Would Sylvanas have beaten Arthas as easily?

[Sanguinerd]

I'm thinking if they fought 1on1 then PERHAPS she'd have a chance but Arthas also had the citadel filled with reasonably competent fighters and Frostmourne. (not sure if Bolvars mace has any relevance but doubt it's anything like what Frostmourne was).

All Bolvar had were some random undead minions but nothing special.

[Jastall]

Yes, that main villain, the one who threatened to destroy the world and was Ner'zhul's boss. Glad we're on the same page.

While I agree that the setting has always had overly powerful characters, I do think what steadily changed is how widespread they were. Back then Archimonde was abeing with nigh unheard of power, mandating the Night Elves bait him into a trap and give up their immortality to stop him. In WoW we just walked up to him and beat his ass for purples. Similarly, Malfurion was a powerful and knowledgeable druid in WC3, but then the books made him into nature Superman, able to do just about anything with pure anime prowess. He got nerfed, but then the anime power boost was given to other faction characters like Sylvanas and Jaina who were suddenly able to accomplish battle-deciding feats of might that suck all tension out of a war, because at the end of the day why wouldn't these be decided by whoever is given the most overpowered shit by the writers at any given time.

Warcraft's a heroic fantasy setting, of course superpowered characters will exist, that's how we get raid bosses and all. But I do think the devs have started to overdo it come Wrath, where even a Warrior character was made into some super-Conan war machine that casually chops dragons in two. End of the day I think the supers should be restricted to being enemies or neutrals like Illidank, having them be faction characters simply sucks as one asks why the Horde/Alliance's every problem isn't solved by them.

[MrLachyG]

Yes, her ever-increasing and ill-defined jailor powers only exist as a sledgehammer for blizzards 'writers' to use to have Sylvanas move the plot forward.
Never underestimate how strong a character can become when a bad writer needs them to move from A to B but can't think of a way to do it without looking stupid.

how would you have done it then? how would you have Sylvanas beat the Lich King without a clear and massive power-up to trigger the Shadowlands expansion?

[kaelix1]

When was it stated? by whom? I do agree with you there but who stated it?

If you tell me how to make a url link without making an account on X webpage i would gladly show you the picture with Chris Metzen saying this

ehh Arthas LK at top was equal in power or little bit weaker than xuen as it was stated by blizz that at the peak of his power LK was weaker than lei shen at the peak of his power and it took 30 lei shen 30 days and 30 nights to beat xuen.

I don't what to sound like i downplay Xuen BUT from his fight against Lei shen the only proper conclusion we can take base on what we know from chronicle is that Xuen have insane stamina to last that long, he wasn't a big challenge to Lei shen and it was never been state the difficulty of the fight Lei Shen vs Arthas except he will win, in my book bringing this don't really show how weak/strong Arthas was compared with the wild gods

I don't even want to touch Sylvanas vs Malfurion fight, it was pure nonsense in my book, HUGE HUGE nerf on Malfurion, at that time he should have easily 1 shot Sylvanas, as i don't want to yell PLOT ARMOR i will shut up on that fight

[Terongor]

If you tell me how to make a url link without making an account on X webpage i would gladly show you the picture with Chris Metzen saying this



I don't what to sound like i downplay Xuen BUT from his fight against Lei shen the only proper conclusion we can take base on what we know from chronicle is that Xuen have insane stamina to last that long, he wasn't a big challenge to Lei shen and it was never been state the difficulty of the fight Lei Shen vs Arthas except he will win, in my book bringing this don't really show how weak/strong Arthas was compared with the wild gods

I don't even want to touch Sylvanas vs Malfurion fight, it was pure nonsense in my book, HUGE HUGE nerf on Malfurion, at that time he should have easily 1 shot Sylvanas, as i don't want to yell PLOT ARMOR i will shut up on that fight

Xuen isn't know for his stamina but his powers and niuzao is know from pandaria wild gods to be most resiliant one and fight against other three celestials wasn't even really descriped meaning they weren't really comperable.

It was stated arthas lk was more intelligent than lei shen and if power differance is only small the greater intelligence should find a way to win it but according to blizz lei shen beats is stupider but still wins.

Well if you take account jailor apperantly started empowering sylvanas during legion already and every single soul who got sent into shadowlands empowered sylvanas more and blizz said legion was burning legion most massive assault yet and the WotA paled in comparison so that many souls go to sylvanas so it really isn't nonsense. Though in sunwell trilogy dark'khan wielded the entire power of sunwell and easily controlled krasus and sylvanases bansheen scream even then stopped dark'khan.

[kaelix1]

Xuen isn't know for his stamina but his powers and niuzao is know from pandaria wild gods to be most resiliant one and fight against other three celestials wasn't even really descriped meaning they weren't really comperable.

im curios about something, did Lei Shen got more powerful after his fight against Xuen? i mean, did he gain any more powers from artifacts etc?

[Terongor]

im curios about something, did Lei Shen got more powerful after his fight against Xuen? i mean, did he gain any more powers from artifacts etc?

No not that we know of his only power boost was powers he took from ra-den and piece of aman'thuls soul as he couldn't wielded fist of ra-den weapon and only thing we know about his weapons really is that he wielded them during his reign as emperor which was most of his life.

Edit.
I checked he gained his weapons at the end of his reign they are said to be strong but how strong it really isn't specified thou nothing compared to fist of ra-den which was one of legion artifacts.

