German city sizes dog of handicapped family with debts, sells it on eBay

[Slant]

Yeah it being Germany their regional laws might not rise to the level of say a human rights issue. That said I also think this is a pretty dick move.

Inless the pug was some kind of rare ultra valuable breed I don't understand the logic.

It is apparently quite expensive, and yeah it is a dick move. But... it doesn't warrant a news article and it certainly doesn't warrant anyone getting outraged over this. The family fucked up, tragic but Germany is still a land where you face consequences when you fuck up. That's how the cookie crumbles here...

[Kelthos]

Some of these European laws and taxes just seem so completely bonkers to me.

[Doctor Amadeus]

"My trusty bike is my family! Fuck you, officer, you can't confiscate it!"

Farmers would love to get away with this. Bank can't take my livestock they are all family. Especially tag red #223

[Slant]

Some of these European laws and taxes just seem so completely bonkers to me.

Don't worry, that Florida law forbidding people to bind elephants to lamp posts seems oddly specific to us, too. :P

[lockedout]

As an EU citizen i can say only one thing: "Disgraceful..."

It's actually a hit show in the UK.

[Vermented]

I think you're emotionally overreacting. I'm a dog person myself, so I get where you're coming from. But you know what? The only reason I don't own a dog is because my situation doesn't allow for it. I'm the responsible person saying I don't have the right job nor the right size of a home for a dog, so I'll most likely never own one. I detest anyone that keeps a dog in a city if they don't own a house with a huge garden (or any garden really), so don't tell me I should feel sympathetic for these people. They owe the society their due and they don't deserve a dog. And most likely, the dog is actually better off with a carer that can afford to keep him.

Being a pet lover yourself says absolutaly nothing. I know plenty of pet lovers, also German pet-owners, who weren't exactly morally high standing people... I'm a pet-lover too, a real dog lover. I own a dog and i can pay for it.

Taking a dog from it's family is traumatising for the animal, taking a dog from 3 young children is hurtfull for those children too. Taking a dog from a disabled father is incredibly sad. I work with disabled people, i know from close by how hard life is for most of them.

I see alot of suffering inflicted. I strongly protest that.

[Doctor Amadeus]

It is apparently quite expensive, and yeah it is a dick move. But... it doesn't warrant a news article and it certainly doesn't warrant anyone getting outraged over this. The family fucked up, tragic but Germany is still a land where you face consequences when you fuck up. That's how the cookie crumbles here...

I don't like this as I'm sure most wouldn't. But yeah welfare for the animal does make me wonder. This falls under just because you could do s thing category.

I think it might have been possible mercy on behalf of the animal or pug.

[Vermented]

I would fully agree.

This being said, the article looks so surreal, it's almost impossible to believe.

You're almost sad RT didn't pick it up earlier i'm sure.

[Greevir]

If a pet is merely "property" can't people do with it as they please? Such as abuse, maim or whatever unspeakable evils people do to their dogs? If not, then I don't see how they can be considered property, and should not be able to be used to pay debts.

[Slant]

Being a pet lover yourself says absolutaly nothing. I know plenty of pet lovers, also German pet-owners, who weren't exactly morally high standing people... I'm a pet-lover too, a real dog lover. I own a dog and i can pay for it.

Taking a dog from it's family is traumatising for the animal, taking a dog from 3 young children is hurtfull for those children too. Taking a dog from a disabled father is incredibly sad. I work with disabled people, i know from close by how hard life is for most of them.

I see alot of suffering inflicted. I strongly protest that.

I know it's traumatizing for the animal, and to a degree also for the kids. They should've thought about that before ignoring the debts for months if not years. You see, seizures don't happen overnight. You get a lot of warnings before that. And especially in Germany, with its proper social aid system, they could probably have gotten the dog tax waived if they had gone to the authorities and requested social aid.

But nooo, poor people are too proud to do that. Well, if you think you can manage on your own, bloody well manage it on your own then! But don't make me pay for your shit, because it's not my fault you're not doing well and too proud to ask for help. That's the deal in Europe, we don't keep these welfare states because we like paying for them... we keep them so they take care of people in shit situations so these things are taken care of.

Nah man, your moral compass is way off here. Blame the family, not the state.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Being a pet lover yourself says absolutaly nothing. I know plenty of pet lovers, also German pet-owners, who weren't exactly morally high standing people... I'm a pet-lover too, a real dog lover. I own a dog and i can pay for it.

Taking a dog from it's family is traumatising for the animal, taking a dog from 3 young children is hurtfull for those children too. Taking a dog from a disabled father is incredibly sad. I work with disabled people, i know from close by how hard life is for most of them.

I see alot of suffering inflicted. I strongly protest that.

Yeah and the dog also has no agency. There are laws especially in the U.S concerning treatment of animals. If thI family was taking care of the dog they need to provide stable means.

