Why Solo-Torghast and every kind of Solo-Content will fail in WoW

[Trend]

Anyone has any idea how to make "solo-content" in WoW somewhat playable? In new ways Blizzard hasnt thought about after 16 years?

You're missing the obvious, again.

I know from your many threads and posts that you want WoW to be a single player game, rather than an MMO with solo content. That's not a flaw, it's a design decision. I'm not saying you're wrong for wanting to have a single player game with selected aspects of an MMO, but you are very likely to continue to be disappointed by your expectation that the game will shift to meet your desires.

[Big Thanks]

And every single person, literally EVERY SINGLE PERSON in this thread is saying you are wrong. They have pointed out countless flaws in your logic, and pointed out great solo content that was well received. As is the typical theme in any conversation with you, you simply spam your opinion over and over and over again, getting more and more frustrated that everyone disagrees with you.

Oh look is arkanon...hello again dude...all your posts are exactly like this one.
Do you copy paste them to make me look bad?

[Ryytikki]

i dont understand literally anything you are trying to say.
do you want the game to become wildstar with its mechanics?
you know that games died in less then 5 years right, and no other mmo has done that cause its horrid
and what does this have to do with single player?

I just wanted to say that wildstar's combat was probably the one thing that *didnt* cause it to be shut down, if anything it was the single redeeming factor of the game outside of its housing system

It was more the godawful itemization, immense lack of endgame content, focus more on making it "hardcore" than fun and the clusterfuck that was drop 2 killing all of pvp

wildstar-like combat would work well in WoW, but that drastic of a change would likely annoy a huge section of the playerbase (which is fair)

[Kathranis]

Limitations are not flaws. All games are limited by their genre and systems. A turn-based RPG can't be a character action game, and a third person shooter can't be a side scrolling beat-em-up. That doesn't mean they can't excel in providing fun and novel experiences to players, whether single player or multiplayer.

This idea extends to all media. A song isn't a movie, a black and white painting isn't in color, etc. Art flourishes because of its limitations, not in spite of them.

The whole premise of this thread is wrong-headed.

[Big Thanks]

Limitations are not flaws. All games are limited by their genre and systems. A turn-based RPG can't be a character action game, and a third person shooter can't be a side scrolling beat-em-up. That doesn't mean they can't excel in providing fun and novel experiences to players, whether single player or multiplayer.

This idea extends to all media. A song isn't a movie, a black and white painting isn't in color, etc. Art flourishes because of its limitations, not in spite of them.

The whole premise of this thread is wrong-headed.

I agree.

WoW was not designed for single player engaging gameplay.

The same way turn-based RPG can't be a character action game, and a third person shooter can't be a side scrolling beat-em-up.

[Shaetha]

Sorry if i missed your post...i cant keep up with everyone. Can you quote it for me so i can reply? Or a link.

I replied to

This combat system is limiting and it doesnt have any of this:
-Immunity Frames
-Avoid telegraphed attacks
-Combos
-Juggles
-rolls
-Collision Detection and Hitboxes

with

1. Combat does have immunity frames. You might know it as ice block and things similar to that. WoW combat is not fast.
2. Literally every fire circle is this.
3. This this is combat flavor. It has nothing to do with the type of combat.
4. See 3
5. there are many abilities in the game you can use to move faster and dodge an attack. The fact it's a roll is nothing but flavor. Rolling in itself is not a mechanic.
6. Every game has this.

The point being that the flaws you describe are that of a lack of imagination, not that of any flaw inherent to the format. Every single specific thing mentioned either exists in game, or is just a way of presenting something, a roll being a way to describe an ability that allows you to move a short distance in a chosen direction, for example. It has nothing to do with it being called a roll. It is mechanically identical to something like blink on the back end. Monks even have a literal roll. There is no reason these things couldn't be in WoW. It is not a limit of the game. It is a fundamental change to the flow of combat, which isn't happening. Limits are a good thing. They inspire creativity much more than not having them.

I also went into a rant on reductionism in that post. Saying that without the dressing, playing a video game is data entry. I'm not even sure what the point was related to your post upon rereading it.

[arkanon]

I agree.

WoW was not designed for single player engaging gameplay.

The same way turn-based RPG can't be a character action game, and a third person shooter can't be a side scrolling beat-em-up.

But a 3rd person shooter can be a fps, and a stratagy game, and a vehicle based combat game, and a flying game. Another "theory" out the window.

[huth]

Ok, i have a nice exercise for you.

Tell me how can a aggro pull of 10 mobs can have engaging gameplay....lets say....for a subtlety rogue
Cant wait for the world of fun you will come up with ^^

No, for two reasons. First, it's your job to provide evidence because you made the claim. Second, regardless of whether i could or could not produce a satisfying answer to your challenge, it wouldn't change that you still haven't pointed out any of those supposedly existing flaws, but merely succeeded or failed at providing a situation were engaging gameplay isn't possible, but there also is no reason to expect such to exist. I.e. your challenge is meaningless in the context of your argument.

