Changes on the new build. Hrm.

[Absintheminded]

Tbh I'm ok with Gargoyle being a talent with the other changes that were made. I'm really excited for a mastery pets build; with pet damage being added to mastery I think UH is going to be very good damage both ST and AoE with no swapouts.

[kubuntu]

We will probably see another changes to Unholly soon because atm in pvp new apocalypse+DT is kinda broken

-Apocalypse have 1min 15 sec CD
-PvP talent Necromancer's Bargin reduce Apocalypse cd by 45 sec
-AotD talent give extra 1 sec reduction per DC
-Conduit convocation of the Dead reduce Apocalypce CD by 0,5-3,5 sec per FW burst
-Conduit Ethernal Hunger increase DT duration by 5-15 sec

With that atm DT in PvP have 100% up time ad to that Legendary that give extra 20% damage and speed when DT is active and Unholy Pact talent and new Unholly is kinda broken, we will ether get nex update soon or we will be super op at start and then get nerf hammer to the ground

[Nayami]

Would love for Summon Gargoyle to be baseline again and instead have Necrotic Plague as a talent.

Also not a big fan of merging DT into Apocalypse, would prefer if DT was just put off the GCD as many many others have already stated. Though I am happy that they still made these level of changes considering release is not that far, but hopefully this isn't the final iteration.

[Tronski]

Epidemic baseline. Awesome

Replaced with Unholy Pact on that tier. Awesome

Dark Transformation baked into Apocalypse. Big fan.

Gargoyle back in the talent tree. Not cool. This was a huge part of our single target DPS. You hyped up this returning baseline... and then take it away? Cmon... wtf. This is going to hurt us in the end. Please consider another talent for that spot. Maybe the old 'Dark Arbiter' talent. Replaces Gargoyle with an advanced version. Do not allow this to go live.


What you guys think?

That you need to have faith in tuning and scaling.

[Nnyco]

Thanks for feedback–in an upcoming build, we are reverting the recent change to Dark Transformation. It will once again be its own ability.

Nice when blizzard listens to use, dt and apoca are its own buttons again.

[Malikath]

That you need to have faith in tuning and scaling.

Failures don't deserve faith.
And as is blizzard has been failing every day they've refused to announce their sub count.


As is, it's surprising how they react to feedback in baseline mandating the split but keeping gargoyle as a talent.
Can't wait for the investors to fire everyone from Kotick's lying duplicitous ass down to the inept codemonkies after the suit is over and the board has to force emergency restructuring to fix it from the past decade of error.
Maybe then we'll see the returning veteran developers assigned to leadership positions and the game improve to a worthwhile state.

[ro9ue]

Gargoyle seems like an optional ability, shouldn't be baseline. If you make it baseline it's expecting you to use it for your damage, when someone might prefer a passive or more disease oriented CD.

[Arkthugal]

Screw everyone who complained for adding another button back to my rotation.

[Ealyssa]

Excellent changes for PVE.
For PVP it's way less of an improvement, especially the super Apocalypse giving less burst and CC options.

[tommyhil622]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...ges/490709/682

[Calevra]

Hrm. They need to revert the Gargoyle change now and take both gargoyle and DT off the global CD. Replace it with Dark Arbiter. Easy fix. Done and Done.

[loanel]

Wow i can't wait for the post detailing the changes and the philosophy of Frost Death Knight design, now that Unholy cleaves with dnd and has a baseline aoe runic power spender i'm sure frost will get more changes before shadowlands launches, considering it kind of undergoes a significant rework with two handed weapons.

[Sulika]

What puzzled me is why people always think Unholy has too many GCDs in its opener. I mean you precast Army, precast DT, cast Outbreak and UF while running to the boss so while it takes 4 globals it is 4 globals you would otherwise have spent standing around doing nothing. The on-target globals you spend is one Festering Strike and then Apocalypse and you're done, into your regular rotation. Yeah, it's 6 casts total but the fact that 4 of them are during what would otherwise have been downtime makes a huge difference.

If you just look at the opener on paper it looks ridiculous, but in practice it was always such a non issue that I always wondered what the fuss was about.

[Unholyground]

I honestly never missed gargoyle in the first place so good riddance.

[Nnyco]

I honestly never missed gargoyle in the first place so good riddance.

I liked it in legion that when you played it correctly it would do massive dmg, but currently you have to put so much effort into it to get average output.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Excellent changes for PVE.
For PVP it's way less of an improvement, especially the super Apocalypse giving less burst and CC options.

It wasn't even good for all of PvE. PvE does not just mean single target raid encounters. In M+ it made you lose the option to choose between single target and aoe depending on what the pack needs, especially since DT is now overloaded with alot of potential AoE Talents.

I also want my arbiter back baseline. If you guys want to play a class with 2.5 buttons go play demon hunter.

[Lucetia]

What puzzled me is why people always think Unholy has too many GCDs in its opener. I mean you precast Army, precast DT, cast Outbreak and UF while running to the boss so while it takes 4 globals it is 4 globals you would otherwise have spent standing around doing nothing. The on-target globals you spend is one Festering Strike and then Apocalypse and you're done, into your regular rotation. Yeah, it's 6 casts total but the fact that 4 of them are during what would otherwise have been downtime makes a huge difference.

If you just look at the opener on paper it looks ridiculous, but in practice it was always such a non issue that I always wondered what the fuss was about.

Because typically you only see this in the higher end game play. Most of the player base won't be doing the precast and will wait until they are on the boss. Which is what Blizzard was aiming for.

[Tronski]

Failures don't deserve faith.
And as is blizzard has been failing every day they've refused to announce their sub count.


As is, it's surprising how they react to feedback in baseline mandating the split but keeping gargoyle as a talent.
Can't wait for the investors to fire everyone from Kotick's lying duplicitous ass down to the inept codemonkies after the suit is over and the board has to force emergency restructuring to fix it from the past decade of error.
Maybe then we'll see the returning veteran developers assigned to leadership positions and the game improve to a worthwhile state.

Just pick the gargoyle talent, then?

[Ealyssa]

It wasn't even good for all of PvE. PvE does not just mean single target raid encounters. In M+ it made you lose the option to choose between single target and aoe depending on what the pack needs, especially since DT is now overloaded with alot of potential AoE Talents.

I also want my arbiter back baseline. If you guys want to play a class with 2.5 buttons go play demon hunter.

Epidemic baseline is better AoE than losing separate DT...

[Venziir]

So, I guess I was the only one who liked that DT was morphed into Apocalypse... Not that it matters now anyways hah.