So why the anger over the final cinematic?

[FelPlague]

sargeras is imprisoned, not dead? Its literally in the fucking story that he was imprisoned by the pantheon, why are you so obsessed saying that he is dead?

Because he has been removed from the story, now, and may be forever, he is as good as dead.
Being dead in wow is as good as being removed from the story.
characters are resurrected more often then released from lockup.

Again kelthuzad is alive, but has been gone for more then 10 years.
you really think sargeras is gunna come back? hes less likely to come back then nzoth.

[Kikazz]

Why is he an idiot? He was actually being quite smart.
He was trying to corrupt her into fel, then boom 2 fel titans, they could easily take on the void lords.
he could have gone for a swing but a swing takes longer ten a direct stab, he would have only hit the surface before being pulled away. going for a direct stab had the best chance of killing her while being pulled away.

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no they ddint, the titans literally killed one... they just said it was not a good idea to kill them.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Y%27Shaarj

Can confirm, The Titans Killed Ysaarj, but in doing so created the Sha, and scarred the land for thousands of years, and still couldnt stop his heart beating, hence locking it beneath the earth in Vale of Blossoms.

[Yarathir]

So we've moved on to throwing Legion under the bus to do damage control for BfA's beyond anticlimactic ending.

Wonder if we'll do the same for BfA when Shadowlands has an awful ending.

[Corruptus]

Strawmanning in this thread to defend Blizzard is hilarious.

Just makes you wonder, why the fuck Titans didn't kill the Old Gods using Watchers or inside their prison, instead of being scared after they pull one from the planet. Also the fucking blade is still in the planet and everyone is just dancing around happy. Azerite - the fucking thing that started 80% of this filler expansion is still a thing. But hey, Magni says it's alright, then who am I to be concerned.

[Koniwej]

Strawmanning in this thread to defend Blizzard is hilarious.

Just makes you wonder, why the fuck Titans didn't kill the Old Gods using Watchers or inside their prison, instead of being scared after they pull one from the planet. Also the fucking blade is still in the planet and everyone is just dancing around happy. Azerite - the fucking thing that started 80% of this filler expansion is still a thing. But hey, Magni says it's alright, then who am I to be concerned.

Because Old gods corrupted watchers.

See: ulduar.

Jesus yall are stupid. Y'all don't like the story sure but their rules have been very consistent wrt old gods

[Rexosaurus]

So you admit that you will ignore any and all differences so you can portrait them as similarly as possible?

Old Gods have been portrayed since day one as being able to make tentacles, mouths, eyes and what-have-yous appear anytime and anywhere they have spread their influence. N'Zoth has been constantly portrayed being "about eyes". Remember Crucible of Storms? Remember the eye we got implanted on our head?

Also, look at this image from AQ. Doesn't that obelisk look strangely familiar?

Also, regarding your "crumbling structure with an eyeball" claim. The only "structure with an eyeball" is a wall. Because the towers that crumble in the cinematic? They have no eyes on them.

WHAT IS HAPPENING HERE?!

Are you guys really dense enough that substituting a tower for a wall (even though we also see a prominent tower crumble at the start of the WoW scene) is enough to throw you off? The differences that both of you mentioned, and that I already addressed, are pretty minor superficial changes. The music, the imagery of the crumbling eyeball structures that then explode, and the setting are extraordinarily similar between the two scenes. If you guys aren't being totally dishonest then that's genuinely terrifying to me that you can't see how much the WoW scene blatantly copies the Lord of the Rings scene.

There is a big difference between a story that borrows universal themes and archetypes, and a story outright steals from others. I have 0 doubts that Blizzard meant it as a homage, but when you just rip an entire scene and use part of it as your grand finale for an expansion, it's cheap af. This is not a case of "every story has already been told/Simpsons did it".

[Onikaroshi]

the Horde vs. Alliance thing was so overhyped.

The horde vs. alliance thing will always be overhyped, no one can ever "win" in an mmo when they're players on both sides. They should probably finally just leave it alone.

[rogoth]

I don't get it.

Nyalotha book-ends Uldir, with lots of parallels in each raid. We spend the entire 8.3 patch taking over and re-energizing the reorigination array. In the raid itself we are placing anchor-points to target the thing.

