Vulpera break the trend

[Yarathir]

Well, in the end there is nothing wrong with using good models again. In this case you can't really critizice Blizzard for it that much. Its just smart ressource managing. And if Mok'nathal are more awesome than Kul Tirans is quite subjective.

I can't criticize them, but it more so has to do with the fact that Horde players insist that Alliance fans should feel blessed and favored with their allied races, eternally grateful no matter what they get simply because they are the faction that got a unique rig, when that rig is extremely likely to be reused in the near future.

And no, there isn't an objective better or worse (other than if we're talking strictly technically), but it's not a secret that most people prefer a strong, heroic body shape over an obese body shape.

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Again, we all know, deep down, that the Tortollion Seekers will be the next allied race for both Horde and Alliance.

Your name makes this post funny.

[The Butt Witch]

They weren't supposed to be an AR, but furries pressured Blizzard into making them.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

They weren't supposed to be an AR, but furries pressured Blizzard into making them.

They were obviously gonna being playable since their introduction. The boogymen "furries" didn't affect the game.

[Rhlor]

That's really not over analyzing anything, it's just logic.

As everyone knows, player rigs are a large investment, one you cannot make without future payoff. One allied race is not enough payoff. Hell, just look at the bee skeleton- introduced in BfA, and already has an Aqir model built on it.

Expecting the Kul Tiran rigs to not be reused at this point is naivete. I mean, the original race skeletons weren't even originally planned to be reused, yet they still did. And you think the unique skeleton made for one allied race a few months ago isn't planned to be reused at least once to really make it worth the time and money put into it?

they could use it in mob races like fat blood troll!

[Yarathir]

They were obviously gonna being playable since their introduction. The boogymen "furries" didn't affect the game.

Yeah, I mean, they had a model that could wear armor, a Heart of Azeroth anim and body customization since before BfA even launched if I recall correctly.

[bullseyed]

Yeah, I don't get it. Minimum effort into reading and making sure you understand the topic before pushing reply. That's the internet though... I've been enjoying the speculation from those who do get it though.

In days gone by the delta between these things was what moderation was for. People who posted without reading were banned. That is how communities are made.

[Mirishka]

Despite being a Horde player I do think the alliance have been done dirty with allied races. Seems lots of them are arsepulls or uninteresting re-colours.

That said I'll be annoyed if they were to get mogu :L

And see, as an alliance player I really like most of them. The LF Draenei are an interesting concept to me (thought they could use a few more distinctions from the standard), Void elves are as close as we're going to come to High elves (whom I've wanted since BC), and Dark Iron dwarves are long overdue. KT humans came out great IMO (one of the most 'new' allied races with all new animations and such) - and I'm a fan of gnomes/gnome lore, so the mechagnomes are a welcome addition as well. They have a lot of customization by WoW standards and many unique 'mechanical' animations.

On the Horde side, HM Tauren are just moose-tauren, Nightborne were a disappointment (they don't look like the NPCs which is a mistake IMO). Mah'gar orcs look great but don't interest me because orcs in general don't. Zandalari are interesting (I love how tall they are) and probably the Horde race I'd play the most if I unlocked them. As for Vulpera, they are neat and I hope to have one someday, but I'm nowhere exalted with Vol'duni and haven't finished any of the stories on that faction.

[Yarathir]

they could use it in mob races like fat blood troll!

It's possible that they'll be reused like that, too. For example, Rexxar uses it right now.

But it's a player viable skeleton, a lot of work was put into that and it needs to be worth the investment, so there's a very, very significant chance you'll see the skeleton repurposed for another allied race. That's simply the nature of a business, being able to justify your time and money investment going forward. and the AR system is almost all about repurposing rigs; reusing player rigs is the norm for it, I don't see why a rig born from that system would be off-limits, if you get what I mean.

They will want to make as much money back as they can using that skeleton.

[Mirishka]

They weren't supposed to be an AR, but furries pressured Blizzard into making them.

Source of this info: your ass.

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They will want to make as much money back as they can using that skeleton.

You speak as if anything they would make with the KT animations/rig would be sold separately. You're entitled to your personal speculation, but said speculation isn't fact.

[Yarathir]

You speak as if anything they would make with the KT animations/rig would be sold separately. You're entitled to your personal speculation, but said speculation isn't fact.

It's not speculation, it's how businesses work, game companies work.

Anyone who unironically believes that a game company creates a player viable rig like that without any intention of ever reusing it or getting maximum use out of it is either naive or wilfully ignorant, and there's no need to humor them since they are not well equipped to contribute to the conversation.

