Sanders Apologizes For Alleging That Biden is Corrupt

[starlord]

Which means our voting system is broken and needs changes. Would Hillary have fixed it, or once she won she would have done what Trump does and do nothing about it? Trump also complained about our voting system and has does nothing so far to fix it. Also getting 2.1% more votes than Trump is not something to be proud of. Imagine if Hillary ran against a competent Republican candidate?

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Both of the Roosevelt's were awesome. FDR was the best and we take what he's done for granted.

you guys don't seem very familiar with what her platform actually was & just bought into right wing talking points.
and presidential elections are typically won by very small margins- hers just weren't in the right geographic locations. so 2016 wasn't some mandate against dems in general that you think.

there were plenty of "competent" candidates who ran against trump, but they did not win the nomination. likewise there were many young, progressive candidates running for this years race, and most of them have been sidelined already.
this is not due to "corruption", its just not enough voters liked them.
but keep not voting if you want and see where that gets you.

[Milchshake]

you guys don't seem very familiar with what her platform actually was & just bought into right wing talking points.
and presidential elections are typically won by very small margins- hers just weren't in the right geographic locations. so 2016 wasn't some mandate against dems in general that you think.

there were plenty of "competent" candidates who ran against trump, but they did not win the nomination. likewise there were many young, progressive candidates running for this years race, and most of them have been sidelined already.
this is not due to "corruption", its just not enough voters liked them.
but keep not voting if you want and see where that gets you.

A short version. Hillary was explicitly for laws that would correct Citizens United. Which seems very obvious on its face.

But unless Joe Rogan talks about Citizens United, the bros wouldn't even know it exists.

[GreenJesus]

clinton won the popular vote, so...

Yes, because she spent her time doing fundraiser dinners in California and doing laps around already heavily democratic areas instead of doing rallies and going door to door in the midwest and rural areas. Trump's campaign actually knew how to play the game. Hillary was so focused on getting resources, she didn't notice the backdoor destroying her base.

[starlord]

Yes, because she spent her time doing fundraiser dinners in California and doing laps around already heavily democratic areas instead of doing rallies and going door to door in the midwest and rural areas.

yea it makes perfect sense that she was so awful that the majority of people voted for her.

so we have two competing narratives here;
clinton lost because she didnt appeal to left wingers enough
and
clinton lost because she didnt appeal to conservative rural voters enough.

[Vash The Stampede]

yea it makes perfect sense that she was so awful that the majority of people voted for her.

so we have two competing narratives here;
clinton lost because she didnt appeal to left wingers enough
and
clinton lost because she didnt appeal to conservative rural voters enough.

Clinton lost because.
A. She had given private speeches to elite financial firms telling them how she's going to balance the budget by cutting Social Security.
B. She wasn't a supporter of free healthcare until Bernie forced her to.
C. She wanted to start a war.

Not only Hillary didn't appeal to the left, she basically took a dump on them. Her campaign took it easy because she thought the Bernie Bros would vote for her and that obviously didn't happen. Just cause they're democrat doesn't mean they have to vote for you.

[Gestopft]

Imagine if Hillary ran against a competent Republican candidate?

Actually she might have had a better chance. Trump got to be the outsider, the anti-establishment 'change' candidate. Would Ted Cruz or Jeb Bush have gotten the "Obama-Obama-Trump" voters that swung the election towards Trump?

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you guys don't seem very familiar with what her platform actually was

Unfortunately for her, most people weren't. Didn't help that the so called "Liberal" media talked mostly about her scandals (and nontroversies) so much and never really talked much about what she'd actually do. Both candidates were unpopular, but people actually had an idea of exactly what Trump stood for when they went to vote. Hillary? If you didn't pay close attention, you may not have.

[Wyrt]

so we have two competing narratives here;
clinton lost because she didnt appeal to left wingers enough
and
clinton lost because she didnt appeal to conservative rural voters enough.

Or it's the same narrative.

Young, left wing millennials/gen z have been suffering economically under the status quo for over a decade now.

Rural conservative voters have also been suffering economically under the status quo for longer than a decade now.

I don't know if you got it yet, but if you haven't, the biggest thing Trump voters have been shouting since 2015 is "FUCK THE STATUS QUO" and Trump was their grenade they tossed in there. It did not help them, at all, but their votes were in large part due to frustration.

[arandomuser]

Or it's the same narrative.

Young, left wing millennials/gen z have been suffering economically under the status quo for over a decade now.

Rural conservative voters have also been suffering economically under the status quo for longer than a decade now.

I don't know if you got it yet, but if you haven't, the biggest thing Trump voters have been shouting since 2015 is "FUCK THE STATUS QUO" and Trump was their grenade they tossed in there. It did not help them, at all, but their votes were in large part due to frustration.

nobody is suffering under the status quo, do you live on a farm and have to shit in an outhouse like they did 100 years ago? Rather be here on a video game forum than that shit, and you know who i have to thank that we've come this far? neoliberal capitalism.
the thing they hate that we've strayed from is they hate diversity, thats basically it, and no im sick of feeling sympathy for the "forgotten man" he has it just fucking fine historically, he just has "anxiety" because people look different then when he grew up.

