde]

Whats all this huff about no human npcs being a bad thing. Take off those rose-colored glasses and try to actually remember Fallout 3 and 4, try to remember the friendly human npcs. They didn't add as much to the story as you think they did, there were only 6-7 locations with meaningful friendly npcs, and most of the time you just skipped their dialogue and tried to shake them down (speechcheck) for extra caps. Plus all they had you do were simple quests like "go kill our neighbors" or "find me the mcguffin" or "this settlement needs your help, let me mark it on your map". Occasionally you fought in a conflict where you had to choose a side, but all sides are always equally horrible in their own right, so really no point there. Also companions were just meatshields with a pullstring voicebox, only one I actually miss is dogmeat.

So this game doesn't have human npcs and tells its story passively with notes and holotapes and quests. This is not the first game you've ever seen that used the exact same method of storytelling, plenty of great games have little to no living human interaction, the fact all the humans are dead/missing doesn't make the story lifeless or the world dead. In fact, in the 20 hours I played during the beta, I can honestly tell you I've never seen a fallout world more alive than this one.

[Endus]

In other games maybe. In Fallout? 9 times out of 10 its

Holotape in ruined building full of ghouls: "boy the nukes sucked, oh people are ghouls now" which you are experiencing in the environment before reaching the tape.
Holotape in a shopping center full of raiders: "This place was nice, then raiders took over" which you are experiencing in the environment before reaching the tape.
Holotape in a vault: "This place seemed okay at first but was a dodgy experiment" which you are experiencing in the environment before reaching the tape.

Really, in Fallout, that's almost always not the case. You've got a ruined location. For instance, the last location in Fallout 76 I cleared was the Bolton Greens location on the East edge of the Forest. It's a hotel-looking place, filled with Scorched. Ruined, obviously.

Going through the lore materials, you get a story about a group of cannibals who came through in the aftermath of the Great War and set up shop, before one of them started breaking the "rules" and eating other clan members. Other than the place being particularly gory, you'd never get that story just from the atmospheric experience of being there.

I get you made it real clear this game is a strange 'down with the ship' and 'purge the nonebelievers' scenario for you for some reason

When people are making "this game is bad and nobody should like it" arguments, then yeah, I'm gonna take issue. Me responding in a dismissive manner is a direct response to their dismissive attack and exclusion of my experience and preferences. I don't care if people don't like the game; I understand it's a shift from the norm. But if you don't like this game, or don't like Bethesda Fallout games in general, why are you here? The only reason is to piss in other people's Cheerios to make sure they can't enjoy them.

but maybe fallouts holotapes ARE by and large lazy attempts at worldbuilding that just state the obvious and making them a replacement for npcs IS kind of a detrimental design choice when it wasn't a strong point in the fallout games WITH a full world of characters.

Nah.

Since your argument is just a subjective preference, that's the only counter-argument it deserves.

Fair enough, but then again, how long would you have to play it until you realize it by yourself or heard it from another player?

I don't think it's even a relevant complaint. There isn't a lack of NPCs. That there aren't any with a standard-human skin on is really just a minor detail, at best. It's not a mechanical lack; there are NPCs. We're just talking about how many are wearing a particular model.

- - - Updated - - -

I had to laugh when I was essentially being taught how to make a decent camp with decent defenses by the audio logs of a guy who died because he failed to build a decent camp with decent defenses.

And then there's the superhero overseer we're following around who apparently has traveled the whole breadth of West Virginia in the few hours we slept in and was kind enough to leave audio logs about her trip and her pre-vault past along the way, most in their own Vault-Tec audio log cases that could probably hold dozens of logs but only has one each time you come across them.

You're not following her entire path in hours. Pay attention to the day/night cycle in-game. It's almost certainly been days, and she's likely traveling at least as quickly as you are anyway.

That your gameplay experience narrows this down to a few hours is a factor of gameplay, making sure that you don't get bored from hours of holding W as you travel from A to B, or having to sit and watch your character get a good 6-8 hours of sleep.

[Deleted]

I just thought I'd go through the official YouTube videos from Bethesda, related to Fallout 76. Since, you know, a few people posting in this thread seem to think this game is dead on arrival, and it's not liked by anyone. First, here's what happens when the community actually, for real, rejects a game:



Now, here's the main videos for Fallout 76:





And if you want, here are all the rest as well, in an imgur album: https://imgur.com/a/isNbExh

Now, when every single official video having to do with this game is getting thumbed up by 90-95% of the people, perhaps the naysayers who belong to the 5-10% downvoters might actually be a vocal minority, and the game might just be fine after all. I would've taken a look at videos from content creators and/or streamers as well, after their B.E.T.A. impressions, but first of all, it'd be really difficult to gauge whether the thumbs ups are for the game or for the content creator / streamer, and secondly, a lot of said people seem to just have been giving out misinformation about the game in their videos, so I'd have to try and find someone who's actually objective, but then I'd already be cherrypicking. However, I think we can all agree that if the majority of the community absolutely hates a product, it's the official videos that they'll shit on.

That isn't the case with Fallout 76.

Could it be that the people being so damn bitter about this game, insulting it, trying to fling shit at it, might just be living in their own, very small bubble, while the vast, vast, vast majority of the gaming community and playerbase are feeling completely differently? I dunno. Maybe all those numbers are fake news and mean nothing.

EDIT: Thought I'd check the other Fallout trailers out too, so here are all the four Creation Engine Fallout trailers:






Fallout 76 definitely getting more thumbs down than the previous ones, but the trailers went from having a million views for a trailer posted 8 years ago for New Vegas (the Fallout 3 trailer was uploaded in 2013 so it can't be accurate), to 23 million views for a 3 year old trailer for Fallout 4, to 33 million views already in just five months for Fallout 76. The interest is definitely there, and the thumbs are holding strong. I would've expected the Fallout 76 trailer to have at least 19011 thumbs down, but I guess not.