[Movie] Snyder Cut: Justice League

[RobertoCarlos]

IDK, that's how I instantly interpreted it when I saw it in theatres, and was very surprised that people had such a shallow, hollow understanding of it afterwards.

I can't say the theatre I was in was all on board for the Martha moment, and even a couple of my friends were like "What's up with that Martha moment?" but a couple of us understood it the same way and quickly explained it as we saw it.

To me, I wonder if viewers ever pay attention. It's like the people who were surprised s8 of GoT was trash, when the entire series pretty much fell off a cliff in s5. Sure, Arya can be stabbed in the stomach, fall into a dirty canal, and then have a Terminator chase through a city the next morning (yes, that's the order it happened in), and that's a "cool" moment, but s8 was the real problem.

Well yeah... The ending of a show that may well serve as an ending for the books because who knows if those will be finished sticks out more than a few bad episodes along the way

[Egomaniac]

IDK, that's how I instantly interpreted it when I saw it in theatres, and was very surprised that people had such a shallow, hollow understanding of it afterwards.

I can't say the theatre I was in was all on board for the Martha moment, and even a couple of my friends were like "What's up with that Martha moment?" but a couple of us understood it the same way and quickly explained it as we saw it.

Here's the thing. Nobody disputes what was trying to be accomplished with that scene. Yeah...it was supposed to be a way to connect Bruce to Clark on a more "human" level. But it's how the scene is handled that is the problem.

Had Clark said "Save my Mom!". ...that would have accomplished the same thing in a better way. It would have nothing to do with a name. It would be a chance for Bruce to see Clark as a man whose dying wish is a desperate plea to save someone else.

Alternatively, had random people been put in danger during their fight...and Bruce and Clark see each other put their own lives in the hands of the other in order to save them...that could have been a real moment of bonding between them. That while they have their differences... both of them are willing to die to save complete and total strangers. And then, after they save the people....they can have a truce where Bruce is finally willing to listen to Clark. Clark explains the situation, says there is a woman named "Martha Kent" in danger and that he needs Batman's help to save her. Then we can have the whole "Martha" moment in a way that connects with more than just a couple of people in the audience. And as a bonus we get to have a cool scene with Batman pulling people out of a collapsing building that Superman is holding up.

See, there's one moment in JL that was done well. Flash is freaking out about fighting Steppenwolf and Batman pulls him aside and says "Save one Person" Flash says "...and then" and Batman replies "you'll know". I'm almost entirely certain that was one of the scenes that Whedon added...because Snyder had thus far really eschewed the whole "Superheroes actually want to save people" thing. Not just women named "Martha"...but everybody.

Instead, their whole moment of connection is reduced to the fact that they both have a mother named Martha. And makes it entirely about Bruce.

[eschatological]

I have no problem saying there were serious issues with the writing and plotting. I've never considered Snyder to be good at any of that.

The theme was good, and it was there. I guess I just appreciate narrative ideas, even if they are executed poorly. Hell, I even liked TLJ.

[Egomaniac]

I have no problem saying there were serious issues with the writing and plotting. I've never considered Snyder to be good at any of that.

The theme was good, and it was there. I guess I just appreciate narrative ideas, even if they are executed poorly. Hell, I even liked TLJ.

Every movie has narrative ideas. Execution is what makes them good or bad.

[Volatilis]

Synder has interesting ideas and hes capable of making cool looking stuff.

But take Sucker Punch for example. Bunch of ladies trying to escape a mental health prison that is disguised as a fantasy.

Great idea!

Then in reality we get a chick dressed up as sex doll do a weird dance routine to go into her dream world to fight robots. And a grizzled army veteran doing narration and sounding like hes reading from 90s motivational posters.

I mean wtf.

[s_bushido]

Synder has interesting ideas and hes capable of making cool looking stuff.

Snyder is good at the visual aspect of movies. That's about it. I can't imagine the sort of complete shitshow Watchmen would have turned out to be if he hadn't been able to shoot half of it straight from the comic. Well...I guess I can imagine...since BvS exists.

[Ausr]

Snyder is good at the visual aspect of movies. That's about it. I can't imagine the sort of complete shitshow Watchmen would have turned out to be if he hadn't been able to shoot half of it straight from the comic. Well...I guess I can imagine...since BvS exists.

Pretty much. He can do a big production shot that looks pretty damn good. He can't make anything pay off before or after that one shot, though.

[tmamass]

Have you ever heard of Banksy?

Bansky is a 3 year old kid? afaik he is a grown man. I dunno what you smoke but you better stop it :-P

[Skorpionss]

Had Clark said "Save my Mom!". ...that would have accomplished the same thing in a better way. It would have nothing to do with a name. It would be a chance for Bruce to see Clark as a man whose dying wish is a desperate plea to save someone else.

