The horde council is pathetic.

[Kyphael]

Our current cast of leading characters is truly pathetic. They are underdeveloped, underused, underpowered and lack any sorts of investment that could draw a horde player emotionally to them. To fix these issues it is needed that the horde council gets replaced with characters that could actually stand off against the big alliance super heroes.

Orcs - kill Thrall. Bring back AU Grommash
Trolls - Rastakhan and Jindo the Breaker
Tauren - Sark Ragetotem
Blood elves - kael’thas Sunstrider
Nightborne - Grand magistrix Elisande
Undead - sylvanas can come back.

Then the horde would be fixed.

I'll raise you...

Orcs: AU Grom indeed.
Trolls: Zul'jin. Make Amani/Jungle Trolls the crux of Troll culture of The Horde. Darkspears are lame.
Tauren: Resurrect Cairne.
Blood Elves: Kael'thas indeed.
Nightborne: Yes, the Horde needs some Elisandre.
Undead: Hell no. Calia is the way! Because of boobs!
Goblins: How could you forget Gallywix?

[Kallisto]

You mean the Ebon Blade that was acting like the Scourge as well? The Ebon Blade that compared themselves to the Forsaken and found them to be too soft twice? Who took a detour from fighting the Scourge just to torment Scarlet Crusaders by turning them into mindless ghouls for shits and giggles? Ebon Blade's issue with Arthas was never "Oh noes, he bad." but "Wait, we were just sacrificial pawns just to lure Tirion out? Time for payback.". And speaking of the Argent Crusade, this is the faction they worked the most closely with. Even after Darion effectively called Tirion an idealistic moron and told him he'll be fighting the Scourge with Scourge tactics no matter what.

The ebon blade whose members actually left the group to be generals of alliance and horde armies up in Western Plague lands. With the horde General basically defying orders, essentially betraying his oath and was punished for almost allowing an alliance forward post less than a days march from Undercity.

Don't forget the Argent that was "Kidnapped." was killing forsaken for funsies while wearing an argent Tabbard. Basically siding with the alliance under the banner of neutrality.

[Ardenaso]

Don't forget the Argent that was "Kidnapped." was killing forsaken for funsies while wearing an argent Tabbard. Basically siding with the alliance under the banner of neutrality.

I'd throw out the generic excuse of "acting alone here" tbh; if the Argent proper was indeed hunting Forsaken there would be reactions from Leonid and Judkins

[MrLachyG]

Our current cast of leading characters is truly pathetic. They are underdeveloped, underused, underpowered and lack any sorts of investment that could draw a horde player emotionally to them. To fix these issues it is needed that the horde council gets replaced with characters that could actually stand off against the big alliance super heroes.

Orcs - kill Thrall. Bring back AU Grommash
Trolls - Rastakhan and Jindo the Breaker
Tauren - Sark Ragetotem
Blood elves - kael’thas Sunstrider
Nightborne - Grand magistrix Elisande
Undead - sylvanas can come back.

Then the horde would be fixed.

ok so issue 1: you've chosen a Tauren rep who is the definition of underdeveloped. also you say "underdeveloped" yet we have some of the most developed characters in WoW.

issue 2: almost every entry you've chosen has fought against the Horde

issue 3: all but 2 are currently dead dead.

[Kallisto]

I'd throw out the generic excuse of "acting alone here" tbh; if the Argent proper was indeed hunting Forsaken there would be reactions from Leonid and Judkins

Oh I wasn't trying to imply the argents were behind it. Just the guy himself was attacking forsaken while being in the argents against argent orders of neutrality.

[Sevarin]

Jesus Christ, why not just bring back Garrosh and Sylvanas and have them merge into Garvanas, the super brute who is so dark, edgy and irrationally angry that all Horde players get a +5 to Crit because the edge is so sharp.

i.... i need someone to art this.

[Die]

Blizzard writers decided that any lore hero that has a personality must be a villain. So they killed them all off or removed them. Now you are left with a horde council filled with bland characters.

[TheRevenantHero]

jesus christ, why not just bring back garrosh and sylvanas and have them merge into garvanas, the super brute who is so dark, edgy and irrationally angry that all horde players get a +5 to crit because the edge is so sharp.

lmfao garvanas. I want this to happen purely to see all the memes.

[Soon-TM]

ok so issue 1: you've chosen a Tauren rep who is the definition of underdeveloped. also you say "underdeveloped" yet we have some of the most developed characters in WoW.

issue 2: almost every entry you've chosen has fought against the Horde

issue 3: all but 2 are currently dead dead.

This is perhaps the best argument in favour of Horde Bias™

[Alexplode]

Jesus Christ, why not just bring back Garrosh and Sylvanas and have them merge into Garvanas, the super brute who is so dark, edgy and irrationally angry that all Horde players get a +5 to Crit because the edge is so sharp.

Garvanas windscream XDDDD!

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Jesus Christ, why not just bring back Garrosh and Sylvanas and have them merge into Garvanas, the super brute who is so dark, edgy and irrationally angry that all Horde players get a +5 to Crit because the edge is so sharp.

"Watch my clever mouth, bitch." wait what?

