Class restrictions are not lore friendly

[Razion]

the problem is that allowing free classes for everyone means that exception stop to exists, like the classic lawful good drow that every d&d novice roleplayer want to be.
the races in rpgs are meant to be archetypes, so you should pick the race that resemble more the idea of your character (at least initially). exceptions are nice, dont take me wrong, but mostly for npcs, where they can be useful for the storytelling for the uniqueness they provide.

Not everyone wants to be forced into stereotypical archetypes.

[Nynax]

And yet, as has been discussed at length in this thread already, and was mentioned in the post you just quoted, that is irrelevant because there are already Draenei and Tauren Rogues in the game, if joe random no-name NPCs can do it why shouldn't the player be able to? Additionally the Elegy short stories have told us quite specifically that Rogue stealth is magically enhanced, muffling effects can easily be a part of that magical enhancement... Also hooves can be padded to reduce noise.

not to mention that recent spec design shows that not all "rogues" are focused on the stealthy assassin stuff. Some like loud guns, big swords, and a good fight.

[Shaetha]

techcnialyl they're priest in the same way night elves are priests of elune.

Their religion just focused on the whole dark star thing (which wasn't at all what they originally thought it was).

Priest stuff is really more focus'd on the religious views, if we want to break it down. But we also tend to focus on the holy light, or shadows angle rather than how priests exist in another spectrum. For example Troll priest were supposed to be "witch doctors" with hexes (well they were given ONE hex)

I look at them the same way I do clerics in D&D

Mostly because they're clerics from D&D with the label greeked.

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Didn't they also do it with Gnomes being mages? I mean, magic has over and over again being portrayed as a scientific power which is linked to ones intelligence, the Jaina novel even established that magic is based on math and Arcane Magic was in every single scenario presented as more powerful than technology, so Gnomes seem to lack the intelligence to use magic if they have to rely on tech.

Not everyone is going to have the specific knack required to be a mage. Canonically, Gnomes are the most intelligent race on Azeroth if you go by pure genetics, but that doesn't mean all of them are going to be able wield the arcane, and fewer still will be trained to do so. Some people are brilliant in one area and completely hopeless in others.

Also, sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

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And yet, as has been discussed at length in this thread already, and was mentioned in the post you just quoted, that is irrelevant because there are already Draenei and Tauren Rogues in the game, if joe random no-name NPCs can do it why shouldn't the player be able to? Additionally the Elegy short stories have told us quite specifically that Rogue stealth is magically enhanced, muffling effects can easily be a part of that magical enhancement... Also hooves can be padded to reduce noise.

That was a joke, hoss. Maybe you should take yourself a little less seriously. You'll live longer.

[Schattenlied]

That was a joke, hoss. Maybe you should take yourself a little less seriously. You'll live longer.

Sure it was buddy.

[Kyphael]

I agree! Now where's my Worgen Paladin?

[jellmoo]

At this point in the development of the game, there isn’t a good reason for at least the core races to be able to play as any of the classes that aren’t locked to a particular spot in time (which is pretty much just Demon Hunters at this point).

Some combos would require some tweaking of the lore, but those tweaks would be no bigger than the ones that have already been done. These races have fought beside one another for years now. Having members of these races be curious about the classes that other races champion should not be outside the realm of possibility.

[Schattenlied]

I agree! Now where's my Worgen Paladin?

Yes please, would racechange my Paladin in a heartbeat.

[Schattenlied]

idgaf. game mechanics =/= lore.

The game mechanic here would be players getting stealth on Tauren, the Grimtotem having Rogues is the lore, it literally is possible.

The lore says it's not a problem for Tauren to be Rogues so I see no reason for the game mechanics to prohibit it.

Usually the "game mechanics =/= lore" argument is used in cases where game mechanics DO allow things that don't necessarily make sense in lore... This is the first time I've ever seen someone try to use it the other way around.

[Malix Farwin]

I can agree with some cases where it may seem unreasonable why a race doesn't have x class but there are certainly strong reasons why some races do not. Undead not being able to be Paladins is what i would considered reasonable while at the same time if you wanted to argue Vulpera should able to be paladins, you could(especially since they can be DKs). Another example would be that Voids Elves cannot be paladins for a very specific reason but you could argue that Goblins should be able to be monks.

