Why is Blizzard taking all the bad ideas that they can find and implementing them?

[Depakote]

Mythic + Dungeons
Mythic Raids
Cross Realm crap
Level Squish
Talent Tree removed
PvP vendors removed
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed
Gutting class abilities
Removing Tier sets

I could go on but I think that's enough for now...
Why are they doing all of this? Do they not realize that removing all these things & implementing the changes they have now has made people quit playing the game? Do they just want to stop making the game? Do they not care about fun anymore?

[Nnyco]

Most of those things are good changes, stop crying.

[Depakote]

Those that insult first make it clear they have 0 rebuttal to what the person had said.
Thanks for making it clear where you stand.

[Seranthor]

Mythic + Dungeons
Mythic Raids
Cross Realm crap
Level Squish
Talent Tree removed
PvP vendors removed
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed
Gutting class abilities
Removing Tier sets

I could go on but I think that's enough for now...
Why are they doing all of this? Do they not realize that removing all these things & implementing the changes they have now has made people quit playing the game? Do they just want to stop making the game? Do they not care about fun anymore?

Ignoring the merits of the changes in each of those things. Do you have any real evidence that the removal of one or more of those things is what has caused people to quit? or are you just making it up? Also, one has to wonder who made you the arbiter of what 'fun' is?

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Those that insult first make it clear they have 0 rebuttal to what the person had said.
Thanks for making it clear where you stand.

who is 'insulting' you?

[Dimmak]

Mythic + Dungeons - Love these - why would ever get rid of these? Do you want to go back to grinding badges from BC?
Mythic Raids - Something to do while we wait for the next patch and an actual hard goal after you already cleared the storyline level?
Cross Realm crap - Maybe you have forgotten the horror of adventuring alone for hours and hours and hours... or not being able to get a tank....
Level Squish - I could take it or leave it. I lean towards a squish because 120 levels is getting unwieldy.
Talent Tree removed - yes I really want to spend 5 levels of +1 % parry to unlock a +5% to damage....
PvP vendors removed - These should be added back in
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed - meh? We'll get a new currency
Gutting class abilities - They prune and add all the time. Current classes are way better than classes from 10 years ago. Are there abilities I want back? Yes and I expect some of them to return.
Removing Tier sets - I was torn on this at first but to be honest it's something I am glad that is gone. It really sucked to not be able to use a piece of gear because it broke your set piece. I like getting new gear on a semiregular basis. Waiting weeks and weeks for a piece sucks.

So the real question is, why does blizzard implement changes? Because sometimes they are needed and sometimes nostalgia isn't enough to keep something that doesn't work around.

[Nnyco]

who is 'insulting' you?

We told him to stop crying, clearly thats the biggest insult ever and totally not justified since this is definitly not a QQ thread.

[JustaWarlock]

Removing Tier sets - I was torn on this at first but to be honest it's something I am glad that is gone. It really sucked to not be able to use a piece of gear because it broke your set piece. I like getting new gear on a semiregular basis. Waiting weeks and weeks for a piece sucks.
.

Lol. Except now you can't use a piece of gear because it's not socketed. Or titanforged. Or it's an ilvl upgrade but you have to regrind more AP to unlock the same ability you already had.

Collecting your tier set was one of the best things about farming raid instances.

[Depakote]

Ignoring the merits of the changes in each of those things. Do you have any real evidence that the removal of one or more of those things is what has caused people to quit? or are you just making it up? Also, one has to wonder who made you the arbiter of what 'fun' is?

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who is 'insulting' you?

Anyone who tells someone to stop crying is clearly insulting the person by dismissing any kind of argument they might have.
I am not the one who decides what's fun, I just pay attention to the sub numbers. FUNFACT: They've been down for quite a long time
Anything else of value to add?

[united]

Those that insult first make it clear they have 0 rebuttal to what the person had said.
Thanks for making it clear where you stand.