[KainneAbsolute]

If all of them can return to life...well most of them will try to kill each other to take full control over the Horde.

[VinceVega]

I like the current council.
They always said, the horde is not evil... this is the first time i can actually believe it.

Every character on the council is quite well developt. Well... except the pandas... but who cares about pandas

[Kithelle]

If all of them can return to life...well most of them will try to kill each other to take full control over the Horde.

I don't know...

Eli would sell out to the first person that challenges her.
Kael would fake his death and come back because it was a mere setback.
Sylvanas would come back and try and kill everyone, and if she succeeded she would then kill the sheep that helped her.
Rasti would need help to kill anything.
Jin'do would return from death again just to die again.
The edgelords would just end up bitching about Grom since he apparently is more peace loving now at the end of WoD...but they'd want him retconned...so he probably try and kill everyone who wasn't a Orc.
Who knows a damn thing about what Kark would do

So there you go...the OP wants a council of failed edgelords who would probably destroy the Horde in a war with itself rather than destroy the Alliance

[deenman]

We've had the Horde be run by incompetent edgelords and nihilistic psychopaths for the better part of a decade now, with a brief respite where Vol'jin didn't do anything because the developers wanted to do more orc stuff instead. Can we give the unrelenting edge a break for an expansion or two? This shit is starting to come off like Game of Thrones fanfiction at this point.

im actualy amazed they didnt make voljin do something like eat babies,a warchief that doesnt do something horrific is a mircale these days with horde writing

[Schattenlied]

I rather be the bad guy then a pathetic alliance boot licker Iike Thrall and Baine are.

Theres a difference between being a boot licker and wanting to avoid pointless loss of life... Thrall and Baine are the latter, not the former.

[Zenlin]

I like the current council.
They always said, the horde is not evil... this is the first time i can actually believe it.

Every character on the council is quite well developt. Well... except the pandas... but who cares about pandas

This is how I feel too, sometimes (most times) I feel like I'm in the minority in that respect. I'm obviously more fond of some characters than others, but I think the Horde just needs some stability right now, and frankly that means the writers leaving them along for awhile. The council is the perfect vehicle for that. I'm happy with Lor'themar, Thalyssra, and Thrall, they've had okay development, and Gazlowe was a fine replacement, Talanji is acceptable but I would have preferred her father. Most of the others are basically unknowns in regards to the lore, or up in the air. Baine is the only one that truly annoys me.

[omeomorfismo]

Then the problem arises that the Horde as written is "Chaotic Neutral" in the way a murderhobo is "Chaotic Neutral." Instead of being focused on freedom and letting the wind take them where they will, they behave with malice and merrily engage in objectively-evil actions (like, say, incinerating a large chunk of the night elves' civilian populace) but claim it doesn't make them evil because that's not what it says on their character sheet. The Horde has been suffering from this schizophrenic characterization ever since Blizzard opted to put Garrosh in charge to drive narrative conflict between the factions at the most illogical times possible, and they've tripled down on it by putting a known nihilist in charge afterwards, leading to the identity crisis we have today.

lulz, in a world where the lawful good stormwindian are cannibal that eat murlocs, be neutral because we do something we anyway do daily to every other non affiliated organization (pillaging, genociding and destroying) isnt so crazy....

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I'd throw out the generic excuse of "acting alone here" tbh; if the Argent proper was indeed hunting Forsaken there would be reactions from Leonid and Judkins

lulz, isnt like that the standard "good" undead is somewhat a suicidal that hate himself so much he hope the entirety of the forsaken will be wiped out

[Raisei]

Our current cast of leading characters is truly pathetic. They are underdeveloped, underused, underpowered and lack any sorts of investment that could draw a horde player emotionally to them. To fix these issues it is needed that the horde council gets replaced with characters that could actually stand off against the big alliance super heroes.

Orcs - kill Thrall. Bring back AU Grommash
Trolls - Rastakhan and Jindo the Breaker
Tauren - Sark Ragetotem
Blood elves - kael’thas Sunstrider
Nightborne - Grand magistrix Elisande
Undead - sylvanas can come back.

Then the horde would be fixed.

Four of these people have already betrayed the Horde and actively tried to murder you all while allying with evil cosmic forces... and you want them back to lead you again? Really?

I mean seriously, I get wanting to be the evil faction, it's a boring and stupid concept, but at least I can get that, what I don't get is wanting to be suicidal.

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Ignoring the fact that a few of these are actually dead, this is a horrible idea. These are truly evil characters, and it’d just make the Horde the bad guys. Again.

You are completely correct. Sadly people like Gazrug want to be the evil faction, he has in several threads already pointed out how he enjoyed Sylvanas' rule and such. That indeed Sylvanas' rule would have ended in the collective death of the Horde is something he still cannot accept, or rather, it doesn't matter.

As long as the Alliance is murdered first in a storm of fire and blood he does not care about anything else. Hence why suggestions like this thread exist and as unbelievable as it is, several people are supporting it.

[oldgeezer]

Blood elves - kael’thas Sunstrider

"The setback after the setback was merely a setback. Wheeze, cough"