More toxic than ever.

[Evaddon]

People talk enough to have arguments in your mythics? Damn that's crazy, all the mythics I've done thus far...we have a lil chat before making our way there, and usually its complete silence unless someone is trying to explain something like a mechanic or a debuff or proper targets

[BeepBoo]

Yeah that's total bollocks right here.

Found the bad.
I'm not ever the person raging at groups like this. I just leave. However, I do always have competitive IOs, plethora of orange parses, etc. I'm in favor of the toxic attitudes all you people are talking about because what it results in is less scrubs queueing and leaving me with an easier time of randomly getting people who are actually good at the game.

Please keep your "hurr durr toxic epeen people are usually actually BAD at the game!" mentality to yourself. It's a lie you and other bads tell themselves. If you were actually playing "perfectly" you wouldn't be doing bad numbers that make it "not good enough" for the other person. Are they assholes? Sure. But I'll take a capable asshole over an incapable nice guy 10/10 times.

TL;DR: If you can't stand the heat, stay the fuck out the kitchen. Git Gud before subjecting other people to yourself, because ain't nobody got time for dat. I've literally chainpulled and solo'd tons of mythic dungeons because the rest of the squad was taking too long and they literally weren't needed, but I wanted that loot satchel.

[didafulloneeighty]

I agree with you. The community is toxic, and It's making it not fun to play. Even joining a guild doesn't mean things will be any less so. There's so much toxic political garbage in all forms of chat, not just in trade anymore. I have so many people on my block list, I've lost count.

I've also experienced joining groups, only for them to break up immediately, if one little snag happens. Then the finger pointing starts, and everyone thinks they're some great amazing player, and makes it so they aren't willing to learn the fights. I wish I still had at least maybe one or two close friends who play this game, but they've all moved on, can you blame them? This behavior is especially tiring as a healer, when time to kill is so short, because instead of people learning from their mistakes they just assume you dont know how to heal.

It has not always been this way, and I think the people saying it's a you problem, or that wow has always been this toxic, are probably the exact same people who are part of the problem.

[Dakara]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

Blizzard have, over the years, created a game that's far more complex and unforgiving than many veteran players are willing to acknowledge. Normal/Heroic Dungeons become dead content extremely quickly, so "casual" players find themselves in Mythic 0 and lower keys where if you don't know what you're doing you can ruin the run for the whole group... especially the timed M+ runs.

Almost always there's someone in these Pugs on their 27th Alt who has the Dungeon memorized backwards and will chastise anyone who hasn't done them same... or you'll have the overcompensating idiot who has no clue either, but hopes if they tell everyone else how bad they are no one will notice they're the reason the group keeps wiping. Usually a Melee player who hasn't interrupted once.

Guilds help immensely here, but they often aren't the cure all people make them out to be. People form Cliques to run together and there's only so many Tanks/Healers to go around. The bigger the guild, the more players to choose from, but the more likely you are to have the same problem as PUG's.

Once you carve out a niche however, and get a clique to run with, the toxicity is a non-issue.

I'm still not sold on M+ being a healthy addition to the game however.

[GrinnersGrin]

sounds like a you problem

[Ermelloth]

Did a few HCs and so far it was OK, except one thing (not toxicity related, but other issue, which is entirely devs fault) - tanks leaving after legendary memory-dropping bosses in the middle of the instance.

[klogaroth]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

So to summarise, you used to be in a position where you wouldn't pug as much (at all?), now you pug more. And you say the game has changed?

No. You changed.

Pug groups have always been terrible. There was no golden age of pugging.

[erifwodahs]

I keep my mouth shut and play well enough so people tend to be nice to me but the community is petty and vicious as hell. I wouldn't suggest trying to play WoW solo, it's really not worth the amount of bullshit you're going to have to put up with to get anything meaningful done in the game.

Well depends.
I find that "wannabe"guys are the toxic ones, those in middle range of being bad and not caring and being in the top percentiles.
Good players don't give a shit, if crap happens they just move on as that is the nature of the beast.
Bad players who think they are good are blaming everyone, but themselves in any game.

Solution? Get good enough to mix in with the good players - raider.io score is very good for that OR find a guild/community.

Also lol at the idea that most of competitive games have less toxic communities. Any FPS/BR/Moba is way more competitive and way more toxic as there are no PvE encounters and very often you also have voice chat enabled.
Also any automated group finder will result in more toxicity. Which WoW only uses for low level content but something like CS or LoL does for top end content too. Imagine random queues to M+... that would be a shit show of the century.

- - - Updated - - -

Pug groups have always been terrible. There was no golden age of pugging.

Agree on this.

[Kumorii]

Here I am and can't even remember a toxic run...

[Dawon]

Pugs are shit, 99% of the cases imo! You can struck gold but usually they are shit.

I went in to heal a NORMAL <dont remember the dungeon name> with the first boss spawning worm adds u need to kill or the aoe dmg murder the group. My dear pug literally took every worm to the face, on all 3 attempts, before I gracefully left.
The day after I went into the same dungeon at Mythic0 with my guild and we killed everything without a single issue or death.

