Another "I can't breath" death: Police Reform & Protests in the USA

[Raetary]

If the local knights can't protect you, then you must do it yourself.

This is the 21st century, not the middle ages.

[Zaydin]

Well, if you want some levity from all this insanity, the Spokane PD posted on Twitter bragging about how someone called in about a bucket of rocks were pre-placed to be used in riots that they then seized.

They are currently getting roasted in the replies, because it's apparently actually a planter and the rocks are there for drainage.

[Pannonian]

So you want to go back to the the days of Feudal Europe? Okay sure so you ready to give up your wife, girlfriend, daughter or yourself if your a woman to the local lord when he comes a calling for his Prima Nocta or "Right of First Night"? Oh you would try to stop it or fight back? Well then you are probably killed or beaten severely by the guards as your wife, girlfriend, daughter is still taken or if your a woman still taken and raped and probably given to the lord's guards after he was done with you. So ya you may want to rethink wanting to go back to ye ole days of knights and ladies.

Prima Noctae is most likely fake (like chastity belts) A much later invention to show how barbaric the middle ages were. When you think about it: How does this work anyway?

Now, no one is a 100% sure, but no one has found a real example of Prima Noctae, and as long as that's the case, i go with fake.

[Elegiac]

Well, if you want some levity from all this insanity, the Spokane PD posted on Twitter bragging about how someone called in about a bucket of rocks were pre-placed to be used in riots that they then seized.

They are currently getting roasted in the replies, because it's apparently actually a planter and the rocks are there for drainage.

"Unfortunately, the Spokane police department budget had a preexisting condition which led to its unfortunate demise."

Me when Spokane PD gets defunded.

[Antipathy1018]

^Yep we talked about it, but it's also sort of still in the air? I want it to be tomorrow already for some followup, because it seems (according to the stories I'm able to read) that the mayor says it won't happen, but they have a veto-proof majority from the council?

Yeah I was wondering about that also, if the Mayor tries to veto a bill(?) that was passed by the majority, what happens then?

Going by democratic law in most states, and I have not had to look this up in decades, the Mayor can not stop this without some sort of extraordinary measures in play. If he does then well you have a complete breakdown of the democratic process and well, to put it bluntly, all hell will break loose. Maybe someone familiar with the Minneapolis/Minnesota city/state laws can fill us in as to how this will play out.

To be frank I honestly think if this is passed nothing but chaos will reign there for who knows how long, but if that is what the people of Minneapolis want then so be it. I mean the last estimate I read was that over $500 million in damages has happened and over half of the people effected will not be able to recover, but if they want to try and revamp the peace keeping system from the ground up so be it.

[Easo]

There are two threads full of posts discussing policing alternatives and what disbandment would look like, one of which you started.

Why feign ignorance?

We talking about technical details of liquidating a whole police department, which has shitload of people who quite literally are not on the streets beating up people.
This thread has like 150 pages of back and forth arguing, if not more. I am getting tired of searching for a needle in haystack.

Criminal investigators often enough are not in the department itself but a separate organisation used by the department, they wouldn't disappear...

Frankly this has been said multiple times but you do know we still have county and state police right?

I don't know how big this department is and if it has more than the patrollers.
P.S.
I am aware of that. Pretty sure that most countries have multiple levels of police forces.

[Elegiac]

Seattle PD using chemical agents on protesters less than a day after the Mayor announced a 30 day ban. So, two observations here.

1) Fuck the police.

2) Notice that despite quite a few flash bangs and gas canisters being fired, they don't seem to be as effective as with previous protests - then take a look at how the protesters are dealing with said canisters.

Look familiar? It should:



Hong Kong pro-democracy protest tactics strike again.

[Deathknightish]

We had riots yesterday in my city, Göteborg, Sweden.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvYFyk_i75w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EUX-nOdYio
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvMnrVHnDBA

Fucking idiots.

[Draco-Onis]

Yeah I was wondering about that also, if the Mayor tries to veto a bill(?) that was passed by the majority, what happens then?

Going by democratic law in most states, and I have not had to look this up in decades, the Mayor can not stop this without some sort of extraordinary measures in play. If he does then well you have a complete breakdown of the democratic process and well, to put it bluntly, all hell will break loose. Maybe someone familiar with the Minneapolis/Minnesota city/state laws can fill us in as to how this will play out.

To be frank I honestly think if this is passed nothing but chaos will reign there for who knows how long, but if that is what the people of Minneapolis want then so be it. I mean the last estimate I read was that over $500 million in damages has happened and over half of the people effected will not be able to recover, but if they want to try and revamp the peace keeping system from the ground up so be it.

Disbanding the police is often times the only way to get around the police unions, new officers and current officers can be hired under different practices. It sounds more dramatic than it is but it is not without precedence, people underestimate just how much power these unions have over the cities.

There's also other police forces that can pick up the slack while all this is occurring.