[Mirishka]

I would prefer that. Hell maybe both sides could get them. As well as the new death knight races. It's all very death related for 9.0 as well.

I'd consider that unlikely as Blizz has spoken of being unhappy with the first neutral race, Pandaren. Though, if the factions do come together as suspected - or at least, cease being at each other's throats for a while - it doesn't feel as much like an impossibility.

[Newname1234567890]

And see, as an alliance player I really like most of them. The LF Draenei are an interesting concept to me (thought they could use a few more distinctions from the standard), Void elves are as close as we're going to come to High elves (whom I've wanted since BC), and Dark Iron dwarves are long overdue. KT humans came out great IMO (one of the most 'new' allied races with all new animations and such) - and I'm a fan of gnomes/gnome lore, so the mechagnomes are a welcome addition as well. They have a lot of customization by WoW standards and many unique 'mechanical' animations.

On the Horde side, HM Tauren are just moose-tauren, Nightborne were a disappointment (they don't look like the NPCs which is a mistake IMO). Mah'gar orcs look great but don't interest me because orcs in general don't. Zandalari are interesting (I love how tall they are) and probably the Horde race I'd play the most if I unlocked them. As for Vulpera, they are neat and I hope to have one someday, but I'm nowhere exalted with Vol'duni and haven't finished any of the stories on that faction.

Interesting! So in my opinion summary:
- LF scapegoats are just regular scapegoats who believed super hard.
- VE should have been HE, appeared at of no where and devalued the void
- Dark Iron are cool and the best ally allied race .
- Kul Tirans, I'm basically just not a fan of the model but culturally ocean sailor shit is right up my alley. If I played alliance I'd have a warrior kul titan.
- Junker Gnomes are similar to what the LFSG are to SG. But with tech instead of light.

So 2/5

Horde:
Highmountian: lame ducks no argument
Nightborne: I love their aesthetic and story. Model may not be great but that's secondary to me over the feel.
Zandarai: Are perfect in basically everything
Mag'har Orcs: Orcs without the fel baggage and closer to true Orcs. Plus more of their individual clans shine through.
Vulpera: Not a going to play one but they feel unique. Also I'd argue they are basically the archetypal Horde race.

4/5

Interesting how different opinions can be. The only race I wish hadn't been added are VE because of the degradation of the void as a result

[Reinhart11]

@ Yarathir

The only Alliance Allied Races i personally can't stand are the Void Elves. And i also don't like the Lightforged Draenei much in general. But that is also because i don't think their futuristic armor and tech fits too well into the Warcraft Universe at all. Blizzard shouldn't have brought space ships into this in my opinion. But thats just my taste.

Mecha Gnomes and Kul Tirans fit the Alliance nicely in my opinion. The different subfaction/races of the main races of the Alliance like humans, dwarves, gnomes and such are good choices. Sure, the Kul Tirans aren't blowing most people out of the water, but i wouldn't mind if for example Lordaeron Humans would be an Allied Race, if they get an awesome model. Maybe a more knightly appearance compared to the humans of Stormwind. Something in that direction(But of course one could also argue, that something like this should just be a customization option and i can't disagree, WoW lacks customization massively compared to other MmoRPGs). Dark Irons i personally like a lot. Wildhammer would be great too.

But i agree that the Alliance did not get highly requested races yet. I think Blizzard made a big mistake in their handling of High Elves and aside from them, i'm not sure the Alliance has too many exciting options left who are asked as often as High Elves? There are Broken, maybe High Arakoa. Botani would fit the Night Elves as allies well in my opinion. Furbolgs could have a really awesome, beastly model portraying powerful bears, in contrast to their current model which looks silly, uninspired and not impressive at all. Maybe if they base a Furbolg model more on the Legion druid bear tanking form it could be a great choice. Jinyu and Ankoan of course are nice as well i think in my opinion. But aside from that, not much comes to my mind in regards to fitting Alliance races who already exist in the game.

Another option might be a very different kind of humans, maybe more based on black people from our world, but sophisticated, maybe based upon the Wagadu Kingdom or the Mali Empire or the Kingdom of Kush or what not, with distinct style and looks compared to the European centered human faction we have so far in WoW. But for something like this, we'd need a fitting new continent. Or a human race / kingdom which fits the people from India, which could be very impressive as well.

Overall, the Horde might have an easier time to get Allied Races, because in the eyes of a lot of people it looks like the ones the Horde can potentially choose from are more desirable.

