What kinda drugs was blizzard on when they decided on the Blood DK nerfs

[ONCHEhap]

Well I don't think they're "fine". Monks need a bigger nerf and probably an overall rework for 9.0 to stop being low effort high effectiveness spec for raids that suffocates any other tank spec choice. Veng DH probably needs a buff / rework too because they're not excelling at anything while being one of the weakest, if not THE weakest raid tank spec, people say it's druids but I think druid kit is not as bad as dh for raiding, the problem is druid is completely outclassed by monk while not bringing anything useful (like dk grip) or different, and is considered even worse for m+ than dh.

If druids sucked for m+ but were amazing for raids, or if dhs were bottom for raids but best for m+, then we could say it's "kinda fine" even though I don't like the concept you have to suck in half of the pve content that is relevant to be good at the other half.

But having monk / dk being best / second best in both aspects while having all the other tank classes back in the tail is not good balance whatsoever. DKs deserved a nerf but so did monks, dks got nerfed and monks didn't really, so prepare for world of brewmastercraft in the next raid, people will have absolutely 0 reason to dump the monks after rerolling to them en masse in Uldir.

Monks already have crazy utility with ring of peace (and leg sweep, and great mobility), so do dks with grips / massgrips, now it's the time to revise all the remaining tank specs and give them something similarly impactful.

At least monks aren't anywhere near the level of game breakingly OP as bears during NH I guess

And even if they somehow manage to make blood the worst raiding tank,we won't even end up as bad as during NH,when we were actually not viable,might have been the only spec that was objectively not viable in a large number of years,instead of just "bad" or "subpar"

[Will]

its a fucking joke, in any mmorpg BY DEFINITION a raid is the biggest challenge, im actually so unbelievable tired of blizzards shit

You do realise M+ is being nerfed a lot lately, making it less challenging? Though, I contradict myself by pointing out that M+ has infinitely scaling difficulty, whereas mythic raids do not. It's cute you say raiding is where the challenge is, but unless you're pushing the cutting edge of keys...

[Xkiller9000]

You do realise M+ is being nerfed a lot lately, making it less challenging? Though, I contradict myself by pointing out that M+ has infinitely scaling difficulty, whereas mythic raids do not. It's cute you say raiding is where the challenge is, but unless you're pushing the cutting edge of keys...

m+ has artificial difficulty, once u get high enough on keys its a matter of avoiding a one shot and thats it. not interesting at all

[Kendros]

M+ hero, yea i only do m+ when my guildies ask me to, dont care for it, raiding is where challenge is

and horde, burn it

Yeah tanking raids too hard, position the boss, tank swaping when addon tells you to taunt and do a minimal rotation to stay alive is very complex. Also check my parses on raids.

[Xkiller9000]

Yeah tanking raids too hard, position the boss, tank swaping when addon tells you to taunt and do a minimal rotation to stay alive is very complex. Also check my parses on raids.

i didnt make this post to argue with people like you about m+ or raids, begone if thats all youre gonna do

[RobertoCarlos]

Blizzard has never used a scalpel, they use a hammer

[Stacie]

Keep it civil / none personal please guys.

[Trumpcat]

They were on the same stuff they usually are on every class design team meeting. It goes like this:

ION: What have you guys prepared to address the overperformance of DK tanks?
CLASS DEVS: Hurr durr hurrrr durrrr.
ION: Sounds good. What about Ret dps?
CLASS DEVS: Hurrderp hurrderp hurrrderpff
ION: Durrrdurrrrduurrrr

Meeting ends, people go to the caffeteria to snack on some chips and diet coke. The white dust is just from the donuts, don't pay attention to people snorting it.

[Deleted]

They were on the same stuff they usually are on every class design team meeting. It goes like this:

ION: What have you guys prepared to address the overperformance of DK tanks?
CLASS DEVS: Hurr durr hurrrr durrrr.
ION: Sounds good. What about Ret dps?
CLASS DEVS: Hurrderp hurrderp hurrrderpff
ION: Durrrdurrrrduurrrr

either that.. or its actually hard to balance 6 classes that by design of tanking don't just compete in dmg meters but against various pve situations while at the same time scaling differently with gearlevels rise up.
seeing how most of the other mmorpgs that did rise and fall sucked big time in this aspect.. i guess its indeed a hard thing to do right :P

[Kendros]

i didnt make this post to argue with people like you about m+ or raids, begone if thats all youre gonna do

You wanted to compare e peenz theres mine, i know what im talking about when it comes to dks.

[Kendros]

In legion it literally capped at 102 targets.

Yeah i remenber in legion it hitting everything thats why i was confused.

[Xkiller9000]

You wanted to compare e peenz theres mine, i know what im talking about when it comes to dks.

as do i, dont come here to pull that kinda shit, its a forum about balance changes

[NehmTH]

It doesn't feel that bad now that we're in a Tyra week again. It's more important than ever to not let bone shield fall off between pulls, and initial pulls withhout it is dangerous though. Go fallen crusader, not stoneskin.