[kaelix1]

No not that we know of his only power boost was powers he took from ra-den and piece of aman'thuls soul as he couldn't wielded fist of ra-den weapon and only thing we know about his weapons really is that he wielded them during his reign as emperor which was most of his life.

EH, not gonna lie, that makes Xuen more impressive than I thought, tho I still don't think it's accurate to use him as an example to measure Arthas powers

[Terongor]

EH, not gonna lie, that makes Xuen more impressive than I thought, tho I still don't think it's accurate to use him as an example to measure Arthas powers

I'm saying around those levels I could see Arthas beating but arthas would most likely do it with his brains more than power and overall Xuen is one of the strongest wild gods out there Malorne and maybe cenarius are stronger than him and malorne gave archimonde a damn good struggle in WotA.

[Syegfryed]

there powers aren't even close to even, chronicles lays out that the lichking becomes more powerful with more souls under his command and frostmourn has a huge bulk of souls. even in game they point out how much weaker bolvar and how the stronger undead broke away.

stronger undead broke away from the Lich king as well, you could even say bolvar cut the gap with his own undead powers coming from the dragons, and thats besides the point, she would have won anyway because she is absurdly stronger and the devs wanted in that way

[Irian]

To put it bluntly, Sylvanas is as strong as the plot needs her to be. No matter who it is, Sylvanas would win if that's where the story needed to go.

As boring of an answer as that is, it's sadly the point we're at with WoW's storytelling at this point. I seriously doubt they're adhering to any understood levels of strength that these characters have, Sylvanas went from a fairly vulnerable but potent dark ranger to a one-woman army overnight due to these ambiguous gifts she has.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

stronger undead broke away from the Lich king as well, you could even say bolvar cut the gap with his own undead powers coming from the dragons, and thats besides the point, she would have won anyway because she is absurdly stronger and the devs wanted in that way

you absolutely can't say he cut the gap as he had no where near as many souls and pretty much every high ranking undead from arthas left. even the dk's the order hall raises aren't linked to the helm they are free willed like the rest of the ebon blade.

but yes sylvanas would have still won if tha'ts what the writers wanted but if she was fighting arthas then the story would be different any way so theres no way to tell what the writer would want.

[Syegfryed]

but yes sylvanas would have still won if tha'ts what the writers wanted but if she was fighting arthas then the story would be different any way so theres no way to tell what the writer would want.

if it was Arthas instead of bolvar, she would broke his sword and the helm anyway, because plot demands, maybe the fight would be less retarded by the end its the same

we can't measure their powers and the distance anyway, how much souls does it take, how much one is worthy and so on, even after wtLK the scourge was massive and in the Legion class hall they never implied he was weaker or lesser.

[darkoms]

When was it stated? by whom? I do agree with you there but who stated it?

ehh Arthas LK at top was equal in power or little bit weaker than xuen as it was stated by blizz that at the peak of his power LK was weaker than lei shen at the peak of his power and it took 30 lei shen 30 days and 30 nights to beat xuen.

Also in WotA malfurion as apprentice druid forced archimonde to retreat who killed the strongest wild god and bfa short stories sylvanas had a tough fight against malf in area were malf is stronger and she gained shit ton of power from all the souls who died in bfa meaning she is even stronger than she was when she fought malfurion and malfurion had to honestly battle against sylvanas and saurfang was nothing to malfurion in same short story.

but by comparing malfurions magical power and how sylvanas managed compete with him when she was alot weaker than she was when facing bolvar its more than likely that sylvanas is stronger as we have clear placing of arthases power level in wow universe and malf and by extension sylvanas has done feats surpassing that placing.

Again. Malfurion forced Archimonde to retreat right after his fight with Malorne. It was a wounded Archimonde.

[msdos]

I vote Arthas because he is the one who slew her, one, and then reanimated her. In my mind she is basically his minion. I don't see a way around that. Maybe if we never killed Arthas she never even becomes powerful. But it is canon that Sylv will try to make pacts with whatever evil, I wouldn't be surprised if she made a pact with Sarg, let alone the Jailor.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

if it was Arthas instead of bolvar, she would broke his sword and the helm anyway, because plot demands, maybe the fight would be less retarded by the end its the same

we can't measure their powers and the distance anyway, how much souls does it take, how much one is worthy and so on, even after wtLK the scourge was massive and in the Legion class hall they never implied he was weaker or lesser.

Sure we can’t measure it exactly and the plot would go any way the writers want it to but we know from cata that he’s weaker/lesser and we know why because of chronicles. The scourge is still huge but it’s like comparing the moon to the earth both are huge but one is way bigger then the other.

[Kithelle]

Pumped up on on death steroids, would she have had just as easy of a time against Arthas as she did with Bolvar and just played around with him? What do you think?

Assuming Arthas with Frostmourne? Definitely not...without it? Maybe not quite as bad I'd imagine but still probably own him.

[united]

I want to say no obviously. But these current lead writers are testing the limits.

[Terongor]

Again. Malfurion forced Archimonde to retreat right after his fight with Malorne. It was a wounded Archimonde.

When a creature that can destroy a planets is wounded he still is huge the threat to nearly any not on planet detsroying level or close to it also the severiry of the wounds were never descriped as wounded on historical texts could just mean suffered few wounds or had to be dragged out of battlefield so its pretty open definition you said said broxif´gar wounded sargeras which wouldn't be a lie and it was similiar amount of damaged suffered by both archimonde and sargeras.

[Vakna]

There's probably no character's in the WoW universe that could beat her while Blizz has this boner for trying to make her an interesting character.