The Confederate Roots of "We’re a Republic, not a Democracy"

[Milchshake]

Been hearing the old "we’re a republic, not a democracy" more frequently now? Or arguments against voter rights because "they don't have the smarts or the education"?

Sound familiar? They should. A historian points out that these arguments began in the Antebellum South. And would reappear during Jim Crow and the Civil Rights era.

Why would modern reactionaries cling to these arguments?

Jamelle Bouie’s response to Don Crenshaw’s inevitably dumb defense of the Electoral College contains a useful history of the most famous quasi-intellectual defense:

It’s worth asking where this quip — “we’re a republic, not a democracy” — even came from. Nicole Hemmer, a historian of American politics and the author of “Messengers of the Right: Conservative Media and the Transformation of American Politics,” traces it to the 1930s and 40s. “When Franklin Roosevelt made defending democracy a core component of his argument for preparing for, and then intervening in, the war in Europe, opponents of U.S. intervention began to push back by arguing that the U.S. was not, in fact, a democracy,” she wrote in an email.

One Roosevelt opponent, for example — Boake Carter, a newspaper columnist who supported the America First Committee (which opposed American entry into World War II) — wrote a column in October 1940 called “A Republic Not a Democracy,” in which he strongly rebuked the president for using the word “democracy” to describe the country. “The United States was never a democracy, isn’t a democracy, and I hope it will never be a democracy,” Carter wrote.

The term went from conservative complaint to right-wing slogan in the 1960s, when Robert Welch, the founder of the John Birch Society, used it in a September 1961 speech, “Republics and Democracies.” In a democracy, Welch protested, “there is a centralization of governmental power in a simple majority. And that, visibly, is the system of government which the enemies of our republic are seeking to impose on us today.”

“This is a Republic, not a Democracy,” Welch said in conclusion, “Let’s keep it that way!”

These origins are important. If there’s substance behind “We’re a republic, not a democracy,” it’s not as a description of American government. There’s really no difference, in the present, between a “republic” and a “democracy”: Both connote systems of representation in which sovereignty and authority derive from the public at large.

The point of the slogan isn’t to describe who we are, but to claim and co-opt the founding for right-wing politics — to naturalize political inequality and make it the proper order of things. What lies behind that quip, in other words, is an impulse against democratic representation. It is part and parcel of the drive to make American government a closed domain for a select, privileged few.

It’s always been about suppressing the votes of minorities and limiting federal authority. Anything to uphold existing hierarchies.

[Gestopft]

I've several times pondered which states still wouldn't have their own version of the Civil Rights Act if we'd just left it to the states.

[Captain N]

I've several times pondered which states still wouldn't have their own version of the Civil Rights Act if we'd just left it to the states.

Considering it took them til 2013 for them to officially ratify the 13th Amendment I'm certain Mississippi wouldn't.

[Kaleredar]

Been hearing the old "we’re a republic, not a democracy" more frequently now? Or arguments against voter rights because "they don't have the smarts or the education"?

Sound familiar? They should. A historian points out that these arguments began in the Antebellum South. And would reappear during Jim Crow and the Civil Rights era.

Why would modern reactionaries cling to these arguments?

Jamelle Bouie’s response to Don Crenshaw’s inevitably dumb defense of the Electoral College contains a useful history of the most famous quasi-intellectual defense:

It’s worth asking where this quip — “we’re a republic, not a democracy” — even came from. Nicole Hemmer, a historian of American politics and the author of “Messengers of the Right: Conservative Media and the Transformation of American Politics,” traces it to the 1930s and 40s. “When Franklin Roosevelt made defending democracy a core component of his argument for preparing for, and then intervening in, the war in Europe, opponents of U.S. intervention began to push back by arguing that the U.S. was not, in fact, a democracy,” she wrote in an email.

One Roosevelt opponent, for example — Boake Carter, a newspaper columnist who supported the America First Committee (which opposed American entry into World War II) — wrote a column in October 1940 called “A Republic Not a Democracy,” in which he strongly rebuked the president for using the word “democracy” to describe the country. “The United States was never a democracy, isn’t a democracy, and I hope it will never be a democracy,” Carter wrote.

