+Hit% vs + Weapon SKill

[Potatowizard]

Maybe I'm looking in the wrong areas or i am googling the wrong questions

But can someone explain to me the difference in an item that increases skill with a weapon (assuming you are max 300) vs just flat hit%?

is +5 weapon skill equal to 1% hit?

[liakos3]

Hit means the critical hit damage I think.. So you can not compare those too..

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[George Costanza]

+ weapon skill is basically defense penetration.

1% hit just means your attacks have a higher % not to miss weapon skill is superior in all cases. but hit is still good

[Ihsatakar]

Hit rating increases the chance for your hits to not miss

Weapon skill reduces your chance to be dodged or parried by the target, in addition to a little bit of hit rating. It also interacts with glancing blows in a way that makes weapon skill a very favorable stat for fighting things higher level than you are.

[MatadorMedia]

It's very confusing but in Vanilla/Classic, everything is sort of on one giant continuum (hit, crit, parry, etc.). But to answer your specific question, +5 weapons skill is equal to approximately 3% chance to hit, and +10 weapon skill is about 4.5% to hit because there are diminishing returns.

[Tojara]

Weapon skill is above and beyond better than anything else for the first 5 points, the next 3 points (to 308) are pretty valuable as well. After 308 it's not that amazing of a stat. It's 3% hit for the first 5 skill, and gives glancing blow penalty reduction up to 308 in addition to reduction in dodge/parry as well. Like stated, the bonus is pretty miniscule past 308 though and you get far more value getting other stats.

Keep in mind weapon skill is only really amazing in raids (or if you're fighting targets at +3 level or beyond, but that's not usually the case).

[mickybrighteyes]

weapon skill is technically hit for the first few points and actually better than hit chance for those first few points... but after soemthing like 5 pts it drops off HARD and stops being that great.

So if you're a non-human, non-orc looking at those gloves that give +7 weapon skill for 3 weapons? yes those gloves are amazing. If you ARE a human with swords or an orc with axes however... you can really ignore +weapon skill effects.

[anveena]

You really only need 305 weapon skill as melee. The first 5 points over 300 are equal to 3% hit.

[Potatowizard]

Thanks for the responses!

[Dacien]

You really only need 305 weapon skill as melee. The first 5 points over 300 are equal to 3% hit.

308 will drop glancing blows down to their minimum of 5% (from 15% at 305), so if you can get to 308, it's worth it.

Human rogues are better off going 310 since there's no better place to put the point.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks for the responses!

If you have the time, this is an excellent explanation of melee mechanics.

[AeneasBK]

Will admit to not having looked super hard beyond initial research but haven't found explicit evidence (as in "here I ran the numbers for 1000 autoshots" or w/e; just a bunch of "it *should* do this" or "It worked like that in Vanilla" stuff, with half of it contradictory) about the effect and advantages of weapon skill for hunters.

Because there exists gear with it, and dwarves and trolls get them as racials. But they don't suffer from glancing blows like melee. Do they suffer the additional 1% chance to miss that melee do for having greater than 10 difference in skill - defence, does it affect chance to be blocked in the same way etc.

No one seems to have published hard evidence about it (that I found. Last time I looked.) If anyone can point to stuff I'd love to see it. The only one that came close the results of testeing didn't support what they were saying about how it should work (and the sample size was pissant small but I'm not a statistician maybe it was big enough w/e).

[Millyraynge]

Important to know is, that there are 3 different formulas around how weapon skill works:

Formula 1: targets defense is lower than attackers weapon skill

Formula 2: targets defense is equal or up to 10 points highrr than the attackers weeapon skill

Formula 3: targets defense at least 11 points higher than attackers weapon skill

The jump from formula 3 to formula 2 happens at 305 weapon skill against bosses / lvl 63 targets.

This makes the jump from 304 to 305 extremely powerful (1.4% reduced miss chance). Just for comparison: the first 4 points after 300 only deliver 1.6% reduced miss chance together.

Any further point weapon skill within formula 2 (306 to 315) provides 0.1 reduced miss chance.

Furthermore any point weapon skill within formula 2 and 3 reduces the chance beeing dodged by 0.1%.

At 300 the average glancing blow deals 55 to 75 %o f the normal damage.