It’s all most posters on here do. Bring in the insults, toxicity, and harassment when they can’t think of an actual argument to something that they disagree with.

[Seranthor]

Anyone who tells someone to stop crying is clearly insulting the person by dismissing any kind of argument they might have.
I am not the one who decides what's fun, I just pay attention to the sub numbers. FUNFACT: They've been down for quite a long time
Anything else of value to add?

Your arguments deserve to be dismissed, out of hand without hesitation. Why? Because without proof they are baseless. One could just as easily say that subs are dropping because Blizzard hasn't permabanned the folks that continually carpet bomb the forums with baseless tears. Congratulations. You've found a correlation, and so did I. Are we both right? Are we both wrong? or, are you going to present some real evidence (your tears aren't admissible as evidence).

[Depakote]

Mythic + Dungeons - Love these - why would ever get rid of these? Do you want to go back to grinding badges from BC? *yes i do, that way i might actually be able to get something that's useful to my class, not pray to the rng gods that i get any gear at alll*
Mythic Raids - Something to do while we wait for the next patch and an actual hard goal after you already cleared the storyline level? *What do you think questing is for?
Cross Realm crap - Maybe you have forgotten the horror of adventuring alone for hours and hours and hours... or not being able to get a tank.... No i don't remember any of that, or not being able to get a tank.
Level Squish - I could take it or leave it. I lean towards a squish because 120 levels is getting unwieldy. If they actually added more talents to the bar or actually put the talent trees back in with new talents & points then those 120 levels wouldn't matter as much. Besides leveling as it is now takes 0 time at all.
Talent Tree removed - yes I really want to spend 5 levels of +1 % parry to unlock a +5% to damage.... That's called immersion.
P[/B]vP vendors removed - These should be added back in *glad we agree on something
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed - meh? We'll get a new currency Not every currency should be brand new every expansion. These provide the easiest way to gear for both pvp and pve content for anyone and everyone.
Gutting class abilities - They prune and add all the time. Current classes are way better than classes from 10 years ago. Are there abilities I want back? Yes and I expect some of them to return. Bit hard to take you seriously on this one, That's just a laughable claim.
Removing Tier sets - I was torn on this at first but to be honest it's something I am glad that is gone. It really sucked to not be able to use a piece of gear because it broke your set piece. I like getting new gear on a semiregular basis. Waiting weeks and weeks for a piece sucks. Oh you mean now it is now with mythic raiding, grinding all those points to buy a piece from one of those ehterial (spelling?) vendors, right?

So the real question is, why does blizzard implement changes? Because sometimes they are needed and sometimes nostalgia isn't enough to keep something that doesn't work around.

replies in bold up above.

[MrHappy]

Mythic + Dungeons: Translation: I can't find a group that will clear a +10
Mythic Raids: Translation: I keep getting sat for Mythic progression
Cross Realm crap: Translation I want to keep war mode on for lootz but I keep getting camped by alliance and refuse to turn it off
Level Squish: Translation : I like big numbers without meaning vs meaningful numbers
Talent Tree removed: Translation : I had more fun putting reduce cast speed by 0.2sec 5 times compared to getting an new ability which is purely subjective feel
PvP vendors removed: Translation: I can't do rated pvp so at least I was able to farm for months doing BG's to buy something. Ok fair enough this one gets you .5 of a point
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed: Translation: I miss grinding dungeons for raid gear. We have a better vendor system now quit complaining.
Gutting class abilities - this is a mixed point. Truthfully it was a bit much having 12 button rotation in Wrath as destro lock and some pruning needed to be done. There is such a thing as too many buttons. each looses meaning and impact if there are too many.
Removing Tier sets - Azerite gear is build-a-bear of tier sets. Sure farming them was something raids needed to have but personally i'm neutral on this one.

I could go on but I think that's enough for now... No please go on as so far you didn't bring up anything meaningful outside of your personal opinion on things that you don't like but actually a great benefit to longevity of the game.

