Should blizzard have a voting system for future content?

[Soon-TM]

The only thing worse than democratic system game design would be democratic system story design.

I would have shared that sentiment with you until MoP or so... But after BfA, I'm not so sure

[erifwodahs]

Honestly? Time and time again we're faced with how some loud voices can influence a lot of people, that follow along without reasoning of their own, mimicking their overlords.

Would it shock you that the same would occur on 'community voting polls' deciding game features?

Seriously?

Have you seen Asmongold streaming yesterday? Most of his viewers don't even play wow or have not player before. In grand scheme of things, if voting could only be done by lvl60 chars, streamers wouldn't have the leverage.

That being said - NO. God, WoW Community is way too diverse to have voting system. Nothing would be ever decided.

[Coldkil]

Last time a vote happened we got a stupid dumb tree as a mount.

[erifwodahs]

"Mage tower was cool lets never do that again"
until they made horrific visions.
until they made torghast twisting corridors

but yeah sure.

You clearly did not do MageTower if you think it's the same.
Visions are more like Withered Minigame
Torghast is roguelike. Strangely it was made worse than it was in beta. I really hope they don't abandon it and actually fix it.

Not to say that it's not good additions to the game. It's just nothing like MageTower

[hulkgor]

Have you seen Asmongold streaming yesterday?

Not yesterday, and not any day. I abhor the whole streaming culture.

[Electric Lighter]

You clearly did not do MageTower if you think it's the same.
Visions are more like Withered Minigame
Torghast is roguelike. Strangely it was made worse than it was in beta. I really hope they don't abandon it and actually fix it.

Not to say that it's not good additions to the game. It's just nothing like MageTower

I think torghast died the day they decided to make it tied so directly to power. Once they decided that everyone had to complete it they made it so everyone could. It is why it is so toothless and bland on live compared to beta or at least that is what I can deduce of it.

Blizzard insecurity got the better of them and had them ruin one of the most looked forward to feature. It honestly is a shame I miss beta torghast wish I could still play it.

[Triceron]

Think we will find ourselves agreeing to disagree. I don't see it as a negative nor do I see a need to show the results of said poll (beyond a simple yes or no rather then breaking it down to percentages).

I admit a lot of this is me losing faith in the design team though. They have been years without a win when it comes to new systems or content and seemed determined to just toss any and everything at the wall.

Even if they don't show the results of a poll, what ends up in the game will speak volumes. The action themselves will praise or damn the various groups of the community, because it's not just a matter of Blizzard acting on their own design, based on their own data, but through the influence of polls as well. And there's also another issue with lacking transparency with a poll - what's the point of polling if they aren't going to share their results or have it influence their design directly? If they're going to take polls and vet the people polling or keep the results completely secret, then we've circled back to exactly where we are today, with people speculating wildly on how Blizzard operates to 'casualize the game' or 'cater to the hardcore while leaving everyone else in the dust'.

As I've explained before, I believe the purpose of a poll is to have a sense of control over a situation that is otherwise completely out of our control. We have a direct line of voicing our demands to Blizzard. If they're just taking the information secretly without sharing the public data, then what's the difference to how we're already providing feedback through forums and tweets to the devs? We already know they do listen to feedback, they simply don't acknowledge it directly. And what I see being proposed here is just another layer of 'anonymous feedback'.


As for losing faith in the design team, I understand the sentiment. I don't even play WoW any more, and haven't really been serious since Cata. I still come here because I'm an enthusiast of Warcraft lore and mechanics in general, but the game and its dynamic has changed far too much from what I expect it to be. I've turned casual simply because the time to do the content I want can be done in a matter of a couple weeks if timed correctly. I treat the game now like an ongoing fairly popular TV series that I occassionally binge through multiple seasons at a time, rather than stay subscribed to the week-to-week. There's really nothing in the lore that I can't get from watching streamers or youtubers, and the whole gearing progression thing is frankly something I can get my fix from any other F2P MMO.

My whole distrust of the devs now isn't coming from WoW itself, but moreso the other mediocre products of late. Heroes of the Storm team kept getting halved. Diablo 3 completely screwed the pooch. Reforged has become the absolute black sheep of the bunch. The RTS team doesn't even exist any more. I totally get the sentiment of losing faith over the devs in favour of 'catering to the lowest common denominator', but that's pretty much the reality of it. Blizzard's mandate is maintaining MAUs, not providing meaningful content that gets consumed. That's pretty much what it seems WoW's systems are designed for; keeping people in the game by whatever artificial means necessary, while the actual content is so limited that it can actually be consumed in a matter of a days.

