Challenging personal tasks over mindless grind

[VinceVega]

1. Let's say you want to unlock flight.

Instead of meaningless shit like doing all the quests in new zones and unlocking 6 reputations, why not something like:

-> Complete all the quests in the new zones and complete these aerial challenges on hard difficulty (a race challenge, an aerial combat challenge, etc)

2. Let's say you want to become exalted with a race.

Instead of meaningless shit like doing the same repeatable quests to honored, revered, exalted, why not instead:

-> Complete the introductory quest for this faction, then these other story chains which will explore the story of these factions through quests, dungeons and exploration of lore items in the world, interlaced with personal challenges that require your skill as a solo player to overcome.

3. Let's say you want to level a profession.

Instead of crafting shit items over and over to get some levels, why not instead:

-> Have the option to go around the world to for example fix NPC's sword and armor, or enchant their gear, or do this even for players, giving you a skill level for say every 5 people helped.

I keep seeing this shit argument for the past 15 years about how "players are entitled and want easy rewards and you should be rewarded only for wasting this many hours in game doing shit tasks" to why I always reply: why? Why the fuck should we content ourselves to be masochistic instead of demanding more challenging/mentally stimulating, more interactive and more fun content?

1. You cannot put something as essential as flying behind a skill check. If you do this you take many people out of the game completely because they cannot play as everyone else.
2. Then they have to timegate it. Which is even a bigger problem for many. I would like it. Story quests over 2 month. But in the end this would not matter a bit as everyone would get it at the same time so why have rep anyway at that point? The other way you decide how fast you get it.
3.That sounds ok. But here you will get complaints from the (according to the forums here) considerable playerbase who do not interact with players in any way... because they don't want to... in an MMO... yeah i don't get it either. But this point sounds interesting.

You will never get rid of dailys and stuff like this in MMORPGs for the simple reason, that they need you to play the game as long as possible. That is the whole system of EVERY MMORPG. I don't say this is bad. This is just the way it is. You cannot make a MMORPG where you can play JUST new stuff for 3 years... there is no game that has that amount of content. Never was and probably never will. SP can do it but you play them not even close as much as MMOs. (simulations are a different thing talking about RPGs and stuff like this with a story)

[Gaidax]

1. You cannot put something as essential as flying behind a skill check.

This is the bottom line.


Quite frankly, over all these years I play WoW, I keep seeing these random ass forum chest thumpers popping up with their make everything require skillzz crap, but the thing is - in WoW - vast majority of the players are not really interested in making every mundane activity be some sort of skill check. People want to login, wack some monsters, get their desire for progression sated for the day and go their merry way until next day/week/month.

And know what? It's completely valid, because WoW is a game and a casual one at that, so people often just want to chill.

If you want challenge - there is no shortage of that in WoW either, so go on and do that.

I do think it's ok to ask Blizz to add some challenging single player content too, but that one should be for vanity rewards, not essential stuff. Mage Tower was a great example, maybe the Shlands tower will be too.

[Strawberry]

Simple, creating challenging chain quests is way harder and more expensive than just making people grind.
Besides, challenging quests would be easily ran through by experienced hardcore players while the casuals would complain about not being able to complete the quest.
Grinding is equal for everyone.

That being said, I hate grinding and would rather have challenging chain quests.

[Laughingjack]

I would enjoy such a change but im skeptical of it working out well... I think if flying speed compared to mage tower if you want rewards for challenging content you have to make it cosmetic or the playerbase rages to hard.

[VinceVega]

This is the bottom line.


Quite frankly, over all these years I play WoW, I keep seeing these random ass forum chest thumpers popping up with their make everything require skillzz crap, but the thing is - in WoW - vast majority of the players are not really interested in making every mundane activity be some sort of skill check. People want to login, wack some monsters, get their desire for progression sated for the day and go their merry way until next day/week/month.

And know what? It's completely valid, because WoW is a game and a casual one at that, so people often just want to chill.

If you want challenge - there is no shortage of that in WoW either, so go on and do that.

I do think it's ok to ask Blizz to add some challenging single player content too, but that one should be for vanity rewards, not essential stuff. Mage Tower was a great example, maybe the Shlands tower will be too.

yes and no. mythic/highlvl PVP/high keys should be the only way to get the best gear in my opinion.

But stuff like flying etc should never be skill checked. If you have NOTHING skill checked that brings you anything power wise the game would be incredible boring. imho

Gearing up is an essential part of the game. Not just some annoyance on the side. If you taking the skill check away from egaring you can get rid of it alltogether and only use transmogs rest is templates. Warcraftwatch... or Overcraft....

[Kendros]

People would bitch about it being too hard and blame blizz for their inaptitude. They would nerf it to the ground until theyre meaningless.