Why are they doing all of this? Because they are thinking about the longevity of the game not immediate gratification.

Do they not realize that removing all these things & implementing the changes they have now has made people quit playing the game? Do you realize that this is just hyperbole and your personal opinion and does not reflect the real world.

Do they just want to stop making the game? Do they not care about fun anymore? Do you just want to make click bait threads? Do you have any valid critisim and ways to improve it beyond "i liked it how it was in the past...except people bitched and whined about the very things when they were current but I don't remember that because it doesn't prove my point"

[Depakote]

Your arguments deserve to be dismissed, out of hand without hesitation. Why? Because without proof they are baseless. One could just as easily say that subs are dropping because Blizzard hasn't permabanned the folks that continually carpet bomb the forums with baseless tears. Congratulations. You've found a correlation, and so did I. Are we both right? Are we both wrong? or, are you going to present some real evidence (your tears aren't admissible as evidence).

So your 'proof' is to be a dick and dismiss my claims clear prejudice. Got it!

- - - Updated - - -

Mythic + Dungeons: Translation: I can't find a group that will clear a +10
Mythic Raids: Translation: I keep getting sat for Mythic progression
Cross Realm crap: Translation I want to keep war mode on for lootz but I keep getting camped by alliance and refuse to turn it off
Level Squish: Translation : I like big numbers without meaning vs meaningful numbers
Talent Tree removed: Translation : I had more fun putting reduce cast speed by 0.2sec 5 times compared to getting an new ability which is purely subjective feel
PvP vendors removed: Translation: I can't do rated pvp so at least I was able to farm for months doing BG's to buy something. Ok fair enough this one gets you .5 of a point
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed: Translation: I miss grinding dungeons for raid gear. We have a better vendor system now quit complaining.
Gutting class abilities - this is a mixed point. Truthfully it was a bit much having 12 button rotation in Wrath as destro lock and some pruning needed to be done. There is such a thing as too many buttons. each looses meaning and impact if there are too many.
Removing Tier sets - Azerite gear is build-a-bear of tier sets. Sure farming them was something raids needed to have but personally i'm neutral on this one.

I could go on but I think that's enough for now... No please go on as so far you didn't bring up anything meaningful outside of your personal opinion on things that you don't like but actually a great benefit to longevity of the game.

Why are they doing all of this? Because they are thinking about the longevity of the game not immediate gratification.

Do they not realize that removing all these things & implementing the changes they have now has made people quit playing the game? Do you realize that this is just hyperbole and your personal opinion and does not reflect the real world.

Do they just want to stop making the game? Do they not care about fun anymore? Do you just want to make click bait threads? Do you have any valid critisim and ways to improve it beyond "i liked it how it was in the past...except people bitched and whined about the very things when they were current but I don't remember that because it doesn't prove my point"

Please don't take what i've said and twist it to mean something else. It's rather childish.

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It’s all most posters on here do. Bring in the insults, toxicity, and harassment when they can’t think of an actual argument to something that they disagree with.

Sad but true.

[Shelly]

Lol. Except now you can't use a piece of gear because it's not socketed. Or titanforged. Or it's an ilvl upgrade but you have to regrind more AP to unlock the same ability you already had.

Collecting your tier set was one of the best things about farming raid instances.

The italicized part hasn't been an issue for over 6 months now.

The rest of your complaint, if you can't use it because it's not socketed or titanforged, well in those cases you already have something better there and it's no different than any other piece of gear you get that you can't use.

I do wish that tier sets would return, but frankly your complaints aren't much.

If your complaint about the lack of tier sets is because you wanted to farm up set bonuses - well we now have azerite traits which are equally powerful and can lead to changing up your gameplay.

If your complaint about lack of tier is because it doesn't give you as many transmog options - I get this but frankly anyone that's a transmog hunter doesn't really care so much about current raids because they are waiting for Shadowlands to come and legacy loot mode to be enabled for Legion. As well as worrying about how to get the warfront transmog gear once BfA is over.