Im a white man, and i am not rich, and i feel absolutely no hate towards the status quo i think its great for me, so i think i can tell my peers to stop loathing and enjoy the great world neoliberalism gave us and know it will only get better if they stop interfering. Or maybe they can go live with the amish if they think its so great

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Actually she might have had a better chance. Trump got to be the outsider, the anti-establishment 'change' candidate. Would Ted Cruz or Jeb Bush have gotten the "Obama-Obama-Trump" voters that swung the election towards Trump?

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Yeah why the hell couldnt they of picked bush? same exact policies, exxcept i dont know bush wouldnt accept help from russia to win the election, and id consider him a legitimate president. But then again george bush actually built a wall while simultaneously letting in 2 million legal immigrants, while trump has dismantled our entire LEGAL immigration system so we get 70% fewer immigrants..makes you wonder what really was the motivation for his support in the primary

[Mormolyce]

Biden isn't corrupt. Well, any more than most American politicians.

What he is is a fucking terrible candidate who would've been out of date 30 years ago. Why the media insists on pushing him is a mystery.

Actually, no it isn't, he's the most right wing candidate least likely to upset their corporate masters.

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Clinton lost because.
A. She had given private speeches to elite financial firms telling them how she's going to balance the budget by cutting Social Security.
B. She wasn't a supporter of free healthcare until Bernie forced her to.
C. She wanted to start a war.

My problem with any explanation "Hillary lost because X" is that you then have to show how X would naturally lead to a candidate getting more votes than their opponent but still not taking office.

[Vash The Stampede]

My problem with any explanation "Hillary lost because X" is that you then have to show how X would naturally lead to a candidate getting more votes than their opponent but still not taking office.

Al Gore had this same problem, and the reality is our voting system is broken because we give more voting power to lower populated states than higher populated ones. This is how you can win the popular vote but still lose the election. But this is more of a problem when the votes come down to 50/50. As great as it is to say that Hillary won the popular vote, she only won by 2.1%. That's more like a margin of error, not a flat out win. If you want to get technical then yes Hillary should have won, but the reality is that Americans hated both candidates equally. I'm personally glad that Hillary lost because now we have a second chance for Bernie Sanders. If you don't want 4 more years of Trump then vote for Bernie.

[starlord]

Or it's the same narrative.

Young, left wing millennials/gen z have been suffering economically under the status quo for over a decade now.

Rural conservative voters have also been suffering economically under the status quo for longer than a decade now.

I don't know if you got it yet, but if you haven't, the biggest thing Trump voters have been shouting since 2015 is "FUCK THE STATUS QUO" and Trump was their grenade they tossed in there. It did not help them, at all, but their votes were in large part due to frustration.

everyone's got their own personal theory they pulled out of their... hat... about why she lost. usually its "whatever issue i personally had." and yet somehow she still appealed to the majority of voters.
people were so tired of the status quo that most of them voted for the status quo?

you guys shriek about status quo while ignoring her actual platform. because you couldnt be bothered to do more than follow some quick and easy sound bites to do the thinking for you. that is why bernie supporters are so like trumpsters.

[Vash The Stampede]

everyone's got their own personal theory they pulled out of their... hat... about why she lost. usually its "whatever issue i personally had." and yet somehow she still appealed to the majority of voters.
people were so tired of the status quo that most of them voted for the status quo?

She appealed to the majority that she failed to win? She failed because Trump offered methods to bring better quality paying jobs while Hillary didn't. As Yanis Varoufakis put it, "This idiocy of the democratic party that Putin won the election against Hillary Clinton. Come on Wake Up! You cannot say to Trump voters that they're idiots and Putin duped them. I mean.. you can say that but that's it you lose them forever. And it's also not true. People say to me how do you explain how Trump won. I'm an economist so I look at numbers, the number that's most spectacular in this country is 2016 more than half of the families in this country, could not afford the cheapest new car which was $14k. Either they didn't have the money, or they did have the money but didn't have the credit rating necessary to borrow $14k. More than half the families couldn't afford the cheapest car. That's why Trump got elected, because Obama failed spectacularly to shift the burdens of the financial crisis onto the 0.1%."

you guys shriek about status quo while ignoring her actual platform. because you couldnt be bothered to do more than follow some quick and easy sound bites to do the thinking for you. that is why bernie supporters are so like trumpsters.

And who does the thinking for you? CNN?