Granted we might be more geared but it's not THAT much of a difference in gear this early in the expansion, but point is, you cant teach puggers to do mechanics. They just refuse and keep tunnelvision the boss with zero awareness. If you try to help and instruct them what to do, BAM you are kicked from the group, doesnt matter if you are polite and friendly.

[tikcol]

I find that more often than not, players targeted with 'toxicity' are bad players that have no wish to improve and pull their groups down.

When called out, they lash back. Not with maturity but with obnoxious remarks

[kamuimac]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

this happens when game design fundamentaly change

you are seeing in groups people that havent been seen for past 5 years if not more

those are people who dont have skills even for m0

for past 5 years they have been playing only WQs and hc dungeons/lfr

now that gear is gone from WQ they are back in instances - and they will your life hell if you are behind curve

im lucky to not see them - why ? because i pushed myself and pushed 2 toons last week to 177-178 and this reset with a bit gear im able to put hard req of 180 on my m0 groups eliminating those people from my runs - should be even better with next weeks normal CN gear to put even higher req.

but i can only imagine the horror that hc dungeons / m0 +/- 160 itlv groups must be.

[saixilein]

Welcome to World of Warcraft in 2020.

You mean welcome to the Online-World 2020. Cancel Culture, outraging for nothing and all the shitstorms.

i Liked the Internet 10-15 back then. Ofc you met some toxic idiots aswell, but overall people were more friendly and cause games wasn that "fast pasting" and more social they dont acted like toxic, braindead idiots.

The society is fcked up anyway.

[Echo of Soul]

It's WoW. Other games that aren't competitive are a lot nicer. I've played almost every MMORPG and I will say they all have way less vile communities than WoW. Christ, even most competitive games do.

I keep my mouth shut and play well enough so people tend to be nice to me but the community is petty and vicious as hell. I wouldn't suggest trying to play WoW solo, it's really not worth the amount of bullshit you're going to have to put up with to get anything meaningful done in the game.

Yes it's really night and day in some cases. FFXIV gets brought up time and time again and for good reason. It doesn't matter if you're doing a dungeon or a raid, people are generally very patient and willing to teach. Sure there are assholes, there are assholes everywhere but WoW has 50 times more of them.

[erifwodahs]

You mean welcome to the Online-World 2020. Cancel Culture, outraging for nothing and all the shitstorms.

i Liked the Internet 10-15 back then. Ofc you met some toxic idiots aswell, but overall people were more friendly and cause games wasn that "fast pasting" and more social they dont acted like toxic, braindead idiots.

The society is fcked up anyway.

Lol at this. Every 13yo has f'ed my mother and was going to track my IP down and come to my place back in a day. Those were the days where you could be anything you wanted on the internet.
Tho I doubt that much has changed besides people actually getting punished. Played CSGO last year and some russians were always shit talking everyone. Usually they shut up, when I talk to them in Russian too, tho my russian is very limited and Apex seems to be the game for the little ones to get their steam off, but that only makes me laugh now more than anything.

[Aggrophobic]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

This is how WoW has always been.
The fix for this is the same as it always has been as well - Do NOT pug, find a guild/fixed grp of firends to play with.

[Easyclassictopkeklel]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

sry but thats just bs.
EVERY mythic run is toxic? Perhaps if you have done only a handful, otherwise I think you are just frustrated and overexaggerating.
I am always 100% pugging on my shitty alts and since the 2 weeks of m0 I had some bad experiences but also many good ones. Same goes for
everyone on my fl and guild.
That being said you got it in your hands. There are casual guilds, communities etc where you can find chill people. Ofc in pug world you will encounter those who have zero social skills and mental disorders...nothing new, has been like this since Ultima Online.

[Efioanaes]

I've seen one problem. Some guy said something questionable, another guy took offence and left, first guy asked what was wrong, us other three were "hmmmmm maybe you were right or the other guy was it's a grey area".

Tbh wow isn't that toxic anymore. If you are seeing a lot of "toxicity" then it's likely a you issue. I would say to stop stirring the pot.

Oh yeah is a me issue ofcourse it is, whatever you say

[czarek]

Find stable pug group or a guild. Cheers. Toxic behavior since raid finder exist :P

[cface]

I prefer pugging, that way more fuckups can happen and I learn more, cause I do need to learn these dungeons. If everyone does 5-8k dps on boss it just melts before anything happens, and I have to learn it on an m+ timer next week, which is not fun.
So as a tank, I actively take in lesser geared players and learn the mechanics now, rather than later. Usually a dps dies in a boss fight, and it's nice and slow, cause what is the rush this week anyway? Most people aren't going for halls, most people don't even go for CE.

Just make sure OP, that you create your own group, stating what this group is for. If you just type in "m0", you get players who are in a hurry to gear their 4th alt for their CE guild mixed in the bag with "horrible" players that didn't play the beta.