Pvp power back? God yes

[melzas]

what?? It´s perfect, it motivates you to be better and you are rewarded for being good.

It creates an even bigger gap between good and bad players, making PvP a horrible experience for people who never tried it or want to learn.

Not only they can't compete with seasoned players, they will also have worse gear than them.

It's by far the worst pvp gearing model you can put in any game.

[Piamonte]

It creates an even bigger gap between good and bad players, making PvP a horrible experience for people who never tried it or want to learn.

Not only they can't compete with seasoned players, they will also have worse gear than them.

It's by far the worst pvp gearing model you can put in any game.

no it doesnt, if you neve tried or want to learn, you start at the bottom in the same conditions that every other player, if you want to get up and get better gear, you need to learn to be better. Thats enough.

[melzas]

no it doesnt, if you neve tried or want to learn, you start at the bottom in the same conditions that every other player, if you want to get up and get better gear, you need to learn to be better. Thats enough.

It's not how it works. People who get to ratings that reward better gear get that gear before others, making it technically harder for them to reach those ratings. I remember in wotlk if you tried to climb arena ladders late in the season, you had to fight through people with 3-4 pieces of PvP armour/set you couldn't get without beating them first. It was a horrid, stupid and flawed system and they got rid of it for a reason.

[Big Thanks]

It's not how it works. People who get to ratings that reward better gear get that gear before others, making it technically harder for them to reach those ratings. I remember in wotlk if you tried to climb arena ladders late in the season, you had to fight through people with 3-4 pieces of PvP armour/set you couldn't get without beating them first. It was a horrid, stupid and flawed system and they got rid of it for a reason.

But you need to pick one

Either:
1) Have PvP Gearing
2) Having the crap we have today...aka...NOT having PvP Gearing at all

And for PvP gearing to exist in the same world of PvE...there needs to exist "PvP Power", "resilence" or whatever pvp stat.

Am i wrong?

[Piamonte]

It's not how it works. People who get to ratings that reward better gear get that gear before others, making it technically harder for them to reach those ratings. I remember in wotlk if you tried to climb arena ladders late in the season, you had to fight through people with 3-4 pieces of PvP armour/set you couldn't get without beating them first. It was a horrid, stupid and flawed system and they got rid of it for a reason.

well yes it has some flaws if you put it like that, but it is much better than the system we have now.

[melzas]

But you need to pick one

Either:
1) Have PvP Gearing
2) Having the crap we have today...aka...NOT having PvP Gearing at all

And for PvP gearing to exist in the same world of PvE...there needs to exist "PvP Power", "resilence" or whatever pvp stat.

Am i wrong?

Sure, current system is bad, mainly because it's a lot easier to get gear from m+ than PvP and that it still gives better gear to people with higher ratings which is flawed and honestly just stupid.

I'm generally not against PvP power/resilience, I'm against putting PvP gear behind ratings in a world where gear matters in PvP. Good players getting better gear create rating walls that casual players can't breach. You can't expect them to beat better players with better gear on top of that, it only discourages players from trying out PvP and getting into it. It's a horrible system that essentially cuts short influx of new players to PvP.

[Big Thanks]

Sure, current system is bad, mainly because it's a lot easier to get gear from m+ than PvP and that it still gives better gear to people with higher ratings which is flawed and honestly just stupid.

I'm generally not against PvP power/resilience, I'm against putting PvP gear behind ratings in a world where gear matters in PvP. Good players getting better gear create rating walls that casual players can't breach. You can't expect them to beat better players with better gear on top of that, it only discourages players from trying out PvP and getting into it. It's a horrible system that essentially cuts short influx of new players to PvP.

OH very nice point.
So...you think is better if everyone has access to the gear? (after putting some time into it)

This is a possible solution...i like it...but i havent thought of the possible consequences yet.

[Butterland]

Sure, current system is bad, mainly because it's a lot easier to get gear from m+ than PvP and that it still gives better gear to people with higher ratings which is flawed and honestly just stupid.