[starlord]

She appealed to the majority that she failed to win? She failed because Trump offered methods to bring better quality paying jobs while Hillary didn't. [url=https://youtu.be/gGeevtdp1WQ?t=2904]As Yanis Varoufakis put it, "This idiocy of the democratic party that Putin won the election against Hillary Clinton. Come on Wake Up! You cannot say to Trump voters that they're idiots and Putin duped them. I mean.. you can say that but that's it you lose them forever. And it's also not true. People say to me how do you explain how Trump won. I'm an economist so I look at numbers, the number that's most spectacular in this country is 2016 more than half of the families in this country, could not afford the cheapest new car which was $14k. Either they didn't have the money, or they did have the money but didn't have the credit rating necessary to borrow $14k. More than half the families couldn't afford the cheapest car. That's why Trump got elected, because Obama failed spectacularly to shift the burdens of the financial crisis onto the 0.1%."

her loss came down to a hanful of voters in a handful of states. anyone who claims to know exactly what caused that is bullshitting. you know what studies have shown is a large impact on who people vote for? the candidates appearance lol.

And who does the thinking for you? CNN?

no i actually look at candidates platform and decide for myself instead of being uninformed.

[Wyrt]

nobody is suffering under the status quo, do you live on a farm and have to shit in an outhouse like they did 100 years ago? Rather be here on a video game forum than that shit, and you know who i have to thank that we've come this far? neoliberal capitalism.
the thing they hate that we've strayed from is they hate diversity, thats basically it, and no im sick of feeling sympathy for the "forgotten man" he has it just fucking fine historically, he just has "anxiety" because people look different then when he grew up.

Im a white man, and i am not rich, and i feel absolutely no hate towards the status quo i think its great for me, so i think i can tell my peers to stop loathing and enjoy the great world neoliberalism gave us and know it will only get better if they stop interfering. Or maybe they can go live with the amish if they think its so great

Except it's not just racist rural folk who are suffering.

Millennials are struggling with school loans, being unable to find well paying jobs, being unable to afford a home or start a family, being unable to afford medical expenses, etc.

And no, they don't have it "Just fine historically." Millennials are worse off than previous generations. They're more educated, work harder and longer, and are worse off because of it.

[Moadar]

Bernie should have stuck to his guns. Hes playing a game rigged in Bidens favor.

[Vash The Stampede]

her loss came down to a hanful of voters in a handful of states. anyone who claims to know exactly what caused that is bullshitting. you know what studies have shown is a large impact on who people vote for? the candidates appearance lol.

Again, Yanis says it best about how our "Democratic politics is broken" because money in politics, has ruined politics. Hillary Clinton looked more corrupt than Trump, and through the Democrats attack on Bernie, shows that our political system is broken.

no i actually look at candidates platform and decide for myself instead of being uninformed.

I actually want to know which candidate you support and what are your reasons for supporting him/her? An actual reason, not that I feel this candidate is more likely to beat Trump. That's not a reason.

[Mormolyce]

Al Gore had this same problem, and the reality is our voting system is broken because we give more voting power to lower populated states than higher populated ones. This is how you can win the popular vote but still lose the election. But this is more of a problem when the votes come down to 50/50. As great as it is to say that Hillary won the popular vote, she only won by 2.1%. That's more like a margin of error, not a flat out win. If you want to get technical then yes Hillary should have won, but the reality is that Americans hated both candidates equally. I'm personally glad that Hillary lost because now we have a second chance for Bernie Sanders. If you don't want 4 more years of Trump then vote for Bernie.

You say that and yet many US Presidents took office with a lower winning margin.

The last two Republican Presidents for example. Also Nixon in his first term. And I think Jimmy Carter.

I agree that the system is the problem however.

Another issue is that Bernie couldn't win unless he ran as a Democrat, and the Democrats are also so conservative and compromised with corporate money (I mean let's just cut the bullshit and start calling it what it is - bribery) that the party intentionally buries any candidate like him with an actual left wing agenda in order to put up center-right milquetoasts like Hillary.

[Martymark]

I look forward to him apologizing soon for saying "Maybe Biden shouldn't molest kids so much at public events".

Sure, it's true like Biden being corrupt, but you can't just say it!

[Flarelaine]

It doesnt matter what percentage of the country wants him removed (even though its a biased CNN poll designed to attempt to sway Trump supporters away from him). If 80% of those 51% are all in California, it doesnt mean a thing. The poll would need to be taken in every state since we use the electoral college, and then show the results from each state.

The USA has ~328 million people.

51% of that is 167 million.

California has 39 million inhabitants, so there have to be at least 128 million people wanting Trump gone outside California.

I understand "but California!" is a very convenient talking point, but easily available facts and numbers do not line up with it.

[Ripster42]

You say that and yet many US Presidents took office with a lower winning margin.

The last two Republican Presidents for example. Also Nixon in his first term. And I think Jimmy Carter.

I agree that the system is the problem however.

Another issue is that Bernie couldn't win unless he ran as a Democrat, and the Democrats are also so conservative and compromised with corporate money (I mean let's just cut the bullshit and start calling it what it is - bribery) that the party intentionally buries any candidate like him with an actual left wing agenda in order to put up center-right milquetoasts like Hillary.

Wait, that's your gripe, not the fact that he's talking about "margin of error" in nationwide voting? There is no margin of error. Margin of error exists when a poll of a subset of the group is used to project the results of the nationwide vote from that subset.