Then we get to the final boss, fighting in his literal brain, at the end of it we succumb to his madness but then get a whisper from the Speaker Magni that allows us to rally and we use our heart of Azeroth to act as the final anchor point and to channel the reorigination array. Ending N'Zoth and freeing Azeroth from the corruption of the final Old God.

Now I get that there's still the loose-end of the giant freakin' sword in Silithis, though there's an implication from Magni that now that N'Zoth is gone Azeroth will be able to finally heal herself. Kinda like using anti-biotics to cure a nasty infection which then let's a septic cut heal up since the body isn't fighting the infection anymore.

But what exactly is the problem?

the horde vs alliance 'war' was such a nonesense pile of shite it was shoehorned into the game because 'gotta have some orcs vs humans' crap again, the game has moved away from the faction conflict so long ago that the idea of it is just archaic and pointless at this moment in time.

the whole overhype of N'zoth since cataclysm and then getting nothing at all is such a kick in the face to lore fans as well as those who only casually play it's smacks of laziness along with the obvious show of them being so pressured to pull out the next expansion they just gave up on BFA months ago.

they essentially reused the EXACT SAME ENDING they used in dragon soul, 'character A holds up relic and shoots it at bad guy B, bad guy B explodes into glittery confetti and the heroes all go home happy' the whole of BFA writing is a total rip off from cata/mop, there's a post somewhere where someone took the opening events of MoP and inserted sylvanas instead of garrosh, and changed the names of a few places to current day named areas and it still made sense, that's how lazy the writing was.

don't even get me started on how bad gameplay is, this is some of the worst the game has actually played in the history of the game, it's just one massive dumpster fire of it's former glory, back when the devs who made it were fans of the game and made for the gamers, not some low budget treadmill workers who couldn't care about what the game is as long as it satisfies the shareholders.

[MoanaLisa]

All to build up the Void Lords as a threat and I'm sure we just push them over too.

If you want realism, you pull the boss, it tosses out one of its mid-power abilities without lifting a tentacle and everyone falls over dead. That's the point of the game. We can kill things, things we should have no right to bother with.

Same with Deathwing. He flaps his wings, burns everyone in the raid in the first 10 seconds and that's the end.

You either accept this or you don't.

Re: faction war. It was tired several expansions ago. It's worse now and Blizzardd seems to think that it's the heart/core of the game.

[Koniwej]

If you want realism, you pull the boss, it tosses out one of its mid-power abilities without lifting a tentacle and everyone falls over dead. That's the point of the game. We can kill things, things we should have no right to bother with.

Same with Deathwing. He flaps his wings, burns everyone in the raid in the first 10 seconds and that's the end.

You either accept this or you don't.

it's only bad when it happens in an expansion i don't like.

Illidan, Kael, Arthas couldve all killed us instantly buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut

[Adamas102]

Because he has been removed from the story, now, and may be forever, he is as good as dead.
Being dead in wow is as good as being removed from the story.
characters are resurrected more often then released from lockup.

Again kelthuzad is alive, but has been gone for more then 10 years.
you really think sargeras is gunna come back? hes less likely to come back then nzoth.

Ah, I see the issue here. You don't know what the word "dead" means.

[Koniwej]

Ah, I see the issue here. You don't know what the word "dead" means.

illidan died

[Cosmic Janitor]

If the Titans, at their prime (before all the Sargeras-turning-evil thing) could not kill an Old God without causing severe, nigh-irreparable damage to a planet, risking killing it, why do you think a bung of rag-tag sword-slashers and wand-wielders would be able to?

I mean, look at this line from the WoWPedia article on Old Gods, and make sure to pay very close attention to the wording of the phrase: "With Yogg-Saron and C'Thun defeated, Y'Shaarj and G'huun deceased, and N'Zoth presumably gone as well, there are no Old Gods that remain active in Azeroth.

The only ones mentioned as deceased are Y'Shaarj (which Aman'Thul personally ripped appart) and G'huun, a "fake" Old God accidentally created by the Pantheon in their experiments to study the Old Gods.

I think you have that backwards, the fact that the titans didn't kill them (or laser-focus re-originate them) just shows how badly written the whole plot currently is. The very fact that they couldn't get rid of them makes no sense in the first place. They could beat them into submission so that they could be imprisoned. But they couldn't remove them surgically with the millions if not billions of mechanical helpers that they constructed to shape the very world? Also, Aman'Thul ripped Y'Shaarj out only to seal his remains back in pandaria, because why not let the festering carcass of a parasite remain around.. I'm sure nothing could go wrong.