I'm generally not against PvP power/resilience, I'm against putting PvP gear behind ratings in a world where gear matters in PvP. Good players getting better gear create rating walls that casual players can't breach. You can't expect them to beat better players with better gear on top of that, it only discourages players from trying out PvP and getting into it. It's a horrible system that essentially cuts short influx of new players to PvP.

PvP was at its most popular during seasons with rating requirements. Just saying.

[melzas]

PvP was at its most popular during seasons with rating requirements. Just saying.

The game had more players in general so obviously there were more people playing PvP too... Duh.....

Unless you can point me to reliable statstics that higher % of players engaged in rated PvP back then than now, then I will ignore your pointless post.

- - - Updated - - -

OH very nice point.
So...you think is better if everyone has access to the gear? (after putting some time into it)

This is a possible solution...i like it...but i havent thought of the possible consequences yet.

Best idea I've seen suggested so far on these forums was that PvP gear rewards should be based on average ilvl of enemy team you've beaten. On top of it put PvP vendors back in, bring back PvP power and keep conquest cap the way it is now. If you play pvp a lot, you can slowly farm bis PvP gear that works as decent level pve gear too. If you can beat better geared players you can get geared up faster. Also make sure bis PvP gear comes from PvP.

[Butterland]

The game had more players in general so obviously there were more people playing PvP too... Duh.....

Unless you can point me to reliable statstics that higher % of players engaged in rated PvP back then than now, then I will ignore your pointless post.

You don't have stats either so whatever.

TBC S3-4 were much more popular than S1-2 with relatively the same amount of active playerbase. What changed? Rating requirements.
LK had rating requirements and was extremely popular.
WoD had one of the lowest PvP participation with respect to its active players population. What changed? Gear didn't matter in PvP.

Rating requirements have always brought more players in than out. Players aspire to gain unfair advantages to beat down their opponents.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

The problem with templates is that you are at the mercy of whatever stats Blizzard decides to give you for your spec. You want to stack vers? Too bad. Here's some mastery.

The obvious solution to that is to just allow players to pick which stat template they want to use. Just create 4 or 5 stat templates per role, and let players choose the template on a per-spec basis. Players will figure out the best template for each spec, and eventually the majority of players who care about their power in PvP will wind up using the best template for their class+spec.

Players not having a choice between templates was the crux of the problem with templates, the concept itself isn't that bad. You just have to build in additional planning around it.

[melzas]

You don't have stats either so whatever.

TBC S3-4 were much more popular than S1-2 with relatively the same amount of active playerbase. What changed? Rating requirements.
LK had rating requirements and was extremely popular.
WoD had one of the lowest PvP participation with respect to its active players population. What changed? Gear didn't matter in PvP.

Rating requirements have always brought more players in than out. Players aspire to gain unfair advantages to beat down their opponents.

Yeah I don't have stats either but I'm not trying to prove my point by taking stats outta my ass like you. Your whole narrative is "X solution is better because of stats I made up in my head" while I'm using actual arguments to prove mine.

[Piamonte]

You don't have stats either so whatever.

TBC S3-4 were much more popular than S1-2 with relatively the same amount of active playerbase. What changed? Rating requirements.
LK had rating requirements and was extremely popular.
WoD had one of the lowest PvP participation with respect to its active players population. What changed? Gear didn't matter in PvP.

Rating requirements have always brought more players in than out. Players aspire to gain unfair advantages to beat down their opponents.

whatever the case may be, they can easily fix it by making it that you only get matched with players that are in the same situation as you, so you dont get matched with people that have gear that isnt available to you.

[protpaul]

whatever the case may be, they can easily fix it by making it that you only get matched with players that are in the same situation as you, so you dont get matched with people that have gear that isnt available to you.

Isn't enough interest in pvp for that to work. It can take over 5 mins at even 1800 to find people to fight.

... a lot of these solutions come from people who play unrated but still want a gear advantage over new players...

[Piamonte]

Isn't enough interest in pvp for that to work. It can take over 5 mins at even 1800 to find people to fight.

