Seems Velonara picks to stay with horde.

[mickybrighteyes]

The biggest problem here seems that by making such followers like Dark Rangers bail on Sylvanas this easily it makes the previous confrontations against loyalist labeled figures worse.

[VladlTutushkin]

We maintain the trend that Garry's followers got to die with dignity, whereas the Forsaken get to be Calia-ized, truly a fate worse than death. So far so standard. There are some other interesting things in there though.

The first is that this is one case where we can see how the loyalist questline has shifted story intent a bit. Things like the whispers from the Former Loyalists and the Dark Ranger who got tipped off by Sylvanas on the possible outcome of the Mak'gora were not originally intended, and thus the Forsaken change of heart was meant to be total. But we know that Sylvanas informed at least some of her dark rangers of what could've happened when she left and now they have to work this in by way of having Velonara reference that some left, but others remained, despite it not quite gelling that she left them if the Dark Rangers weren't actually abandoned but were in on her plans as 8.2.5 shows us with Lenara. I would advise everyone to contain their expectations when it comes to Sylvanas sleeper agents - they might crop up, but they were not an intended plot point in the original draft of this.

The second point is what @VladlTutushkin mentions. That Sylvanas's closest followers are apparently willingly to ditch her immediately, even with some of them being in the know, and stick with both the Horde and, crucially with Velonara, the blood elves, so their living identity, makes what's been done with Delaryn and the night elven dark rangers even more insulting. Firstly that they need Calia to set them right when those who were much closer to Sylvanas didn't and second that they're being herded into the Forsaken, despite the reclamation of identity that both the Lordaeronian humans and the Thalassian dark rangers are going on meaning that it would make the most sense fro them to return to their race, as both Maiev and Tyrande offered.

Exactly. The fact that Velonara chose her past as a blood elf and Forsaken and Horde member over loyalty to Sylvanas shows that Delaryn shound have chosen her past as a night elf and Alliance member and simply rejoined her faction and her peolle instead of hanging with Calia of all people and being more emo about that then original emo archers.

- - - Updated - - -

It can still happen. We know that Calia will not join forsaken from an interview and she already meetup with the undead sentinels.

I am not sure. They most likely will stay Horde just as one more “fuck you” from Blizz to Alliance and night elfs.

[Gaidax]

Not every Dark Ranger is some beta hivemind drone.

[VladlTutushkin]

Not every Dark Ranger is some beta hivemind drone.

*Nathanos disliked this message*

[Verdugo]

Not every Dark Ranger is some beta hivemind drone.

Those that dont follow Church of Anduin sure are not.

[mickybrighteyes]

Not every Dark Ranger is some beta hivemind drone.

That's fine, but they still treated groups that might be loyal to Sylvanas as far more loyal than this bullshit and general justification for fighting to the death. If Sylvanas' pet Dark Rangers are this easy to turn... why then go through the trouble of killing hoards of guards who aren't anywhere near as emotionally or physically invested in the Dark Lady?

[TrueHorde]

They were also deluded by Sylvanas.

How many Dark Rangers were killed by Baine and Saurfang? Won't Baine be ashamed of it?

[Claymore]

So. Dark Rangers who served Sylvanas for years and were her most trusted elite can defect from her to the Horde. While undead night elfs who were risen out of spite and have no purpose in the Horde cant defect to Alliance?

Honestly, this is something Blizzard needs to address, or maybe even retcon entirely. It clearly goes against all established lore.

As dumb as it sounds, this was honestly the final straw for me, personally. I understand that Blizzard always follows "the rule of cool" when it comes to deciding where the story should go next, but this specific instance was just *SO* broken and at-odds with previously-established, HIGHLY IMPORTANT lore.

[Maljinwo]

But this line is actually funny.



Spit to famous Sylvanas quote.

Fitting, considering Sylvanas was the cause of the torment to a great deal of her people

[eurojust]

I don't even get why these kind of people didn't immedialty get back to Silvermoon once they were raised in the first palce.
"Yea Sylvanas turned me into an undead and cursed me, i'm going to follow her".
WTF

[Tarba]

Hmmm why does she side with Baine then? He is only loyal to himself and killed more forsaken and horde soldiers than Sylvanas.

[Zuben]

Good. I still don't appreciate how Sylvanas was handled in the end, but since the situation is what it is I'm happy the Forsaken ranks won't be crushed by it. With the likes of Belmont and Velonara taking care of their own branches the faction can go on without a central figure calling the shots.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Who’s going to be honestly surprised come shadowlands if Velonara goes “for the dark lady” and back stabs some idiot that took her at her word?

[Newname1234567890]

Disappointing. I don’t see why anyone would want to be part of the Horde at this stage. With Baine as Warchief it’s all but under the Alliance’s boot.

If wow was real you absolutely would verus the women who started a global war to kill as many people from all sides as possible

[Raisei]

Excellent, at least the NPCs are capable of seeing what was happening.

[MatthiasVonTzeskagrad]

They were also deluded by Sylvanas.

How many Dark Rangers were killed by Baine and Saurfang? Won't Baine be ashamed of it?

In order to be ashamed, you have to have shame on the first place.
And by helping even quillboars more than his fellow people, you pretty much know how much shame does Baine have.

[Artelia]

does she do that whisper shit supporting sylvanas if you're a loyalist?

some of the "former" loyalists do that in orgrimmar.

if she doesn't though, i'm glad to see some of them are staying on our side.

What is your side? Alliance puppet or Alliance? Because there is no other side...

[Varitok]

Personality cults tend to do that.

No one heeded the words of Living Colour

- - - Updated - - -

This fanbase, much like Arthas, is beyond redemption.

[Thage]

Good. I still don't appreciate how Sylvanas was handled in the end, but since the situation is what it is I'm happy the Forsaken ranks won't be crushed by it. With the likes of Belmont and Velonara taking care of their own branches the faction can go on without a central figure calling the shots.

One good thing that came of Sylvanas's leadership: the various branches (Deathguards, Darkstalkers, Dark Rangers, etc.) are used to being highly compartmentalized, meaning they can operate efficiently without needing a central figure coordinating everything. With Lillian filling the role Rok'han does (giving the Forsaken a voice in the Council), that also addresses any concerns the Forsaken might have about not having a say in the Horde going forward.

However, Blizzard really needs to take some time and have someone step up and lead the orcs, and Forsaken. Two of the original four Horde races are leaderless and running on cobbled-together temporary governments, or without any central government at all and are just focused on day to day survival. Hell, the blood elves are still running on a regency that was supposed to be a short-term stopgap while they dealt with their near-extinction, the Mag'har haven't appointed a new Warchief officially, and the vulpera don't have any recognizable structure in their society (again, a matter of necessity considering the situation we found them in). But instead of focus on this, Blizz just keeps throwing Horde characters into the meat grinder and putting power-mad tyrants in charge to drive the plot forward every time they run out of ideas, leaving the Horde a broken mess of temporary and incomplete governments, in some cases for over a decade.

edit: Had forgotten Rokhan officially took up being the Darkspear chieftain, finally giving them a leader after going completely leaderless since Vol'jin's death. The orcs remain without a leader, and the Forsaken are managing well enough for now but should find a permanent form of government, ditto the blood elves.

[Friendlyimmolation]

In order to be ashamed, you have to have shame on the first place.
And by helping even quillboars more than his fellow people, you pretty much know how much shame does Baine have.

Lies and slander, Baine feels great shame every time the Horde raised a hand against the alliance