Anthem: Bioware's next Mass Effect-like IP

[Baconeggcheese]

Yeah, it is. The online mode in ME was super limited in scope and very easy to design around, as it wasn't designed to be a core "looter shooter", but a multiplayer activity to bolster your single player experience (and generally be a fun horde-wave shooter).

They've never worked on a looter shooter or purely loot driven game like Anthem before, and it's painfully apparent that's the case.

They made an MMORPG

[Edge-]

They made an MMORPG

I was talking about Edmonton. But even with Austin, they struggled for years to get loot "right" and are still tweaking it with the latest SWTOR expansion.

Though again, that's a very different type of game than Anthem with an extremely different loot system, rewards structure, and progression system.

You keep seeming to think, "but RPG!" when that's not relevant. There are tons of RPG's not centered around loot farming, hell, I'd say a majority don't. You didn't do that shit in any of the ME/DA games, you didn't do that shit in SWTOR, you didn't do that shit in Jade Dynasty or KOTOR. That's a uniquely "action-RPG"-esque mechanic that's been ported over to the shooter genre thanks to the likes of games like Destiny and Borderlands (which would be another good well to draw from for talent!). Games that are still RPG's, but where the core of the retention is centered around endlessly farming the same shit for incremental upgrades and "god-rolls" that don't exist in all these other titles.

[Baconeggcheese]

I was talking about Edmonton. But even with Austin, they struggled for years to get loot "right" and are still tweaking it with the latest SWTOR expansion.

Though again, that's a very different type of game than Anthem with an extremely different loot system, rewards structure, and progression system.

So... they have people with experience.

You keep seeming to think, "but RPG!" when that's not relevant.

Now you're putting words in my mouth.

MMORPG's are absolutely loot driven, and you see games like WoW adopting ARPG systems to allow for grind as a way to extend their content. There's plenty of overlap in these kinds of games... hell initially the looter shooters were marketed as shooter MMORPG's.

[Edge-]

So... they have people with experience.

No.

The loot system in SWTOR is extremely different than that in Anthem, and you can't translate experience from one to the other given how radically different they are. As is the goal of play - SWTOR is not a game designed for players to constantly be farming for incremental upgrades or "god-rolls" like Anthem is.

The loot in a game like SWTOR is a means to an end, while in Anthem the loot is the end itself.

MMORPG's are absolutely loot driven, and you see games like WoW adopting ARPG systems to allow for grind as a way to extend their content.

Fair, apologies if I did that as that was my interpretation of your comments.

WoW is adopting some of the worst aspects of it for their loot system, yes. That doesn't mean it's a good/smart decision (IMO it's massively stupid and yet another example of Blizzard copying what works from other teams without fully considering its effects in a different game) or that it will play out well.

Again, even the system in WoW pales in comparison to how loot functions in Anthem and you can't easily or reasonably translate experience in one to the other, as you can't with SWTOR.

If they want to look to another game that did it "better" (quotes because IMO it doesn't, but plenty of folks think it does), Borderlands is the ticket.

[rhorle]

It's not like experience means anything if you pick a poor system. Blizzard had plenty of experience yet still picked a poor loot system for Diablo 3. As much as people like to say Bioware had no clue they certainly did. ME 3 and 4 both had loot driven multiplayer. DA and ME had loot driven systems though ME used loot a lot more. They were basic compared to Anthem and other typical "Online" shooters.

But they still had basic understandings of what drives people and how to create systems. To be frank Bioware has never had loot and gear systems as a strong point in their games. They have a lot of faults as a studio that always appear in their games in one form or another.

[Halicia]

If they want to look to another game that did it "better" (quotes because IMO it doesn't, but plenty of folks think it does), Borderlands is the ticket.

How about Warframe ? Its a pretty well received game similar to Anthem that would probably merit comparison to Anthem, once you disregard some of the differences of monetization.

[Edge-]

How about Warframe ? Its a pretty well received game similar to Anthem that would probably merit comparison to Anthem, once you disregard some of the differences of monetization.

It's one of the ones I listed earlier. It's a bit different in that you're farming materials mostly (IIRC) to craft items, rather than the items with RNG stats themselves. But through the RNG cards and the fact that it's the loot-grind that's "end" rather than the "means" to another end, I think it's plenty similar enough for them to be able to learn an immense amount on from folks who know more about its internal workings.

[Yriel]

How about Warframe ? Its a pretty well received game similar to Anthem that would probably merit comparison to Anthem, once you disregard some of the differences of monetization.

I really hope they don't get their inspirations from Warframe.
I hate their system, it's the epitome of grind, especially everything prime where you need to farm stuff just to access instances that may have a chance to drop something...
Warframe is fun to play but their loot system is abysmal.

[kaid]

I think it is safe to say they are planning to keep going. No real discounts, no statements about stopping support, and active hiring for the game all point to the intention of supporting the game for a while. It would be nice if they could make it clear though. As I imagine they won't get much new blood to the game if they seem likely to cease support.

It is at least better then Andromeda so far so there is that.