[Mokuna]

You really have to be delusionnal to say those nerfs weren't justified or warranted, dk representation is through the roof in M+ , if you check the top runs you'll see nothing but dks and a few monks, in raids it was roughly the same but reversing monks and dks in terms of numbers, meaning these two are too far ahead of other tanks.

That said i don't agree with Blizzard's way of doing things, as always recently it's a negative change, especially in these times everyone's asking for more gameplay this would have been a great opportunity to use that positively, bring back what other tanks needed to compete, warrior banners, guardians being actual meatshield, paladins being actual offhealers...

Another option would have been to deal with what really makes dks so far ahead of other tanks in M+, like the dnd slow being stupid, grip being so strong because of how situations are designed around it...

But that's not the way Blizzard deals with stuff, Blizzard looks at representation, and then nerfs or buffs by a flat round % an arbitrary metric, this is why monks escaped nerfs, despite being so strong, they're still low in representation numbers (mostly because it's not a popular tank in the first place and only high end players bother to fotm reroll to monk when it's strong)

[Deleted]

Nerfed is the wrong expression. That would imply Blood DKs are mediocre now. They got tweaked and balanced but not nerfed. Guardian druids are nerfed, not blood death knights.

[stross01]

But that's not the way Blizzard deals with stuff, Blizzard looks at representation, and then nerfs or buffs by a flat round % an arbitrary metric, this is why monks escaped nerfs, despite being so strong, they're still low in representation numbers (mostly because it's not a popular tank in the first place and only high end players bother to fotm reroll to monk when it's strong)

Over half of the tanks in the game during mythic Uldir progression were brewmasters. A lot of guilds ran two, as there was no reason not to and every reason to.

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In legion it literally capped at 102 targets.

Pretty sure that was just a display bug.

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as do i, dont come here to pull that kinda shit, its a forum about balance changes

I would've nerfed DK further. Maybe put a 1-2 min CD on Death Grip and a double CD on AMS.

[Mokuna]

Over half of the tanks in the game during mythic Uldir progression were brewmasters. A lot of guilds ran two, as there was no reason not to and every reason to.

Well yeah that was my point most high end mythic guilds tanks rerolled to brewmasters, lower mythic guilds followed the example quite a bit, but if you look at the big spectrum of players monks are still not well represented (3rd represented tank in heroic behind dk and pala, with dks being almost twice as popular), so looking at the big picture prolly like blizzard does monks are far from overrepresented, thus less targetted by nerfs

[Xkiller9000]

Over half of the tanks in the game during mythic Uldir progression were brewmasters. A lot of guilds ran two, as there was no reason not to and every reason to.

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Pretty sure that was just a display bug.

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I would've nerfed DK further. Maybe put a 1-2 min CD on Death Grip and a double CD on AMS.

are you actually on drugs too? while i wouldve accepted a cd increase on aoe grip, because thats a M+ nerf for hte most part, no, your ideas are way out of line and extreme. You forget warriors get a % dmg reduc on spell reflect on a shorter cooldown than AMS, meanwhile AMS only absorbs a flat amount

Well yeah that was my point most high end mythic guilds tanks rerolled to brewmasters, lower mythic guilds followed the example quite a bit, but if you look at the big spectrum of players monks are still not well represented (3rd represented tank in heroic behind dk and pala, with dks being almost twice as popular), so looking at the big picture prolly like blizzard does monks are far from overrepresented, thus less targetted by nerfs

the balance difference affects mythic really, and mythic raiders who actually try, not to mention the # of alts that go into heroic. find out the representation in mythic, not heroic

[Deleted]

are you actually on drugs too? while i wouldve accepted a cd increase on aoe grip, because thats a M+ nerf for hte most part, no, your ideas are way out of line and extreme. You forget warriors get a % dmg reduc on spell reflect on a shorter cooldown than AMS, meanwhile AMS only absorbs a flat amount




the balance difference affects mythic really, and mythic raiders who actually try, not to mention the # of alts that go into heroic. find out the representation in mythic, not heroic

you forgetting the 2nd part where ams prevents you to get magical debuff

Removing mass grip (giving it to frost/unholy) would be the 1st step
then nerf the dnd slow talent (you know, like all of the other tank slows got nerfed from Legion)
and change Death Strike to increase the healing only from the last physical damage taken

[Flashforcash]

you forgetting the 2nd part where ams prevents you to get magical debuff

Removing mass grip (giving it to frost/unholy) would be the 1st step
then nerf the dnd slow talent (you know, like all of the other tank slows got nerfed from Legion)
and change Death Strike to increase the healing only from the last physical damage taken

so basiscly you would nerf the spec to have absolut nothing, worst mitigation in the game, and worse "active mitigation" in the game also with a poor DS ?

your funny