[Venziir]

Then it's a blatant contradiction to in game lore specifically telling us that what remains of the Shadowmoon clan's laws forbid the use of shadow magic of any kind. So, Blizzard either forgot their own lore (again) or they aren't Shadowmoon Orcs.

The only mag'har priests we see are all clad in the Shadowmoon outfits, refered to as "Darkcasters" and are seen using void abilities against the Alliance if/when the Horde attacks Stormsong. They do not worship the Light whatsoever, they litterally fled their own home to avoid the Light.

[Hyeonh]

There are some races that shouldn't be certain classes. It makes completely no sense to have a lightforged warlock, but at the same time there are certain classes that would greatly work with them for forgotten lore reasons. Trolls should be able to be every class but demon hunter for being the first race to have a major empire with already existing definitive lore behind every class and why they can be it. Also monk should be the third class to be available to all races.

[LemonDemonGirl]

Trolls should be able to be every class but demon hunter for being the first race to have a major empire with already existing definitive lore behind every class and why they can be it.

Zandalari included?
But I agree with this. Troll Paladins make sense because we have Darkspear who live among Zandalari so they could probably learn from them. Troll Warlocks don't really make that much sense to me though (unless it's explained somewhere that they're just using Voodoo magic/Hexes) but I think we should have Zandalari ones as well. I know Blizzard said something like 'Zandalari have no connection to Fel magic' but they could just say they're Necromancers/Hexers?

[VinceVega]

Often on forums when I read a lore discussion there are people who say something along the lines of "Ugh, Blizzard doesn't care about lore if they give X race this Y class" or "It's ridiculous that they gave Y class to X race, it goes completely against the lore" or something that just boils down to "X race can't be Y class because they like such and such and that means that they can't be interested interested in something or other". And I just completely disagree with such arguments because I think that the logic behind these statements is just flawed. I think that every race should be every class and that that would be perfectly fine from a lore perspective, in fact even more so than having restrictions. And I am saying this from a pure lore perspective, I don't care whether they implement it in the game or not.

And I will try to establish a few points as to why I think that's the case:

1. The average meat consumption per person in industrialized countries is around 80 kilograms. In America it's around 120 kg. It's no surprise that americans love to eat meat: when one thinks of american cuisine he most likely will imagine foods like hamburgers, steak, bacon, fried chicken and others. Obviously eating meat is a major part of american culture. Does that mean that americans can't be vegans? Of course it doesn't. In fact there are a lot of american vegans. Smoothies and quinoa are also associated with american cuisine, even though they promote a much healthier lifestyle. But how is that possible? Just because a culture traditionally values one custom, doesn't mean that it cannot also value another, even if it's in total contrast I.e. just because Tauren are largely intersted in nature, doesn't mean that they can't be interested in becoming mages.

2.From the 16th to the 18th century, France was one of the leading absolute monarchies in Europe (which means that the king has supreme and unrestricted authority) and remains to this day (historically) a prime example of such a system of government. Does that mean that all french citizens supported such a system and that it never changed? Of course it doesn't The french revolution completely changed this system and resulted in values that are relevant even today. But how? Just because a custom is completely different than one that is already strongly established in a culture, doesn't mean that it can't become just as strongly established (or replace it altogether) I.e. just because Humans are largely intersted in industry and Gnomes in technology, doesn't mean that others can't be interested in shamanism in druidism.

3.The horns of javan rhinos are used in traditional vietnamese medicine. As a result there are only a few hundred left in Vietnam. Luckily for the rhinos, the vietnamese government has started several conservation projects to save them from extinction. There are however still poachers who hunt them because there exists a great market for their horns. Who hunts them? The vietnamese. Well, who runs the the conservation projects then? Also the vietnamese. But how is that possible? Shouldn't all vietnamese people have the same values? Of course not. A culture isn't a singular entity. It consists of many different groups with many different sets of values. I.e. just because most Night elves and Draenei hate fel magic, doesn't mean that a large group do want to become warlocks.

What does this amount to? I will try to use both the forum-arguments and my reasoning on a race/class combination from vanilla.