[Laughingjack]

No, for two reasons. First, it's your job to provide evidence because you made the claim. Second, regardless of whether i could or could not produce a satisfying answer to your challenge, it wouldn't change that you still haven't pointed out any of those supposedly existing flaws, but merely succeeded or failed at providing a situation were engaging gameplay isn't possible, but there also is no reason to expect such to exist. I.e. your challenge is meaningless in the context of your argument.

Valkyrie chronicles

[huth]

But a 3rd person shooter can be a fps, and a stratagy game, and a vehicle based combat game, and a flying game. Another "theory" out the window.

Well, it might have an option to switch between first and third person, i suppose, though design for those tends to be somewhat different. There's been quite a few Shooter/Strategy/Vehicle combat games though. Battlezone comes to mind.

[Valhalladin]

If you can stomach the game for a little while longer the "Trashmaster" title would be perfect for you.

[Zorish]

can someone explain what OP trying to say, and what the reason of this entire thread, and why it's not in the graveyard of forgotten threads?

[Big Thanks]

The point being that the flaws you describe are that of a lack of imagination, not that of any flaw inherent to the format. Every single specific thing mentioned either exists in game

Not every class has access to this abilities that you pointed out already exist in the game.

But what exactly are you trying to say?
I think you are trying to say "WoW can simulate action combat if it so desires"

Well...maybe that is true. Ok lets say its true.

WoW can simulate the action combat mechanics. 100%

BUT

Not every class has IFrames
Not every class has a dash or a roll
Not every class has kiting potential

After reading your post, yeah maybe WoW can recrete it. BUT it would need to give everyone the simple tools for every class.

[Laughingjack]

Not every class has access to this abilities that you pointed out already exist in the game.

But what exactly are you trying to say?
I think you are trying to say "WoW can simulate action combat if it so desires"

Well...maybe that is true. Ok lets say its true.

WoW can simulate the action combat mechanics. 100%

BUT

Not every class has IFrames
Not every class has a dash or a roll
Not every class has kiting potential

After reading your post, yeah maybe WoW can recrete it. BUT it would need to give everyone the simple tools for every class.

It doesn't attempt to though at least not to that level. It isn't going to be tuned as tightly as traditional group high end content think of it more like flex raiding.

[Big Thanks]

It doesn't attempt to though at least not to that level. It isn't going to be tuned as tightly as traditional group high end content think of it more like flex raiding.

Yeah, i was going to say a Fireball is always going to hit you no matter what after being cast.

But after thinking...yeah, Blizzard can make a fireball miss you (with hit boxes) if it so desires. Among other things.

[Daedius]

My Shadow Priest misses Enemy Grid... RIP.

[Huggykaze]

Uhh...you know you can just use your mouse to target mobs, right? I can't say that tab-target has been any sort of impediment in solo content for me because I can...just...click the mobs/health bars I need to target.

As for the video you linked, that specific mechanic a) already exists in WoW, it just isn't represented in the exact way (we already have circles that explode after x seconds that need to be avoided, the circles just don't progressively fill over time to indicate when it will explode) and b) has absolutely nothing to do with the tab target system.

Tab-target certainly didn't stop anyone completing their mage towers, some of the most lauded and well regarded solo content WoW has ever added. I've also had, so far, had zero issues in Torghast due to Tab-target, so I am really not sure what you are on about.

His point is: selecting mobs and pressing 2-3 keys on your keyboard is boring as fuck, which prevents solo content from being satisfying.

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Yes, please change WoW even more in some kind of twitch shooter/platform jump'n'run/dark souls clone. That's what i wanted when i signed up 15 years ago.
/s

You also didn't sign up for talent system changes, for sharding, layering, pruning, removal of ability ranks, riding changes etc. Bad argument.

[Chumahki]

Why Solo-Torghast and every kind of Solo-Content will fail in WoW

Has not been answered. Many examples of very successful solo content in WoW have been provided, zero evidence to support the claim has been presented.

[razorpax]

can someone explain what OP trying to say, and what the reason of this entire thread, and why it's not in the graveyard of forgotten threads?

hes saying "wow cant be fun because its not an arpg

then proceeds to list debunked reasons

and its because hes like the special cousin on the short bus
you just let him keep playing even though he hits people because he also sometimes runs around grabbing dog shit and saying its delicious tootsie rolls

[huth]

It doesn't attempt to though at least not to that level. It isn't going to be tuned as tightly as traditional group high end content think of it more like flex raiding.

Is your opinion on the matter, since Blizzard hasn't actually stated anything in this vein.

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His point is: selecting mobs and pressing 2-3 keys on your keyboard is boring as fuck, which prevents solo content from being satisfying.

Of course, that's merely an opinion, not a "flaw".