First Protection Paladin Tanking 4hm (Four Horsement)

[Zendhal The Black]

at this point, you don't even need tank in classic...

[Vilendor]

This could have been a cool video and topic if you wouldn't have turned it into a Victim Olympics with that stupid monologue. Now im not interested.

[Echocho]

Ah yes, trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. A tale as old as time.

[Frolk]

When the game is so easy u need to gimp your tanks to make it bit more challenging

[Cempa]

Alright, hence some of you may didnt or refused to notice in the Video was:

1. The Warrior Tank who supposed to Taunt the Boss from the Paladin Tank , failed to keep and hold aggro from the Paladin Tank.

That is the reason why Boss did run toward the group increasing more debuff to Paladin Tank which led to his death.

So actually here Paladin did his job properly, while the Warrior Tank failed badly picking up the Horse from Paladin.

The reason Paladin did Bubble was to help Warrior Tank to hold threat after picking it up from Paladin, where Warrior failed to and led Horse running toward Group instead.

I dont see the point of you blaming the Paladin of himself dying due to someone else mistake.

For the rest of the trolls here, whatever.

RNG happens, the point is warrior/druid have far more toys in the bag to stay up ..

[arkanon]

Wait a minute. You're telling me that 16 year old content isn't as hard as modern raiding??? That every little bit of information is available and allows it to be MUCH easier than originally intended?? Jesus christ, you have stumbled onto something REALLY groundbreaking here. I hope you've rung the news with this new and compelling discovery.

This argument is boring and tired - and has been dismantled multiple times on this forum alone. It makes the assertion that these raids were very difficult and challenging in vanilla, and that they are only easy because we know the encounters now. It also suggests that our ability as players has improved to the point that the encounters seem easy - but there is one main issue with that part - the skill floor is EXTREMELY low in classic, lower than any other mmo i have played, and the ceiling is so low its almost touching the floor.

The only factor that has changed dramatically over the years is the popularity of raiding. WoW was the most casual mmo ever, and many players approached it with a casual mindset - with no interest in serious, organized raiding. For many, TBC was their first taste of raiding, and participation took off from there. Some of you need to accept that entire guilds of first timers, with no knowledge of the encounters beyond what was readily available in 2004, are walking in and completely stomping these encounters. And thats totally fine, its great that people are enjoying it, even I get a small hit of nostalgia on the first raid night, and then i remember its about as engaging as a target dummy.

[blooderduki]

saphiron on the other hand we've only got to him a couple of times now and didn't really have a lot of time to practise it, suffice to say the damage on that fight is insane for level 60. without much FR or slow dispelling you get absolutely destroyed by the aura and the life drain ticks for something like 2.5k, probably going to want every ounce of healing you can muster. your pala tank would be absolutely useless on saph.
.

I would say it is quite opposite, since Paladin Tank only require Spell Damage Weapon or Thunderfury + Spell Damage Ench on Weapon + SP Trinket + SP Consumes in order to bring extremely high threats + GBOK Spamming + Exorcism.

Which mean he would gone for full FR Gear without any sacrifice toward his threat, hence he is not much into Melee HiT like Warriors who clearly has an issues there , so they gotta bring "Papper DPS Gear" or Taunt Resists like them.

Warriors unlike Paladins wont handle or do enough threats as Tank against Sapphiron while in FR Gear, while Paladins threats skyrock compare to Warriors who has tremendous problems with threat, so they are forced to go "papper Tank" and equip DPS Gear.

Benefits Paladin vs Warrior There = Pala can still do extremely high threats during Air Phase thanks to Exorcism and Greater Blessings while Warrior would do nothing , Paladin can do self cleanse to instantly cleanse while Warrior would depend on some slacker Healer and fail terrible.

Just as reminder to others who are willing to ignore full time in this post:

IT WAS THE WARRIOR TANK WHO FAILED TO TAUNT FROM PALADIN , REASON WHY PALADIN AND GROUP WAS DYING.

[Tsyplenk]

This argument is boring and tired - and has been dismantled multiple times on this forum alone. It makes the assertion that these raids were very difficult and challenging in vanilla, and that they are only easy because we know the encounters now. It also suggests that our ability as players has improved to the point that the encounters seem easy - but there is one main issue with that part - the skill floor is EXTREMELY low in classic, lower than any other mmo i have played, and the ceiling is so low its almost touching the floor.

The only factor that has changed dramatically over the years is the popularity of raiding. WoW was the most casual mmo ever, and many players approached it with a casual mindset - with no interest in serious, organized raiding. For many, TBC was their first taste of raiding, and participation took off from there. Some of you need to accept that entire guilds of first timers, with no knowledge of the encounters beyond what was readily available in 2004, are walking in and completely stomping these encounters. And thats totally fine, its great that people are enjoying it, even I get a small hit of nostalgia on the first raid night, and then i remember its about as engaging as a target dummy.