... a lot of these solutions come from people who play unrated but still want a gear advantage over new players...

what??? we are talking about how it was back in wotlk, someone here says that the problem was that if you enter too late to the ranked ladder, when you are reaching certain level is very difficult to progress because gear is locked behind that certain level, so new people is matched against people with 3 or 4 pieces of pvp gear with a higher ilvl they dont have access to, so they cant get to the rank where that gear is unlocked and im saying that the solution would be programing the matchmaking so people is only matched with people who has access to the same pieces of gear that they do, in other words, people who have never breached that certain level or rank in ladder.

[Nightstalker]

Versatility should just have become PvP power. Or get some extra scaling in PvP.

[protpaul]

what??? we are talking about how it was back in wotlk, someone here says that the problem was that if you enter too late to the ranked ladder, when you are reaching certain level is very difficult to progress because gear is locked behind that certain level, so new people is matched against people with 3 or 4 pieces of pvp gear with a higher ilvl they dont have access to, so they cant get to the rank where that gear is unlocked and im saying that the solution would be programing the matchmaking so people is only matched with people who has access to the same pieces of gear that they do, in other words, people who have never breached that certain level or rank in ladder.

There would be hour long queues after the first step... not many people pvp in wow in ranked. There are hours of the day when rated battle grounds simply cant be done from a lack of 2 teams to fight each other

I would go as far to say that there are more people pet battling right now at the same time then there are people doing rated pvp.

There isn't a population size large enough for your idea

[WintersLegion]

Thats one cynical way of seeing things.

1) I for one like to feel "progression" in the main content i do.
2) When everything is equal and balanced by Blizzard...ABSLUTELY NOTHING interesting happens in the whole expansion and nothing "new" is discovered. Is literally a snoozefest
3) Customization and "sandbox" in customization options

This are my reasons

Except it's been proven multiple times. Twinks always insisted they didn't twink because it allowed them to slaughter those that didn't twink but because it allowed them to be the best they could possibly be and the thrill of fighting another twink. But when Blizzard made it so that you could level in pvp and made it so that twinks could stay twinks by turning off their exp but would only queue into bg's with others that turned off their exp twinking experienced a serious decline because they didn't actually want the challenge. Then people kept insisting that pvp should be about the skill not the gear and so Blizzard made it so that gear was irrelevant in pvp and again people hated it because they couldn't just outgear the other players.

[hulkgor]

MMO players want power\gear progression, it makes sense.

However, a true competitive game can't have progression, power mostly... that's why you don't get extra power in games like League of Legends, Counter-Strike or Starcraft 2. It's an even playing field, regardless of you having played for 1 day or 5 years.

So, just take WoW's PvP for what it is, a jumbled mess, fun at times... but don't mistake it for 'competitive', please.

The only reason people have fun at WoW's PvP is when they're at a overpowered\unbalanced class\spec, or simply vastly outgear the opponents. No one wants 'fairness' or true balance.

[Palapop]

Why not just have gear not matter in PvP...didn't legion work like this, or was it WOD? I don't see why gear even plays a role in pvp...Im not a moba or FPS players, but in Counterstrike do people have better guns in that game? Like they do more damage in competitive games. I know in RTS there is no such things.

because that is WRONG!

People have invested countless hours into farming their gear and powering up.

ALSO, due to retarded scaling we have in PVP atm, 2.7k+ rbg scene is being dominated by 390-400 ilvl eq BLUE geared players.

They do it on purpose. They have ~50% less HP, but they do 200%+ more dmg and they get ~50% LESS DMG.

So... if you do the math there = their abilities 1 shot someone in full 460-470 ilvl, while someone whos 460-470ilvl hits them like a wed noodle.

AND NO ONE HAS DONE ANYTHING ABOUT THIS THROUGHOUT WHOLE BFA!




Also, about topic:
I'm glad they brought back honor and conquest points.

Due to yet ANOTHER retarded system where they focus "wpvp" (aka gank fest) with multiple gear-rewarding quests, theres no reason why anyone should queue random BGs.

No honor, no marks, no pvp vendors, rewards from random bg are lower than any random WQ reward....

Retarded, retarded, retarded!

That much about "pvp devs"....