At 305 the average glancing blow deals 80 to 90 % of the normal damage.

At 308 the average glancing blow deals 91 to 99% of the normal damage. This is the glancing cap.

[Methodd]

I just want to make sure I'm reading this right.

I've got about 9% hit right now and just got edgemasters. If i replace my current gloves with them I'll lose 2% hit. Does that hit get replaced by the added weapon skill? I'm a dwarf so no weapon racial.

[Goradan]

Hit rating increases the chance for your hits to not miss

Weapon skill reduces your chance to be dodged or parried by the target, in addition to a little bit of hit rating. It also interacts with glancing blows in a way that makes weapon skill a very favorable stat for fighting things higher level than you are.

Yeah it works a bit like Expertise in that regard.

[Aphrel]

Maybe I'm looking in the wrong areas or i am googling the wrong questions

But can someone explain to me the difference in an item that increases skill with a weapon (assuming you are max 300) vs just flat hit%?

is +5 weapon skill equal to 1% hit?

The frist 5 wep skill above 300 Is HUGE. They give you 3% hit AND on top of this reduces the amount of glancing blows by 10% AND reduces the glancing blow dmg reduction. around 10% more white hit dmg from the glancing components reduction. this is insane!

However every following 5 wepskill above 305 that only give 0.5% hit. but you still get the same glancing blow reduction. So the 305-310 wep skill increase is still rly good. (about 3.5% more white hit dmg).

At 310+ however youre getting significantly less improvment to your glancing blow reduction (it still reduces amount of glancings you get, but the dmg reduction of glancing is already capped out at this point), you still get another 0.5% hit thou. The glancing components makes up for only 0,5% white hit dmg at this point.

Tl;dr: First 5wepskill is insane. Worth more than anything by a mile. the glanicng components alone is almost 10% more white hit dmg.
Next 5wep (310) skill is about as good as 3-4% hit.
The last 5 wep skill (315) is at best equally good as 1% hit.
These are not exact values, im not a simbot, just some napkin math done based on existing wepond tables.
Edit: These values are for attacking a boss lvl mob.

[Storfan]

Maybe I'm looking in the wrong areas or i am googling the wrong questions

But can someone explain to me the difference in an item that increases skill with a weapon (assuming you are max 300) vs just flat hit%?

is +5 weapon skill equal to 1% hit?

The function is non-linear. The first 5 points of weapon skill (300 -> 305) gives you 3% hit. After that it falls off quite quickly. In addition to this weapon skill adds several bonuses, glancing blow penalty reduciton, tiny bit of crit, lowering of boss dodge rate etc. Weapon skill is **HANDS DOWN** The most powerful stat you can get as melee in vanilla. Dont stack it past 308 though. After 308 it falls off a steep cliff and becomes pretty bad.

[Svisalith]

I just want to make sure I'm reading this right.

I've got about 9% hit right now and just got edgemasters. If i replace my current gloves with them I'll lose 2% hit. Does that hit get replaced by the added weapon skill? I'm a dwarf so no weapon racial.

Yes, and more.

[Storfan]

I just want to make sure I'm reading this right.

I've got about 9% hit right now and just got edgemasters. If i replace my current gloves with them I'll lose 2% hit. Does that hit get replaced by the added weapon skill? I'm a dwarf so no weapon racial.

+hit added by the 7 skill from edgemasters should be 3.2% (basically 3% from the first 5 points and an additional 0.1% for each extra point of skill past 305).

tldr: Your yellow hitcap against lvl63 bosses with edgemasters is 5.8% instead of 9%. You will never replace those edgemasters basically.

[Numiro]

You will never replace those edgemasters basically.

That's not entirely true, Kel'Thuzad has the +6 sword skill sword, so you'll replace it when you've beat the last raid boss of the game! (But every single melee and tank will compete for that weapon, so in reality you'll never replace it.)

[Storfan]

That's not entirely true, Kel'Thuzad has the +6 sword skill sword, so you'll replace it when you've beat the last raid boss of the game! (But every single melee and tank will compete for that weapon, so in reality you'll never replace it.)

Thus, the use of "Basically". But yes, you might replace them if you get lucky and get THC+Gressil.