The "Classic is easy and not as hard as retail" "argument" is boring and tired. Everything has evolved... Rotations, classes, abilities, mechanics, consumables, everything is different nowadays. If raiding stayed as easy as Classic all through WoW, then it would've been dead years ago from everyone's immense boredom. A lot of Classic players also play retail and have for years, so they have the most up to date meta mentality and of course are more skilled, so no shit it's going to be stomped and easy.

[Radisss]

I would say it is quite opposite, since Paladin Tank only require Spell Damage Weapon or Thunderfury + Spell Damage Ench on Weapon + SP Trinket + SP Consumes in order to bring extremely high threats + GBOK Spamming + Exorcism.

Which mean he would gone for full FR Gear without any sacrifice toward his threat, hence he is not much into Melee HiT like Warriors who clearly has an issues there , so they gotta bring "Papper DPS Gear" or Taunt Resists like them.

Warriors unlike Paladins wont handle or do enough threats as Tank against Sapphiron while in FR Gear, while Paladins threats skyrock compare to Warriors who has tremendous problems with threat, so they are forced to go "papper Tank" and equip DPS Gear.

Benefits Paladin vs Warrior There = Pala can still do extremely high threats during Air Phase thanks to Exorcism and Greater Blessings while Warrior would do nothing , Paladin can do self cleanse to instantly cleanse while Warrior would depend on some slacker Healer and fail terrible.

Just as reminder to others who are willing to ignore full time in this post:

IT WAS THE WARRIOR TANK WHO FAILED TO TAUNT FROM PALADIN , REASON WHY PALADIN AND GROUP WAS DYING.

Why cant the warrior get threat? He can.

[Heathy]

tank doesn't need FR gear hes being spam healed. you never need to tank anything in FR gear, maybe hydross in tbc. dps need FR gear, healers need some fr gear, the tank doesn't need any.

only trouble with a prot pala not being MT is that they'd likely only be a mediocre healer, a fury/prot warrior still does moderate dps, stacking warriors and having 10 or so ppl spamming execute seems to be the meta. the ability to be mostly a dps and simply throw on chonky gear when needed. you don't really lose much, the only thing I don't have is deep wounds, and maybe 10% damage on the off hand. its kinda minor since I don't think deep wounds is that great in classic.

[blooderduki]

tank doesn't need FR gear hes being spam healed. you never need to tank anything in FR gear, maybe hydross in tbc. dps need FR gear, healers need some fr gear, the tank doesn't need any.

without much FR or slow dispelling you get absolutely destroyed by the aura and the life drain ticks for something like 2.5k

This puts Warrior Tank into Suboptimal Position compare to Paladin for Sapphiron.

[Monkiy]

No one said it wasn't possible, but having 39 other people bend over backwards to make it happen, and literally cripple the raid to make it work to any measurable extent is... painful to watch.

This is ultimately what being a Prot Paladin in Classic comes down to - having an ego and making everyone else conform to it to make yourself feel better.

Ran a pug ZG one night with a Prot Paladin, and as the "off-tank" I couldn't even auto-attack for eight seconds in order for the guy to hold threat, and I could barely use half my buttons without over taking him in 2-3 seconds. The rest of the DPS had to hold back from doing a single thing for just as long on pulls, and the guy whined any time someone pulled threat on him while doing a basic rotation. I'll leave how well Hakkar went to your imaginations.

[blooderduki]

This is ultimately what being a Prot Paladin in Classic comes down to - having an ego and making everyone else conform to it to make yourself feel better.

Ran a pug ZG one night with a Prot Paladin, and as the "off-tank" I couldn't even auto-attack for eight seconds in order for the guy to hold threat, and I could barely use half my buttons without over taking him in 2-3 seconds. The rest of the DPS had to hold back from doing a single thing for just as long on pulls, and the guy whined any time someone pulled threat on him while doing a basic rotation. I'll leave how well Hakkar went to your imaginations.

Only because the Prot Paladin you were playing with , was a plain noob, doesn't put the Paladins in that position.

There are tons of Warrior Noob players who i can count , where they had no clue how to even threat, rather than Taunt and failing to keep aggro once Taunt was over.

So yeah , you compare frogs and cabbages here.

[Echocho]

IT WAS THE WARRIOR TANK WHO FAILED TO TAUNT FROM PALADIN , REASON WHY PALADIN AND GROUP WAS DYING.

If he had played a real tank class he could've just taunted it back but no he had to go special snowflake

[chrisnumbers]

IT WAS THE WARRIOR TANK WHO FAILED TO TAUNT FROM PALADIN , REASON WHY PALADIN AND GROUP WAS DYING.