I also guarante you that if those kids were in jeopardy the city would likely come for them. Which would be even more stressful.

Bottom line if you love those you care for you take care of your business. A dog is property and as such is more vulnerable to abuse than anyone in the situation.

[Thelyron]

What @Slant (most likely "accidently"!) forgot to mention was that the city tried to seize the father's wheelchair first but they found out it wasn't his property, it was lended. That's why they seized the dog.

Google Translate

They wanted to seize the wheelchair... of a wheelchair bound man? What the absolute fuck.

[yetgdhfgh]

I would fully agree.

This being said, the article looks so surreal, it's almost impossible to believe.

TBH there is too much being left out to fully grasp what is going on here to really judge this but i still say taking someones pet is a shitty thing to do especially when i doubt the bills are in the hundreds of thousands and at best is prolly a few thousand euros which couldve and shouldve been handled where the guy could make reasonable monthly payments without his quality of life becoming intolerable.

[josykay]

Being a pet lover yourself says absolutaly nothing. I know plenty of pet lovers, also German pet-owners, who weren't exactly morally high standing people... I'm a pet-lover too, a real dog lover. I own a dog and i can pay for it.

Taking a dog from it's family is traumatising for the animal, taking a dog from 3 young children is hurtfull for those children too. Taking a dog from a disabled father is incredibly sad. I work with disabled people, i know from close by how hard life is for most of them.

I see alot of suffering inflicted. I strongly protest that.

Thing is, it wasn't a service/ support dog, or just a random dog. For which you can ask for a waiver, to not have to pay taxes. Which is in theory possible, if you are less wealthy. However, it is highly unusual, for a poor family in chronic debts, that already had multiple stuff seized, to own a pure breed dog with a pedigree, which usually are very expensive. Also, simply refusing to pay the taxes for the dog, can at worst become a tax evasion felony, and can end up with sooner or later your dog being taken away.
Poor people generally do not have pets, that cost a good fortune.

[Vermented]

I know it's traumatizing for the animal, and to a degree also for the kids. They should've thought about that before ignoring the debts for months if not years. You see, seizures don't happen overnight. You get a lot of warnings before that. And especially in Germany, with its proper social aid system, they could probably have gotten the dog tax waived if they had gone to the authorities and requested social aid.

But nooo, poor people are too proud to do that. Well, if you think you can manage on your own, bloody well manage it on your own then! But don't make me pay for your shit, because it's not my fault you're not doing well and too proud to ask for help. That's the deal in Europe, we don't keep these welfare states because we like paying for them... we keep them so they take care of people in shit situations so these things are taken care of.

Nah man, your moral compass is way off here. Blame the family, not the state.

There are alot of "if's" and "mabeys" in your argumentation. I rather stick with the facts, oke?

[EnclosedOne]

the only person at fault here is the shitty father for buying a dog he couldn't afford and not paying the taxes required of him like everyone else and being in a wheelchair doesn't absolve him from his responsibilites. the courts only seize items when all attempts to get in contact with the person responsible have failed or they outright refuse to pay and its quite rare that they go after pets but purebreds can fetch enough money to repay some or all of the debt so thats what they'll do

the fathers irresponsibility is the reason his children are suffering now

[Vermented]

They wanted to seize the wheelchair... of a wheelchair bound man? What the absolute fuck.

Indeed. Very sick sh*t.

[Doctor Amadeus]

If a pet is merely "property" can't people do with it as they please? Such as abuse, maim or whatever unspeakable evils people do to their dogs? If not, then I don't see how they can be considered property, and should not be able to be used to pay debts.

It's a contradiction in practice and legally really treated high courts.

[zEmini]

It seems the German police haven't changed in nearly a century.

If the police tried to take my Dog away in the US I would probably be dead.

[Slant]

If a pet is merely "property" can't people do with it as they please? Such as abuse, maim or whatever unspeakable evils people do to their dogs? If not, then I don't see how they can be considered property, and should not be able to be used to pay debts.

You have to think like a lawyer.

What is property damage? It's the reduction of the functionality of the property, isn't it? If I make a dent in your car, I'm reducing the integrity of the car door, thus property damage. Same goes for the dog, it's purpose being a healthy animal companion to its owner. Now, it gets a bit tricky, but essentially the law says "animals are not things, but they are treated like things." This is to prevent owners from damaging their own pets (which would be legally inconsequential, as you are absolutely allowed to damage your own property as much as you like) by leaving the door wide, wide open for animal protection laws (that don't affect property by definition of them being inanimate "stuff") that will protect living "things" from human abuse. Within reason, of course... butchers still need to be able to do their job.

I've rambled a bit, if you have questions, ask away, it's not that silly once you think about the way a lawer looks at these things.