Everything around old gods and titans is one giant plot hole and gleaming any kind of grand meaning from the desperate struggles of somones glorified fan fiction is a fool's errant. Everytime we meet them something new get's tagged on that doesn't sit well with what was previously established.

Also no one in WoW ever stays dead if some hackwriter decides they want them again, this was established on the 25th of march in 2008. What WoWpedia writes in that regard is about as meaningless as the suggestion of my 8-ball. We know for a fact that even their de facto lore guide/compendium was preemptively neutered in this regard, just to keep that option open.

[FelPlague]

Ah, I see the issue here. You don't know what the word "dead" means.

Illidan was dead, came back
kalethas was dead, came back
archimonde was dead came back
guldan was dead, came back
mannaroth was dead, came back

Kelthuzad has been locked away for over 10 years but nothing.
Bolvar was locked away for 10 years.
Kiljaden was locked away for 10 years.


As ive said like 8 times but you still cant understand.

being locked up, and dying, mean basically the same thing in wow.
Sargeras like kelthuzad could literally just be gone forever, locked away to never come back to the lore.

[Corroc]

Because he has been removed from the story, now, and may be forever, he is as good as dead.
Being dead in wow is as good as being removed from the story.
characters are resurrected more often then released from lockup.

Again kelthuzad is alive, but has been gone for more then 10 years.
you really think sargeras is gunna come back? hes less likely to come back then nzoth.

Your mental gymnastics are pretty amazing. I would love to say you are really good troll but I kinda know that you are being dead serious so its a bit scary to imagine what is going on in your head.

[Adamas102]

being locked up, and dying, mean basically the same thing in wow.

Yeah, it seems you need a dictionary. Being dead is a pretty definitive state of being. "Pretty much dead in terms of story presence" is hyperbole and just flat out incorrect. Sure, they may be absent from the game for a long time (or forever), but dead is dead and Sargeras is not dead. The status of other characters is completely irrelevant. Why is it so difficult to just say you misspoke? It's really bizarre how defensive you are about being wrong.

[Zeons]

No wonder blizzard ignores the whiners. They offer nothing of value.

[Rexosaurus]

If you want realism, you pull the boss, it tosses out one of its mid-power abilities without lifting a tentacle and everyone falls over dead. That's the point of the game. We can kill things, things we should have no right to bother with.

Same with Deathwing. He flaps his wings, burns everyone in the raid in the first 10 seconds and that's the end.

You either accept this or you don't.

Re: faction war. It was tired several expansions ago. It's worse now and Blizzardd seems to think that it's the heart/core of the game.

I have long since abandoned hope that WoW's story will ever be good, but realism is far from the only way to make a villain feel threatening in a story. They could have had N'zoth kill/permanently corrupt important characters or areas. They could have made the players lose the fight, or win in a way that inflicted a high cost, etc.

[Ghostile]

Strawmanning in this thread to defend Blizzard is hilarious.

Just makes you wonder, why the fuck Titans didn't kill the Old Gods using Watchers or inside their prison, instead of being scared after they pull one from the planet. Also the fucking blade is still in the planet and everyone is just dancing around happy. Azerite - the fucking thing that started 80% of this filler expansion is still a thing. But hey, Magni says it's alright, then who am I to be concerned.

Now which would cause more damage.

a massive fucking hole or a an object sticking out of it?

[FelPlague]

Yeah, it seems you need a dictionary. Being dead is a pretty definitive state of being. "Pretty much dead in terms of story presence" is hyperbole and just flat out incorrect. Sure, they may be absent from the game for a long time (or forever), but dead is dead and Sargeras is not dead. The status of other characters is completely irrelevant. Why is it so difficult to just say you misspoke? It's really bizarre how defensive you are about being wrong.

mean basically the same thing in wow.

Again, kelthuzad has been locked up for more then 10 years.
bolvar was "locked up" for 10 years.
Kiljaden was locked up for 10 years.
funny the locked up people seem to dissapear longer from the story then the dead people.
Archimonde actually died in TBC (technically warcraft) but came back to life before kiljaden who was only locked away came back.
Kalethas came back in only a few patches.
Sargeras will be locked up atleast 6 years, about 5 and a half years longer then kaelthas who literally died was gone.