The term went from conservative complaint to right-wing slogan in the 1960s, when Robert Welch, the founder of the John Birch Society, used it in a September 1961 speech, “Republics and Democracies.” In a democracy, Welch protested, “there is a centralization of governmental power in a simple majority. And that, visibly, is the system of government which the enemies of our republic are seeking to impose on us today.”

“This is a Republic, not a Democracy,” Welch said in conclusion, “Let’s keep it that way!”

These origins are important. If there’s substance behind “We’re a republic, not a democracy,” it’s not as a description of American government. There’s really no difference, in the present, between a “republic” and a “democracy”: Both connote systems of representation in which sovereignty and authority derive from the public at large.

The point of the slogan isn’t to describe who we are, but to claim and co-opt the founding for right-wing politics — to naturalize political inequality and make it the proper order of things. What lies behind that quip, in other words, is an impulse against democratic representation. It is part and parcel of the drive to make American government a closed domain for a select, privileged few.

It’s always been about suppressing the votes of minorities and limiting federal authority. Anything to uphold existing hierarchies.

It's also worth noting that The "America First Committee" had ties to Nazi Germany, who saw the group as a way to keep the US out of their affairs during WW2.

In so many words:




More to the topic at hand, look at the bending over backwards people are doing to defend the electoral college as an institution (because it allowed Bush and Trump to steal victories from the popular vote.) They argue that it "gives smaller states more say," and that "otherwise the vote would only be decided by California and New York!" While, of course, any intelligent individual would realize that no, the popular vote would not do that, because states aren't made up of 100% one political party, while having the electoral college function as is just puts the deciding votes into the scant handful of other swing states. Basically, instead of having California, New York, and Texas "decide" (again, an inaccurate assessment) elections you basically have Florida and Ohio literally decide them instead.

Republicans are "okay" with that because, well, they have more than a snowball's chance in hell in those states, unlike California or New York.

[Mekh]

I mean... Germany is officially a republic too, but they still manage to have every vote count the same, no matter from which state it comes...

So even in the confines of "...not a Democracy", that line of thinking is retarded.

[Wyrt]

A republic is a form of democracy. Specifically one where the people are represented through elected officials.

It's a nonsense statement that doesn't really mean anything.

[ranzino]

A republic is a form of democracy. Specifically one where the people are represented through elected officials.

It's a nonsense statement that doesn't really mean anything.

res publica and demos+kratos are more or less the same, at least by its meaning.
for the easiest example: Greece = Hellenic Republic = Elliniki Dimokratia

[zenkai]

Been hearing the old "we’re a republic, not a democracy" more frequently now? Or arguments against voter rights because "they don't have the smarts or the education"?

.

We're a Democratic Republic, it isn't complicated.

[Vash The Stampede]

Been hearing the old "we’re a republic, not a democracy" more frequently now?

Where, on Fox or CNN? I don't watch TV anymore so I don't know where people get their information from.

Or arguments against voter rights because "they don't have the smarts or the education"?

That is an argument to keep existing people in power, just like any other dictatorship. Remember USSR also stands for Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. The country that we considered to be communist also considered themselves to be a Republic.

Why would modern reactionaries cling to these arguments?

Same reason why these same people call anything they dislike RADICAL, SOCIALIST, and FRINGE because they're trying to push the argument into their favor. It doesn't necessarily need to have a rhyme or reason, just to make you think it does. If we Americans truly consider ourselves a free country then a true Democracy is the bare minimum requirement to be truly free. We the people, not we the few.

It’s always been about suppressing the votes of minorities and limiting federal authority. Anything to uphold existing hierarchies.

That's what they're doing. The idea is to make you believe that the current system is the best system, even if it isn't perfect, and that current system wasn't a Democracy. When in reality our Democracy is broken due to corruption from people like Welch.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

Waaaah! I didn't get the president I wanted!

Time to post about it on the internet




forever.
[Infraction]

[Kallisto]

Republics and Democracies are not mutually exclusive. Those that cry America is a Republic not a Democracy just don't understand what it means to be a republic.

In its simplest terms, but not being a monarchy you are a republic. Doesn't matter if you're democratic or not. (Countries like North Korea and Syria having head of nation handed down from Father to son basically makes tham absolute monarchies in all but name).

Sweden/Norway/Denmark/Netherlands/Belgium = Consitutional (Democratic) Monarchies
Germany/USA/France/Austria = Democratic Republics

[smityx]

Democratic Republic

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_republic