[Seranthor]

So your 'proof' is to be a dick and dismiss my claims clear prejudice. Got it!

Reeeee... you didn't agree with me and you dared to call me out... so I'm going to reeeeeeee and call you names instead of backing up my claims.

And if exposing you is being a 'dick' then I plead guilty.

[THevil30]

Anyone who tells someone to stop crying is clearly insulting the person by dismissing any kind of argument they might have.
I am not the one who decides what's fun, I just pay attention to the sub numbers. FUNFACT: They've been down for quite a long time
Anything else of value to add?

But you didn't make an argument. You said "these are bad ideas, why is blizzard implementing them?"

But you listed a whole series of features that I think the vast majority of people would say are pretty good? Like Blizz has done plenty of dumb shit recently. Titanforging is dumb where it is, GCD change made the game less fun, AP grind is terrible.

But who doesn't like M+? If you enjoy challenging end game content, but don't have time or stability to be part of a raid group M+ is a godsend. When I was in high school in Wrath I could easily dedicate 3 fixed nights a week to raiding. Nowadays I have shit to do and can't do that anymore. So the ability to run M+ with my 4 friends who play WoW has been a godsend. And if you don't like the content, you don't have to do it.

As for mythic raiding: what do you not like about it? It's something that has been in the game in one form or another since Ulduar. Used to be that Normal was the equivalent of today's heroic, and heroic was the equivalent of today's mythic. It's just more challenging content for the people who want it. If you aren't into it, like the vast majority of players, it just doesn't affect you.

Cross Realm "crap": IMO this is one of the best changes that blizz has added to the game. I don't really see any downsides except for less realm community. But the tradeoff for less realm community is that you no longer have to spend an hour in Dal spamming "LF1M TANK for ICC 3/12 down, on Saurfang, quick fun clear!" Also, now when you make friends in real life with someone and find out that they play WoW, you can play with them together. The next thing they need to do is add cross-faction play, and I will be happy. Making it easier to play with your friends is always a good thing IMO.

Level Squish this isn't really good or bad. It doesn't affect anything at all. It makes it less daunting to play the game. Plus, who wants to play in Outland these days?

Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed
These were nice catchup mechanics, but theyve been replaced by world quests. Either one was pretty much "grind X, get gear."

Gutting class abilities OK you got me on this one, this was a bad call by Blizz. But it seems they're rolling it back in Shadowlands.

Removing Tier sets Tier sets were cool. I'd like these back. Not a gamebreaker though.

All in all, most of the changes you listed made it IMO easier for people to get into the game, and made it more likely that people will stick around. I can't imagine who says to themselves "well fuck they added a tier of raiding that I am not gonna do, fuck this game I quit."

[Kyphael]

Mythic + Dungeons: Don't care, I don't over indulge on "ultra hard levels" of any game.
Mythic Raids: Don't care, even when I was a raider, hardly ever did Heroics, was satisfied being Kingslayer, didn't need Bane.
Cross Realm crap: How is this crap? It's widening your player pool base. If we're never getting cross-faction play, we absolutely needed this.
Level Squish: I agree with you, unnecessary.
Talent Tree removed: Eh.
PvP vendors removed: I haven't PVP'ed since Mists of Pandaria, so meh.
Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed: I don't really care where I get my gear from, it's interchangeable anyway.
Gutting class abilities: You mean pruning? 36 simple classes is more interesting than 12 classes whose design is not all that to begin with, even if a Fire mage has frostbolt.
Removing Tier sets: People kept complaining tiers got ugly with every new addition anyway, and people transmog more often than not anyway. Tiers were retired for good reason. I like raid or zone themed sets.

[THevil30]

I just pay attention to the sub numbers. FUNFACT: They've been down for quite a long time
Anything else of value to add?