[Mikhas]

However, Vulpera seem to change that. They are an entirely new race added to the game, and the only thing they have in common with their counterpart race is that they are a small race. But Vulpera are in no way a subspecies or different tribe of goblin.

At any rate, it seems the last AR for Alliance is still the biggest mystery of BfA.

But didn't Kul Tirans use a new rig for animations? I dont see any other race with the Kul Tiran model. They are still humans, but the horde didn't get a new rig just modified version of Night Elf

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

But didn't Kul Tirans use a new rig for animations? I dont see any other race with the Kul Tiran model. They are still humans, but the horde didn't get a new rig just modified version of Night Elf

He's not talking about their rigs. He's talking about the lore of the races.

[Mirishka]

It's not speculation, it's how businesses work, game companies work.

Anyone who unironically believes that a game company creates a player viable rig like that without any intention of ever reusing it or getting maximum use out of it is either naive or wilfully ignorant, and there's no need to humor them since they are not well equipped to contribute to the conversation.

I don't mean to let the air out of your down-nose staring and know-it-all shtick, but there are literally thousands of games that come out every year with 'one time use' sets of animations and rigs. The industry does not begin and end with OMG MUST REUSE THESE ANIMATIONS PLZ.

And for a company of Blizzard's size and success, reusing animation rigs is more a matter of convenience than it is 'making as much money as possible' on the rig. Not that there is even a way to quantify that - I promise that there's no "the decision to reuse KT animations for this fat troll led to over $8 million dollars in revenue for the fiscal year!" TBA in any financial reports.

When you actually have a job for Blizzard, feel free to come back to the forums and regale us with stories about how their business operates. Until then? Its speculation, whether you like it or not.

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Interesting! So in my opinion summary:
- LF scapegoats are just regular scapegoats who believed super hard.
- VE should have been HE, appeared at of no where and devalued the void
- Dark Iron are cool and the best ally allied race .
- Kul Tirans, I'm basically just not a fan of the model but culturally ocean sailor shit is right up my alley. If I played alliance I'd have a warrior kul titan.
- Junker Gnomes are similar to what the LFSG are to SG. But with tech instead of light.

So 2/5

Horde:
Highmountian: lame ducks no argument
Nightborne: I love their aesthetic and story. Model may not be great but that's secondary to me over the feel.
Zandarai: Are perfect in basically everything
Mag'har Orcs: Orcs without the fel baggage and closer to true Orcs. Plus more of their individual clans shine through.
Vulpera: Not a going to play one but they feel unique. Also I'd argue they are basically the archetypal Horde race.

4/5

Interesting how different opinions can be. The only race I wish hadn't been added are VE because of the degradation of the void as a result

Indeed, and I appreciate the reply.

You make a good point about the Mag'har orcs btw, I hadn't considered that.

And the Nightborne thing, I was one of the people *begging* Blizzard to make them playable. I LOVED their story in Legion and working through it was my priority on non-raid days. But I was just hugely disappointed that we got these generic, wide eyed (O_O) models instead of the squinting, calculating Nightborne that I fell in love with. Like compare Valcroix or Thalyssra's face to that of a playable female Nightborne... looks like a difference race altogether. And damn it, we should have gotten a post-Legion version of Suramar as a city.

Their heritage armor is gorgeous though!

[Yarathir]

@ Yarathir

The only Alliance Allied Races i personally can't stand are the Void Elves. And i also don't like the Lightforged Draenei much in general. But that is also because i don't think their futuristic armor and tech fits too well into the Warcraft Universe at all. Blizzard shouldn't have brought space ships into this in my opinion. But thats just my taste.

Mecha Gnomes and Kul Tirans fit the Alliance nicely in my opinion. The different subfaction/races of the main races of the Alliance like humans, dwarves, gnomes and such are good choices. Sure, the Kul Tirans aren't blowing most people out of the water, but i wouldn't mind if for example Lordaeron Humans would be an Allied Race, if they get an awesome model. Maybe a more knightly appearance compared to the humans of Stormwind. Something in that direction(But of course one could also argue, that something like this should just be a customization option and i can't disagree, WoW lacks customization massively compared to other MmoRPGs). Dark Irons i personally like a lot. Wildhammer would be great too.

But i agree that the Alliance did not get highly requested races yet. I think Blizzard made a big mistake in their handling of High Elves and aside from them, i'm not sure the Alliance has too many exciting options left who are asked as often as High Elves? There are Broken, maybe High Arakoa. Botani would fit the Night Elves as allies well in my opinion. Furbolgs could have a really awesome, beastly model portraying powerful bears, in contrast to their current model which looks silly, uninspired and not impressive at all. Maybe if they base a Furbolg model more on the Legion druid bear tanking form it could be a great choice. Jinyu and Ankoan of course are nice as well i think. But aside from that, not much comes to my mind in regards to fitting Alliance races who already exist in the game.

