What is it called to oppose free basic income and healthcare?

[OopsReality]

Imagine thinking people need to earn healthcare...

It is pretty backwards to assume that, I also wish I could obtain free shit and have others pay for it. What station does your train of thought get off to make room for the train of feelings, again?

[Machismo]

It is pretty backwards to assume that, I also wish I could obtain free shit and have others pay for it. What station does your train of thought get off to make room for the train of feelings, again?

You can, just be like Trump...

[OopsReality]

The vast majority of people work. Sometimes they don’t. For example, sometimes people don’t work because of a global pandemic or a housing crisis created by banks. Unemployment has much more to do with political problems created by rich assholes then people being lazy. Sometimes fascist cosplayers try to distract people from the immoral, unethical actions of rich assholes by whining about the moral failings of the poor but that’s all it is, a distraction.

Meanwhile a wannabe fascist sits in the White House stealing for himself and his cronies while he tries to keep one step ahead of the mountain of debt barreling down oh him.

PS You forgot to mention some new flavour of fascism in your OP.

Wrong, wrong, and wrong, also you may want to look up basically every word you said, in a dictionary. Especially fascist. Allow me to fix your post: "pls giv free shit lifew hard no want pay for anything sum1 else hav more muny pls gib... work hard, being finasilly responsible harder no ty"
[Infraction]

[Adam Jensen]

Wrong, wrong, and wrong, also you may want to look up basically every word you said, in a dictionary. Especially fascist. Allow me to fix your post: "pls giv free shit lifew hard no want pay for anything sum1 else hav more muny pls gib... work hard, being finasilly responsible harder no ty"

Strawman.

Absolutely not what anyone pro-universal healthcare wants.

Universal healthcare has been proven to be cheaper to everyone, including the taxpayer, and a benefit to society as a whole and people are more healthy and less in debt.

None of it is "free," it is paid for by taxes. "BUT MUH TAX RATES!" you might shriek, but again, it costs less than the system where we have now where people go bankrupt and end up depending on government welfare anyways.

[Elegiac]

Strawman.

Absolutely not what anyone pro-universal healthcare wants.

Universal healthcare has been proven to be cheaper to everyone, including the taxpayer, and a benefit to society as a whole and people are more healthy and less in debt.

None of it is "free," it is paid for by taxes. "BUT MUH TAX RATES!" you might shriek, but again, it costs less than the system where we have now where people go bankrupt and end up depending on government welfare anyways.

Yeah I'm also kinda confused as to how a giant non-profit health insurance company run by the government is a handout, tbh.

[Ivanstone]

Wrong, wrong, and wrong, also you may want to look up basically every word you said, in a dictionary. Especially fascist. Allow me to fix your post: "pls giv free shit lifew hard no want pay for anything sum1 else hav more muny pls gib... work hard, being finasilly responsible harder no ty"

Hi, which burner account is this? I’ll start working harder when Trump pays his taxes and stops playing golf on the tax payers dime. And when YUPPIE stops being a fascist cosplayer.

In the mean time I’ll stick with 60-70 hours of work I do every week.

[Felya]

Wrong, wrong, and wrong, also you may want to look up basically every word you said, in a dictionary. Especially fascist. Allow me to fix your post: "pls giv free shit lifew hard no want pay for anything sum1 else hav more muny pls gib... work hard, being finasilly responsible harder no ty"

How old are you?

[Zan15]

• Republican
• Mitch McConnell
• Austrian Economist

Reminder to Mitch McConnell, the airlines will most likely go bankrupt on Oct.1 without federal assistance. Looking at a mass layoff of about 60,000 workers.

Let them get in line behind everyone else.
They already got 25 billion or more.....
Maybe they should have saved a few dollars instead of buying back stock and exec bonuses.

they can just re-issue new stock if they want "assistance" with their funding and deal with the consequences. But we know they don't want to have to do this because all those millions of execs stock options would become near worthless.

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It is pretty backwards to assume that, I also wish I could obtain free shit and have others pay for it. What station does your train of thought get off to make room for the train of feelings, again?

You went to school right?
Did your mom pay 10-13k a year in property tax just for school or did you happen to get some "free shit" in the form of education paid for by others?

Let me know when you get around 100-120k in property tax paid in order to pay back all that was spent educating you. Most likely you will not come anywhere near that and in fact part of your education would have been for "free" on someone else dime


I am willing to bet there is also a half dozen other services you got for "free" during you and your families lifetime.

[Felya]

You went to school right?
Did your mom pay 10-13k a year in property tax just for school or did you happen to get some "free shit" in the form of education paid for by others?

Let me know when you get around 100-120k in property tax paid in order to pay back all that was spent educating you. Most likely you will not come anywhere near that and in fact part of your education would have been for "free" on someone else dime

I am willing to bet there is also a half dozen other services you got for "free" during you and your families lifetime.

It’s why I asked how old he was... we can start a tally of how much he owes.

[Zan15]

but why should people that dont work be able to get by for free?

Take food stamps for instance. For every dollar spent on food stamps it contributes way more than a dollar to the economy.
So getting something for "free" benefits the country and the people whom paid for it.


You also prevent things like homelessness, crime, death and longer term societal issues that would prop up by not helping non working people.