I think actively hiring devs to shore up weak spots seems a pretty clear case of more long term support. You are not hiring a guy making likely 6 figure income just to ditch the game any time soon.

- - - Updated - - -

It's not like experience means anything if you pick a poor system. Blizzard had plenty of experience yet still picked a poor loot system for Diablo 3. As much as people like to say Bioware had no clue they certainly did. ME 3 and 4 both had loot driven multiplayer. DA and ME had loot driven systems though ME used loot a lot more. They were basic compared to Anthem and other typical "Online" shooters.

But they still had basic understandings of what drives people and how to create systems. To be frank Bioware has never had loot and gear systems as a strong point in their games. They have a lot of faults as a studio that always appear in their games in one form or another.

Blizzard had a couple iterations of diablo to get loot right and still fell on their face out of the gate. Sometimes what you think you know when put into practice just fails. I give credit to EA/bioware for realizing the issue and bringing in outside talent to help. That indicates that they are standing behind the game and that they have more long term plans to keep supporting it. If they intended to just dump it hiring high end devs would just be throwing good money after bad.

[kaelleria]

Stream delayed until April 23rd.
Apparently a fiber line was cut outside their office and they are on backup internet.

[Greyvax]

Wellp. This game is finished.

[Dextroden]

Welp, that's not good. I don't doubt stupid shit like this happens sometimes, but a week without any kind of update after trying to hype people up for the stream is not gonna go over well.

[kaelleria]

Wellp. This game is finished.

Eh... There are legitimate fiber issues in Austin going on right now.

Given that they need to schedule the appropriate people and it's Easter weekend, Tuesday is probably the earliest they can schedule people for another stream.

[kaid]

I am hoping they post some snippets or something but if their fiber really was cut then probably on do as little as possible until shits fixed.

[Edge-]

Eh... There are legitimate fiber issues in Austin going on right now.

Given that they need to schedule the appropriate people and it's Easter weekend, Tuesday is probably the earliest they can schedule people for another stream.

I have concerns...

I'm not taking them at their word, but a number of folks are claiming to have reached out to other companies operating out of the same business, claiming they're all saying they haven't had any internet issues. Huge grains of salt with this since it's all anonymous.

Beyond that, they can still share information that's ready now and let folks know they'll expand upon it in the livestream.

I can't blame folks for not fully trusting BW anymore and being beyond disappointed that today's livestream was canceled at the last minute. Folks keep pointing out they can do a canned video instead and follow up with a livestream.

Continued total silence in lieu of this livestream is a bloody joke.

[dope_danny]

Stream delayed until April 23rd.
Apparently a fiber line was cut outside their office and they are on backup internet.

Oh is that what they are calling this extremely convenient delay?

[Faldric]

Stream delayed until April 23rd.
Apparently a fiber line was cut outside their office and they are on backup internet.

Sure. There is absolutely no way to do the stream anyway. In a world where every 16 year old with a Laptop can stream in HD on Twitch/Youtube with little to no equipment, this really seems like an impossible task.

[Dextroden]

I have concerns...

I'm not taking them at their word, but a number of folks are claiming to have reached out to other companies operating out of the same business, claiming they're all saying they haven't had any internet issues. Huge grains of salt with this since it's all anonymous.

Beyond that, they can still share information that's ready now and let folks know they'll expand upon it in the livestream.

I can't blame folks for not fully trusting BW anymore and being beyond disappointed that today's livestream was canceled at the last minute. Folks keep pointing out they can do a canned video instead and follow up with a livestream.

Continued total silence in lieu of this livestream is a bloody joke.

That was hilarious to read and it makes me really hope it isn't a lie. Because no one should think the internet isn't going to check if your company has internet access. And lieing about that to get out of doing a live stream you did a 24 hour in advance tweet for is not going to go well.

At least the tweets and Reddit are hilarious.

[kaelleria]

I have concerns...

I'm not taking them at their word, but a number of folks are claiming to have reached out to other companies operating out of the same business, claiming they're all saying they haven't had any internet issues. Huge grains of salt with this since it's all anonymous.

Beyond that, they can still share information that's ready now and let folks know they'll expand upon it in the livestream.

I can't blame folks for not fully trusting BW anymore and being beyond disappointed that today's livestream was canceled at the last minute. Folks keep pointing out they can do a canned video instead and follow up with a livestream.

Continued total silence in lieu of this livestream is a bloody joke.

ATT is the only fiber provider in Austin - https://istheservicedown.com/problem...-united-states

Its probably more along the lines of they need to reschedule the people they were planning on having on the stream. Considering these issues arose this morning and they were trying to get it running on backup, they probably decided it was better to just delay it until after the holiday weekend.

Should they put out a post saying hey this is what we want to show? Absolutely.

[Faldric]

Jesus fucking christ, fuck up after fuck up... I'm really starting to believe that Dragon Age 4 will be the last thing we will see from Bioware.

You are more optimistic than me. My bet is Bioware getting dissolved before entering DA4 production phase.