Another option might be a very different kind of humans, maybe more based on black people from our world, but sophisticated, maybe based upon the Wagadu Kingdom or the Mali Empire or the Kingdom of Kush or what not, with distinct style and looks compared to the European centered human faction we have so far in WoW. But for something like this, we'd need a fitting new continent. Or a human race / kingdom which fits the people from India, which could very impressive as well.

Overall, the Horde might have an easier time to get Allied Races, because in the eyes of a lot of people it looks like the ones the Horde can potentially choose from are more desirable.

Honestly, I can give all of the 7.3.5 races a pass, as I mentioned before. They were the first baby steps in the allied race system, of which Nightborne were the biggest, but they were still baby-steps.

Dark Irons and Mag'har felt like fillers. Good fillers, but essentially making up for the fact that Zandalari were held back due to the work required on Kul Tirans. They pair well, considering they roughly feel like the same amount of work went into them and are as relevant in the story as one another.

Although Kul Tirans aren't my jam, they work well with Zandalari as well. Both of them required more than a typical time investment, especially Kul Tirans for aforementioned reasons, and they both occupy roughly the same spot in the story, of being the two main factions the Alliance and Horde respectively get to work with.

I won't mention the Mechagnomes, because my opinions on them would just upset people. I'd say that I would have preferred Ankoan to go with Vulpera instead, despite the fact that they would've been built on a Night Elf skeleton. Give them enough unique anims and they'd be roughly even.

You're right, though, that the Alliance doesn't have the best options. The Horde has cool options, old (Ogre, Mogu, Forest Trolls) and new (Sethrak), plus, if you're going for old races, you'd probably have to find some way to make them relevant again in the story. Much as I'd love High Arakkoa for the Alliance, they're currently in Draenor and pretty much an alternate timeline and dimension removed from our story. It'd be possible to make them relevant, but right now, I see Furbolgs and Broken as being the two races I can see the Alliance getting if Blizzard plans to pick from older content.

The story changes, however, if Blizzard intends to bring the allied race system into 9.0 and they focus on races that are relevant (and perhaps new) to that expansion.

[LionSinMaikeru]

Sure I can see Lightforged Undead going to the Horde because of the recent interactions with Calia in 8.3. They'd obviously re-use the Human model/rigging. But that's a huge stretch lore wise. Calia is "special", she's an exception. What's the lore - that she or some other super powerful Priest starts mass razing new Undead with the Light?

For Worgen? As Pebrocks said - Saberon? But what's the lore reasons?

To be honest, I'm kinda disappointed Alliance got the Mechagnomes with the Vulpera. The Mechagnomes are so underwhelming...it would have been much cooler for them to give Alliance Lightforged Undead with the Vulpera. /shrug

[benting]

But I like KT's druid forms more than Zandalari. Drust are cooler than dinos IMOs.

I actually like the drust theme too, but its the quality difference between the models.

[Yarathir]

I don't mean to let the air out of your down-nose staring and know-it-all shtick, but there are literally thousands of games that come out every year with 'one time use' sets of animations and rigs. The industry does not begin and end with OMG MUST REUSE THESE ANIMATIONS PLZ.

And for a company of Blizzard's size and success, reusing animation rigs is more a matter of convenience than it is 'making as much money as possible' on the rig. Not that there is even a way to quantify that - I promise that there's no "the decision to reuse them for this fat troll led to over $8 million dollars in revenue for the fiscal year!" TBA in any financial reports.

When you actually have a job for Blizzard, feel free to come back to the forums and regale us with stories about how their business operates. Until then? Its speculation, whether you like it or not.

Hey, I'm sorry to break your 'Disney Magic' blinders, but not all of us are as deliberately naive about business decisions as you are. "Down-nose staring", hmh.. what a comical remark to make, Mr/Mrs. Opponent of Stupid. There is no magical smokescreen, game companies don't operate beyond our understanding, they're a business just like any other and will try to make as much money as they can. Investments need to be worthwhile, and making a unique rig that can be utilized for players is an investment that needs to pay for itself. That doesn't make Blizzard scummy, it just makes them logical.

Maybe if you spent less time fighting what you consider stupid, you'd be able to learn more about what business investments entail and how a new race can bring Blizzard money, both directly and indirectly.