[Shaetha]

1. Let's say you want to unlock flight.

Instead of meaningless shit like doing all the quests in new zones and unlocking 6 reputations, why not something like:

-> Complete all the quests in the new zones and complete these aerial challenges on hard difficulty (a race challenge, an aerial combat challenge, etc)

2. Let's say you want to become exalted with a race.

Instead of meaningless shit like doing the same repeatable quests to honored, revered, exalted, why not instead:

-> Complete the introductory quest for this faction, then these other story chains which will explore the story of these factions through quests, dungeons and exploration of lore items in the world, interlaced with personal challenges that require your skill as a solo player to overcome.

3. Let's say you want to level a profession.

Instead of crafting shit items over and over to get some levels, why not instead:

-> Have the option to go around the world to for example fix NPC's sword and armor, or enchant their gear, or do this even for players, giving you a skill level for say every 5 people helped.

I keep seeing this shit argument for the past 15 years about how "players are entitled and want easy rewards and you should be rewarded only for wasting this many hours in game doing shit tasks" to why I always reply: why? Why the fuck should we content ourselves to be masochistic instead of demanding more challenging/mentally stimulating, more interactive and more fun content?

It's a very simple answer: Some people want the mindless grind. FFXIV's endgame and Classic will attest to that.

Challenging content is much more like masochism than easy content you repeat. They're both tedious(Everything is MMORPGs is. It's almost the point.) but one is also banging your head against a wall.

- - - Updated - - -

nah give me the mindless grind.

wow is the game I relax to, I don't want it to be super difficult.

Thank you for providing an easy example for my point.

[Qnubi]

Play a different game. Blizzard doesn't care as long as you give them their $60/1.5y & 15/m.

An expansion costs 60$ in the US? I pay 40 Euro for the standard edition. Exchange rate is at 1.08 atm so that doesn't explain it.

[Mardux]

Why not both? Well hey there mage tower ������

OP said challenging tasks. Mage tower does not fit that stipulation.

Granted, none of OP's suggestions do either.

[Mirishka]

1. Let's say you want to unlock flight.

Instead of meaningless shit like doing all the quests in new zones and unlocking 6 reputations, why not something like:

<deletes useless rant>

Oh look, its another 'I want to bitch about WoW' blog!

Yeah listen, nobody is forcing you to play. Other games are that way. ---->

[WintersLegion]

An expansion costs 60$ in the US? I pay 40 Euro for the standard edition. Exchange rate is at 1.08 atm so that doesn't explain it.

it used to be but Shadowlands is only 40 dollars for base version here as well.

[Nightstalker]

Here is how you fix the game:

Just do anything that is as vague as possible and fits in a one-line paragraph.

[Michael Jackson]

Oh look, its another 'I want to bitch about WoW' blog!

Yeah listen, nobody is forcing you to play. Other games are that way. ---->

Holy shit, let's see if the report system works on this site.

[Hyoie]

Idk man, guardian druid did. Admittedly, other specs not so much.

- - - Updated - - -

OP said challenging tasks. Mage tower does not fit that stipulation.

Granted, none of OP's suggestions do either.

Idk man, guardian druid did. Admittedly, other specs not so much.

[Garymorilix]

Holy shit, let's see if the report system works on this site.

For real.

What is content in the game currently that you would consider challenging that you have actually done?

[cuafpr]

what's hard for one person, is easy for another. So for mass appeal, it would be balanced around the least skilled. just FYI

[Freighter]

An expansion costs 60$ in the US? I pay 40 Euro for the standard edition. Exchange rate is at 1.08 atm so that doesn't explain it.

Expansions don't cost anything in South Korea.

[Softbottom]

Have you done a 5-mask vision solo already at least?

Or you are just asking for "challenge" but you don't want it at all?

What does 5 masking a vision have to do with anything? You can 5 man visions. Visions are shit content anyways.

[Garymorilix]

What does 5 masking a vision have to do with anything? You can 5 man visions. Visions are shit content.

That is the closest we have in the game right now that matches the "challenging solo content" criteria.

If he can't even do those (and I am faily certain he cannot) then this discussion is dead on arrival.

If you can't complete the challenge you want to force everyone else to adapt to then all you are is a hyprocite bullshit artist.

[Softbottom]

That is the closest we have in the game right now that matches the "challenging solo content" criteria.

If he can't even do those (and I am faily certain he cannot) then this discussion is dead on arrival.

If you can't complete the challenge you want to force everyone else to adapt to then all you are is a hyprocite bullshit artist.

It's not a solo challenge though? You can 2man, 4man, etc. Whether it's a challenge or not; visions are literally the most boring form of content i think i have ever done. Once I got my cloak to 15 i unsubbed.