[KaPe]

That is some pretty tame stuff for a riot. Some kids throwing a few rocks at a police combi.

In the USA there are entire neighbourhoods on fire / police stations burned down.

Keep in mind that Sweden did not have a police officer murder someone on camera. (as far as I know?) If this is supposed to be a show of solidarity, in can be done peacefully.

[Evielution93]

Keep in mind that Sweden did not have a police officer murder someone on camera. (as far as I know?) If this is supposed to be a show of solidarity, in can be done peacefully.

In the UK we also have managed to go this year without a BME person being killed on camera, as far as I know. Two days ago in London, this happened. https://twitter.com/GStarkeyMidha/st...17414451363846

tl;dr [but please read the whole story] People were peacefully protesting, police officers kettled in everyone, sending in riot gear and blocking off any way of escaping for everyone there, stoked tensions, attacked people, and only allowed people to go one at a time and arrested people for not giving their name and home address, then made it illegal for anyone who was there to show up the next day.

People 'riot' because the police force them to, because when we try to do things peacefully, we are pushed and pushed until we snap so they can punish us. This isn't an 'Oh, well no one was murdered HERE, I don't see why we should act out'. This is "What happened in America could have happened anywhere else, and we should all speak out against it. And if they aren't going to listen to us doing so peacefully, it's on them when we answer the only way we can.

[Mister K]

Keep in mind that Sweden did not have a police officer murder someone on camera. (as far as I know?) If this is supposed to be a show of solidarity, in can be done peacefully.

A lot of people are in it for the riots, adrenaline and general anarchy, not to change anything. London and areas around has been mostly riotless thankfully.

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In the UK we also have managed to go this year without a BME person being killed on camera, as far as I know. Two days ago in London, this happened. https://twitter.com/GStarkeyMidha/st...17414451363846

"There is a lot of context around it and I believe we did the right thing"

Indeed there is and indeed you did.

[Mister K]

tl;dr [but please read the whole story] People were peacefully protesting, police officers kettled in everyone, sending in riot gear and blocking off any way of escaping for everyone there, stoked tensions, attacked people, and only allowed people to go one at a time and arrested people for not giving their name and home address, then made it illegal for anyone who was there to show up the next day.

People 'riot' because the police force them to, because when we try to do things peacefully, we are pushed and pushed until we snap so they can punish us. This isn't an 'Oh, well no one was murdered HERE, I don't see why we should act out'. This is "What happened in America could have happened anywhere else, and we should all speak out against it. And if they aren't going to listen to us doing so peacefully, it's on them when we answer the only way we can.

-- Edit -- Look at the wrong section of the links.

[Evielution93]

A lot of people are in it for the riots, adrenaline and general anarchy, not to change anything. London and areas around has been mostly riotless thankfully.

- - - Updated - - -



"There is a lot of context around it and I believe we did the right thing"

Indeed there is and indeed you did.

I believe I'm missing what that has to do with my post, I don't see where that was mentioned anywhere in the twitter thread. Unless that is the half baked 'defense' Number 10 put out?

[Mister K]

I believe I'm missing what that has to do with my post, I don't see where that was mentioned anywhere in the twitter thread. Unless that is the half baked 'defense' Number 10 put out?

Looked at the wrong part of the post.

[Evielution93]

Looked at the wrong part of the post.

Fair, it happens.

[kamuimac]

so i guess RIP mineapolis now that they announced discontinuation of police in that city .

[Draco-Onis]

so i guess RIP mineapolis now that they announced discontinuation of police in that city .

not really there's several levels of police at the state and federal level and they are not the first to do this in order to get out of the police union problem.

[Endus]

Disbanding the police is often times the only way to get around the police unions, new officers and current officers can be hired under different practices. It sounds more dramatic than it is but it is not without precedence, people underestimate just how much power these unions have over the cities.

There's also other police forces that can pick up the slack while all this is occurring.

People seem overly eager to "forget" that state police still exist.

so i guess RIP mineapolis now that they announced discontinuation of police in that city .

Do me a favor and google Camden, New Jersey.

Beat me to mentioning Camden, NJ, which has seen significant reductions in crime since abolishing their PD.

[Kathandira]

For those who catch a headline about "Defund the Police". The term seems like it means to abolish the police, but that isn't what it means.

It means to reduce their funding and put their focus back on what their actual job is, rather than filling gaps in other defunded programs making police do things that they shouldn't be in the first place.

For more information, please do yourself a service and look it up.

- - - Updated - - -

Beat me to mentioning Camden, NJ, which has seen significant reductions in crime since abolishing their PD.

Additionally, Camden basically fired their police force, and made them all reapply for their jobs with a refined set of requirements.

- - - Updated - - -

These muggers, looters, and arsonists are bandits.

Remember the good ole' days, when the local lord rounded up the knights to clear out bandits?

What kind of knight kneels to bandits?

The ones who come to their senses and realize they are working for a corrupt system and don't want to work with the evil villain anymore.