Wouldn't mean a thing to Batman, because for all he knows Supe's speaking about his alien mother that might just be another target for him to eliminate. Saying a human name (yes I think it would have worked even for another name than Martha) and he would have still hesitated for a second, enough for Lois to get between them.

- - - Updated - - -

Synder has interesting ideas and hes capable of making cool looking stuff.

But take Sucker Punch for example. Bunch of ladies trying to escape a mental health prison that is disguised as a fantasy.

Great idea!

Then in reality we get a chick dressed up as sex doll do a weird dance routine to go into her dream world to fight robots. And a grizzled army veteran doing narration and sounding like hes reading from 90s motivational posters.

I mean wtf.

I mean that wasn't the idea behind sucker punch but whatever floats your boat...

[Egomaniac]

Wouldn't mean a thing to Batman, because for all he knows Supe's speaking about his alien mother that might just be another target for him to eliminate. Saying a human name (yes I think it would have worked even for another name than Martha) and he would have still hesitated for a second, enough for Lois to get between them.

Bruce doesn't care that its a "human name". His actual response is "Why did you say that name?".

Snyder thinks the only thing stopping Batman from Killing Superman is that they both have moms named Martha.

[Volatilis]

I mean that wasn't the idea behind sucker punch but whatever floats your boat...

well feel free to correct me rather than just pointing it out if I got something wrong

[t1saif]

[Pachycrocuta]

I honestly thought that was a joke video, but it's real. Ok then.

[Soulwind]

I honestly thought that was a joke video, but it's real. Ok then.

It looks like unfinished scenes from 5 different movies stitched together. And the music isn't pretentious or anything.

[Pachycrocuta]

It looks like unfinished scenes from 5 different movies stitched together. And the music isn't pretentious or anything.

The music is the biggest thing that made me think it was a joke video. I may not have enjoyed the "Whedon Cut", but that's because he had Snyder's horrendous pile of shit he had to work with. If Whedon could have been given the ability to scrap it and start completely from scratch, it might have been a good movie. Snyder is to super hero movies as Liefeld is to feet. They just can't do it. Also, Liefeld to realistic anatomy. But at least we can thank Liefeld for something good (the Deadpool character), even if he did have help (Fabian Nicieza).

[Egomaniac]

It looks like unfinished scenes from 5 different movies stitched together. And the music isn't pretentious or anything.

The music is the biggest thing that made me think it was a joke video. I may not have enjoyed the "Whedon Cut", but that's because he had Snyder's horrendous pile of shit he had to work with. If Whedon could have been given the ability to scrap it and start completely from scratch, it might have been a good movie. Snyder is to super hero movies as Liefeld is to feet. They just can't do it. Also, Liefeld to realistic anatomy. But at least we can thank Liefeld for something good (the Deadpool character), even if he did have help (Fabian Nicieza).

I was prepared to try to defend that trailer before watching it. I was like "Well, sure...the movie is going to be terrible...but the trailer can't be that bad." But I thought I should watch it first just to get an idea. After I heard the firs tnote of "hallejuah" I was like..."oh. Nevermind...this is gonna be awful". I mean...it's a fine song...but it just doesn't work with a movie trailer for a Superhero film. Movie trailers are supposed to get you pumped up to see the film. Melancholy shouldn't be what you are shooting for.

And yeah Nicieza defined most of what makes Deadpool a great character...but you should also thank Marv Wolfman and George Perez for creating Deathstroke so Liefeld had someone to copy for character design.

[s_bushido]

...is that the exact same version of that song he used in Watchmen? And why is it in 4:3?

[Ausr]

I was prepared to try to defend that trailer before watching it. I was like "Well, sure...the movie is going to be terrible...but the trailer can't be that bad." But I thought I should watch it first just to get an idea. After I heard the firs tnote of "hallejuah" I was like..."oh. Nevermind...this is gonna be awful". I mean...it's a fine song...but it just doesn't work with a movie trailer for a Superhero film. Movie trailers are supposed to get you pumped up to see the film. Melancholy shouldn't be what you are shooting for.

And yeah Nicieza defined most of what makes Deadpool a great character...but you should also thank Marv Wolfman and George Perez for creating Deathstroke so Liefeld had someone to copy for character design.

DC and WB don't seem to put trailers out that pump you up to see the movie or have an iconic theme like Marvel did with the Avengers theme. You knew once that shit started playing things were going to go down.

[bmjclark]

...is that the exact same version of that song he used in Watchmen? And why is it in 4:3?

That's what I was thinking lol. Imo it's not a great cover and it was kind of weird in Watchmen but just bizarre in a trailer

[Luxeley]

The song from Watchmen is a really bad choice. Makes me wonder what other bad choices they made. Not worth the extra nickel or two or three or w/e HBO Max is charging. Hardcore, of which I am sure there are lot, will jump at the opportunity. How many will be happy for their choice? Will the new cut make a big enough difference? It's just not worth the time or $$$ for me.