"Why can Humans/Orcs be warlocks? Demons almost wiped out their entire populations and destroyed their homeworld. Also, Humans are devout light worshippers/ Orcs worship their ancestors." By that logic warlocks shouldn't even be a playable class because everyone hates demons in one way or another (except trolls, undead and belves because they have no morals). And yet here we are. Because playable warlocks are members of small and often secret groups. All races should have warlocks People often say "Night elevs and Draenei could never be warlocks. The Burning Legion almost destroyed them" but that doesn't make any sense because the Burning Legion almost destroyed everyone.

Other race/class combinations can be justified in a similar way.
Again, I don't care about which races get to play as warlocks I just think that people who say that certain races can't be certain classes because of "lore" don't know what they're talking about.
Prove me wrong.

I actually disagree strongly and think the current restrictions are not strong enough.
Why do we have goblin and gnome warriors? What are they going to do? Hold there shield up and get stomped by a tauren.

Tauren Mages... well maybe they have not the capability of other races. Humans have a huge affinity for the arcane. As habe Draenei.

I never got why undead can weild the light. But we have lore presedence. So meh...

Why have a tauren rouge? How would that work. "clopclopclopclop* BACKSTAB!

Same as with warlocks. If there is no one who can teach you how would you find out how to use the fell? Some may sometime. But not at the time our characters start. I don't say Night Elfes can't weild fel. I say there is no one who knows how. And if someday there is one he probably won't be allowed into Darnassus (or wherever they are going to be) and could not teach our player char who comes from this place to do this. Same with Draenei. They could. But there is no one allowed to teach it.

That might change in the future. But lorewise every player-character in wow starts at the same point in time. In SL it is moves forward to just before BfA.

[owbu]

No class/race restrictions works well in table top because the gm can react to your choices and you are only a could of people in a huge world.

In an mmo we outnumber the world. What combinations are allowed will determine how other players perceive what is normal in this world.

Allow NE to be paladins and the game will look like most paladins are NEs.

So those restrictions aren't really there to protect the lore, they are there to protect the identity of classes and races.

[Saichou]

.

Why have a tauren rouge? How would that work. "clopclopclopclop* BACKSTAB!

Oh, finally someone said this.
Hooves aren't loud. Horsheshoes are loud. The reason why you hear the clop sound from horses on the street is because it's metal colliding with hard cement.
Hooves are made of the same material as hair and nails.
They're not loud, people.

[Saltysquidoon]

if you wanted to argue Vulpera should able to be paladins, you could(especially since they can be DKs).

What does being a DK have to do with being a paladin? That's a WCIII thing, the ebon blade dks pretty clearly weren't all paladins and bolvars allied boys certainly weren't.

[Saichou]

Your argument doesn't make sense in relation to his argument.

For Orcs and Humans warlocks are/were mostly "bad dudes" within their larger armies. They can be tolerated as long as they behave this time. It's maybe worse for the orcs, but because so many warriors like Grom were complicit there's a lot more of a "shared" sin. A warlock opened the gateway, but it was the warchiefs that lead the way.

For Draenei, though, asking them to harbor warlocks is a lot more like going to Germany and being like "hey, can we start up the Nazi party again? Just a little one, ya know, for those who are interested!" That's the big cultural divide he's talking about.

Your argument doesn't make sense. So you're saying that other countries wouldn't have as much problems starting a nazi party?
Also, ironically, the nazi analogy fits much better with the orcs because they did the warlock thing and are now doing it again. The draenei never had warlocks to begin with and I think that's the cultural divide that guy was talking about.

[VinceVega]

Oh, finally someone said this.
Hooves aren't loud. Horsheshoes are loud. The reason why you hear the clop sound from horses on the street is because it's metal colliding with hard cement.
Hooves are made of the same material as hair and nails.
They're not loud, people.

Considering why horses have horseshoes, why would you assume draenei don't have them for convenience?

[Xilurm]

No, they are. Stop trying to change things because YOU don't care about the lore. Cataclysm already messed it up.

And don't use real world situations, I'm not playing this game to experience real world things.

I hope Blizzard never does this.

[Michael Jackson]

I hate how women can be druids and men can be hunters for Night Elves, in WC3 it was strictly determined these roles were gender locked, and it made for a cool race.