Class choice makes no difference here. Another player failing to taunt doesn't MEAN paladins are good. What you're showcasing here isn't convincing at all, just to be clear. If you want people on your side we need to see something else entirely. Maybe a compilation of encounters, even if it's biased as hell and cuts out all the bad parts. We need more.
I'm going to meet you half way and say that maybe it isn't paladins that are bad, it's this video that isn't doing paladins any justice (pun intended)

[vian]

I was a paladin tank in vanilla... BEFORE all the 1.12 changes that pallies got to make it a little easier. It was a pita, having Thunderfury helped a TON as the sword proc generated a decent amount of threat on its own. In BC i made a proper warrior tank. What did I learn? Can you tank as a pally in vanilla... yes.... Should you? hell no, Not when there are proper tanks that did MUCh better at it, had more defensives and were easier to heal. Just like in real life just because you CAN do something does not mean you SHOULD do something.

My guild brought along an outside TF prot paladin to tank Nefarian once in vanilla, went smooth. Although everyone was decked out in later tiers so it was mainly for shits n giggles.

[chrisnumbers]

My guild brought along an outside TF prot paladin to tank Nefarian once in vanilla, went smooth. Although everyone was decked out in later tiers so it was mainly for shits n giggles.

Had me in the first half ngl

[Trajer]

I would say it is quite opposite, since Paladin Tank only require Spell Damage Weapon or Thunderfury + Spell Damage Ench on Weapon + SP Trinket + SP Consumes in order to bring extremely high threats + GBOK Spamming + Exorcism.

Which mean he would gone for full FR Gear without any sacrifice toward his threat, hence he is not much into Melee HiT like Warriors who clearly has an issues there , so they gotta bring "Papper DPS Gear" or Taunt Resists like them.

Warriors unlike Paladins wont handle or do enough threats as Tank against Sapphiron while in FR Gear, while Paladins threats skyrock compare to Warriors who has tremendous problems with threat, so they are forced to go "papper Tank" and equip DPS Gear.

Benefits Paladin vs Warrior There = Pala can still do extremely high threats during Air Phase thanks to Exorcism and Greater Blessings while Warrior would do nothing , Paladin can do self cleanse to instantly cleanse while Warrior would depend on some slacker Healer and fail terrible.

Just as reminder to others who are willing to ignore full time in this post:

IT WAS THE WARRIOR TANK WHO FAILED TO TAUNT FROM PALADIN , REASON WHY PALADIN AND GROUP WAS DYING.

Tanking Sapphiron isn't about threat generation at all lol. He is probably the hardest hitting boss in the game and you still need a good amount of FR to survive well enough. Paladins have to sacrifice survivability for spell power to maintain any kind of threat. Warriors have a far easier time tanking, plus they have CDs like last stand, lifegiving gem, and shield wall. Paladins have no CDs to use...

[OokOok]

No key binds, swapping spells while tanking LAWL classic is such a joke.

You're not even close to the first anything, so don't try claiming such things. Lots of paladins tanked all of naxx when it was actual content and not a meme game

[blooderduki]

If he had played a real tank class he could've just taunted it back but no he had to go special snowflake

He already had the Aggro even without the Taunt and is the main reason why he and his group got plenty stacks, Warrior was the one who failed to Taunt.

What's your point here?

- - - Updated - - -

Class choice makes no difference here. Another player failing to taunt doesn't MEAN paladins are good. What you're showcasing here isn't convincing at all, just to be clear. If you want people on your side we need to see something else entirely. Maybe a compilation of encounters, even if it's biased as hell and cuts out all the bad parts. We need more.
I'm going to meet you half way and say that maybe it isn't paladins that are bad, it's this video that isn't doing paladins any justice (pun intended)

What you are seeing here in this Video , is actually the only fight 99% of Top Raiding Guilds and 99.9% of the people would tell you CAN'T TANK IT AS PALADIN.

If this fight is obviously done by a Paladin Tank, the why would you need more than that? Everything else except 4HM is damn easy as Paladin Tank.

Aggro? Paladin already does more aggro than Warrior even as Tank Gear, while Warrior is FORCED to use DPS Gear in order to make any descent threat which leaves him as Papper Tank.

- - - Updated - - -

Tanking Sapphiron isn't about threat generation at all lol. He is probably the hardest hitting boss in the game and you still need a good amount of FR to survive well enough. Paladins have to sacrifice survivability for spell power to maintain any kind of threat. Warriors have a far easier time tanking, plus they have CDs like last stand, lifegiving gem, and shield wall. Paladins have no CDs to use...

Perhaps you ignored what was written there, let me repeat it for you :

I would say it is quite opposite, since Paladin Tank only require Spell Damage Weapon or Thunderfury + Spell Damage Ench on Weapon + SP Trinket + SP Consumes in order to bring extremely high threats + GBOK Spamming + Exorcism.

Which mean he would gone for full FR Gear without any sacrifice toward his threat, hence he is not much into Melee HiT like Warriors who clearly has an issues there , so they gotta bring "Papper DPS Gear" or Taunt Resists like noobs.

Paladin in every single aspect of Sapphiron fight is superior over Warrior Tank.