No you don't. Blizz hasn't released sub numbers in like 4 years. You have no idea whether they've gone down or not. For all we know, with WoW Classic in the mix, they might be back up to 10 mil now. (They probably aren't but you have literally no way to know.)

[Depakote]

But you didn't make an argument. You said "these are bad ideas, why is blizzard implementing them?"

But you listed a whole series of features that I think the vast majority of people would say are pretty good? Like Blizz has done plenty of dumb shit recently. Titanforging is dumb where it is, GCD change made the game less fun, AP grind is terrible.

But who doesn't like M+? If you enjoy challenging end game content, but don't have time or stability to be part of a raid group M+ is a godsend. When I was in high school in Wrath I could easily dedicate 3 fixed nights a week to raiding. Nowadays I have shit to do and can't do that anymore. So the ability to run M+ with my 4 friends who play WoW has been a godsend. And if you don't like the content, you don't have to do it.

As for mythic raiding: what do you not like about it? It's something that has been in the game in one form or another since Ulduar. Used to be that Normal was the equivalent of today's heroic, and heroic was the equivalent of today's mythic. It's just more challenging content for the people who want it. If you aren't into it, like the vast majority of players, it just doesn't affect you.

Cross Realm "crap": IMO this is one of the best changes that blizz has added to the game. I don't really see any downsides except for less realm community. But the tradeoff for less realm community is that you no longer have to spend an hour in Dal spamming "LF1M TANK for ICC 3/12 down, on Saurfang, quick fun clear!" Also, now when you make friends in real life with someone and find out that they play WoW, you can play with them together. The next thing they need to do is add cross-faction play, and I will be happy. Making it easier to play with your friends is always a good thing IMO.

Level Squish this isn't really good or bad. It doesn't affect anything at all. It makes it less daunting to play the game. Plus, who wants to play in Outland these days?

Honor, Conquest, Valor and Justice points removed
These were nice catchup mechanics, but theyve been replaced by world quests. Either one was pretty much "grind X, get gear."

Gutting class abilities OK you got me on this one, this was a bad call by Blizz. But it seems they're rolling it back in Shadowlands.

Removing Tier sets Tier sets were cool. I'd like these back. Not a gamebreaker though.

All in all, most of the changes you listed made it IMO easier for people to get into the game, and made it more likely that people will stick around. I can't imagine who says to themselves "well fuck they added a tier of raiding that I am not gonna do, fuck this game I quit."

Mythic Raiding has not been in the game since ulduar. Those were hard mode bosses, not actual mythic raiding. As for why i dislike both mythic plus and mythic raids, two arguments for each, i'll start with dungeons first. They're a needless grind that imo provides much more toxicity then the game has ever been filled with. Not only that but if you don't have a certain level key or the right ilvl good luck getting a group for anything. As for mythic raids.. I haven't looked on the data of how many people actually do these for awhile so it might be out of date but with that being said i don't think many people do them. What did realm firsts & hard mode fights do that mythic doesnt?
Cross realm has killed any sense of community a realm had. IF you can't understand that then i don't know what to tell you.
The level squish actually does a lot to the story of wow and how you put it all together. From a new players point of view i'd be pretty confused if i went from Classic to WoD as i'd have no idea why things are the way they are now.
Ya, world quests, the things that most people loathe or totally skip over for various reasons.
The points you mention weren't used for catch up. honor and conquest were used to by pvp gear, justice and valor for pve and some of the piece that were able to be purchases with that stuff were tier set pieces & good gear you couldn't get from anywhere else.
Tier sets were actually what helped classes bring out their identity. It's funny they talk about class identity now yet they removed one of the biggest features that does that.

[Nefarious Tea]

The italicized part hasn't been an issue for over 6 months now.

It never should have been an issue on the first place!

The ENTIRE azerite system shows that blizzard neither did any quality control nor did they think ahead on how the system might affect players.