Half of Medicare members are getting by "for free" right now since they never paid in enough to pay for their cost. I don't see people actively trying to kick them off the Medicare system but 40-45% of the cost is paid for out of general taxes to make up the difference that is not collected in payroll taxes.

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It’s why I asked how old he was... we can start a tally of how much he owes.

my guess is mid 20's and has not had enough life experience to "get it" yet.

[Edge-]

Half of Medicare members are getting by "for free" right now since they never paid in enough to pay for their cost.

My remaining living grandmother never worked a day in her life and has enjoyed Medicare/Social Security since her 60's.

We need to start a movement to kick all these senior citizen freeloaders off of socialism if they didn't pay into it. Sorry folks, you're going to have to have some hard discussions with Grandma and Grandpa about budgeting and not living their earlier lives like lazy, unemployed shits. (/s)

[Egomaniac]

South Korea does not have free healthcare. It's heavily subsidized for the people using its services but it's not free.

Strictly speaking, no country has "free" health care...it's paid for through taxes and such. What "free healthcare" typically means is that when you need go to the hospital...you don't leave with a massive bill.

[Zan15]

My remaining living grandmother never worked a day in her life and has enjoyed Medicare/Social Security since her 60's.

We need to start a movement to kick all these senior citizen freeloaders off of socialism if they didn't pay into it. Sorry folks, you're going to have to have some hard discussions with Grandma and Grandpa about budgeting and not living their earlier lives like lazy, unemployed shits. (/s)

my grandmother lived to 96.
I calculated her income based on social security web site since the day she started working, was shocked it went back that far.
i assumed a 8% growth in the investment she made through payroll taxes which is bigly vs reality.

Guess what? She blew through her "investment" before she hit 75. And that was about when she started really using Medicare.

If you assume just cost based on services rendered she hit that magic number at 81-82 after a heart attack, the first of a few. She lived in the sticks and had to be airlifted to VT hospital so you can imagine before even being worked on she already spent tens of thousands.

Social Security was an even bigger mess since she was not a big earner. She worked at department stores all her life.




Once we get done with these senior citizen freeloaders we can move on to the military freeloaders and their lifetime VA benefits right?

[Egomaniac]

my guess is mid 20's and has not had enough life experience to "get it" yet.

Life experience has nothing to do with it. Plenty of Boomers still don't get it.

[YUPPIE]

My remaining living grandmother never worked a day in her life and has enjoyed Medicare/Social Security since her 60's.

We need to start a movement to kick all these senior citizen freeloaders off of socialism if they didn't pay into it. Sorry folks, you're going to have to have some hard discussions with Grandma and Grandpa about budgeting and not living their earlier lives like lazy, unemployed shits. (/s)

if she has never worked a day in her life, does not that imply parasitism to you?

That is my problem here. If people don't work and get basic living, what would happen if everyone decided that was satisfactory enough and just stayed home? The world would fall apart. People have to be forced into working and see consequences if they don't.

[Felya]

my guess is mid 20's and has not had enough life experience to "get it" yet.

Lower... mid 20s is where you exaggerate your entry job, as if you just made it. It would feature, things like “I was...” and “I did...”.

[Elegiac]

People have to be forced into working and see consequences if they don't.

Citation needed.

And no, just because you personally would be lazy in that position is not a citation.

[Felya]

if she has never worked a day in her life, does not that imply parasitism to you?

Why would it? Plenty of people don’t work... I don’t see why I should waste my time worrying about it, when a third of my day is already spent working.

That is my problem here. If people don't work and get basic living, what would happen if everyone decided that was satisfactory enough and just stayed home? The world would fall apart. People have to be forced into working and see consequences if they don't.

You are projecting...

[Egomaniac]

But that doesn't happen in South Korea.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heal...in_South_Korea

Seem to me that it is exactly what is happening in S. Korea... I did say you don't have to pay a massive bill when you leave. Seems like, even if you didn't have private insurance, you'd still only be paying 40% of the bill. That, to me anyway, seems a lot better than paying 100% of the bill...

[Egomaniac]

if she has never worked a day in her life, does not that imply parasitism to you?

Maybe she wasn't working because she was at home raising her children?

[That is my problem here. If people don't work and get basic living, what would happen if everyone decided that was satisfactory enough and just stayed home? The world would fall apart. People have to be forced into working and see consequences if they don't.

https://qz.com/765902/ubi-wouldnt-me...rce=reddit.com

Back in the 1960s and 1970s, the US and Canada were seriously considering the possibility of instating a UBI. During that time, the US government commissioned a series of experiments across six states to study the effects of guaranteed income, particularly its effects on work. The Canadian government introduced a similar experiment in the town of Dauphin.

But it turns out that the effects of a UBI on labor participation weren’t nearly as bad as some had feared. Researchers found that households as a whole reduced their workloads by about 13%, as economist Evelyn Forget explains in a 2011 paper published by Canadian Public Policy. But within each household, the (generally male) primary breadwinners cut back on work hours only slightly. Women who were secondary earners reduced their work hours more, devoting more time to household care and staying home with young children. Teenagers also put off getting part-time jobs to focus on school, leading to a noticeable decline in high school dropout rates in Dauphin, and to double-digit increases in high school completion among participating families in New Jersey, Seattle, and Denver.