To have it all go to a poll is pretty pointless. WoW is like the McDonalds of MMO's. It's not designed to give you a long-term, nourishing, fulfilling experience. It's a guilty pleasure comfort food that is designed to appeal to everyone and keep you coming back for more with flashy new content. Any kind of poll is pretty much going to be on the level of 'Would you prefer us keeping the Double Big Mac or the Bacon Big Mac'. Again, I point at the polls for Classic's future; it's all predictable and redundant and the fans absolutely want more. TBC is not something exciting or new, yet the fans are super hype over the same Double Big Mac package we got 15+ years ago.

[FelPlague]

I mean, neither Visions nor Boreghast offer anything that you can't get other places. Mage tower had a reward exclusive to it that you could not get elsewhere, nor could you be carried to get it unlike Visions and Torghast. So no, they haven't really done anything like Mage tower since. A personal challenge that was pass or fail on your singular skill(and luck).

1. just like the unique rewards from twisitng corridors you cant get elsewhere?
2. you could be carried through mage tower, it was called letting someone else play
3. so again torghast and horrific visions?

[SirFinlot]

Voting implies we would be given options.

Blizzard does not have man power to offer options.

It's all about tight pipeline and loop of addictive systems.
Mage Towers are too much effort, throwing people in the same dungeons for an entire expansion, for them to get +2% more damage, is not.

Tho you do have a vote right now, consisting of "yes and no" options - wallet.

[Electric Lighter]

Even if they don't show the results of a poll, what ends up in the game will speak volumes. The action themselves will praise or damn the various groups of the community, because it's not just a matter of Blizzard acting on their own design, based on their own data, but through the influence of polls as well. And there's also another issue with lacking transparency with a poll - what's the point of polling if they aren't going to share their results or have it influence their design directly? If they're going to take polls and vet the people polling or keep the results completely secret, then we've circled back to exactly where we are today, with people speculating wildly on how Blizzard operates to 'casualize the game' or 'cater to the hardcore while leaving everyone else in the dust'.

As I've explained before, I believe the purpose of a poll is to have a sense of control over a situation that is otherwise completely out of our control. We have a direct line of voicing our demands to Blizzard. If they're just taking the information secretly without sharing the public data, then what's the difference to how we're already providing feedback through forums and tweets to the devs? We already know they do listen to feedback, they simply don't acknowledge it directly. And what I see being proposed here is just another layer of 'anonymous feedback'.


As for losing faith in the design team, I understand the sentiment. I don't even play WoW any more, and haven't really been serious since Cata. I still come here because I'm an enthusiast of Warcraft lore and mechanics in general, but the game and its dynamic has changed far too much from what I expect it to be. I've turned casual simply because the time to do the content I want can be done in a matter of a couple weeks if timed correctly. I treat the game now like an ongoing fairly popular TV series that I occassionally binge through multiple seasons at a time, rather than stay subscribed to the week-to-week. There's really nothing in the lore that I can't get from watching streamers or youtubers, and the whole gearing progression thing is frankly something I can get my fix from any other F2P MMO.

My whole distrust of the devs now isn't coming from WoW itself, but moreso the other mediocre products of late. Heroes of the Storm team kept getting halved. Diablo 3 completely screwed the pooch. Reforged has become the absolute black sheep of the bunch. The RTS team doesn't even exist any more. I totally get the sentiment of losing faith over the devs in favour of 'catering to the lowest common denominator', but that's pretty much the reality of it. Blizzard's mandate is maintaining MAUs, not providing meaningful content that gets consumed. That's pretty much what it seems WoW's systems are designed for; keeping people in the game by whatever artificial means necessary, while the actual content is so limited that it can actually be consumed in a matter of a days.

To have it all go to a poll is pretty pointless. WoW is like the McDonalds of MMO's. It's not designed to give you a long-term, nourishing, fulfilling experience. It's a guilty pleasure comfort food that is designed to appeal to everyone and keep you coming back for more with flashy new content. Any kind of poll is pretty much going to be on the level of 'Would you prefer us keeping the Double Big Mac or the Bacon Big Mac'. Again, I point at the polls for Classic's future; it's all predictable and redundant and the fans absolutely want more. TBC is not something exciting or new, yet the fans are super hype over the same Double Big Mac package we got 15+ years ago.

It might true to be honest. I just am annoyed that the game I used to enjoy casually and still complete the most challenging content ( the content I enjoy) seems to ever be devolving into grindier and grindier systems. What used to be a complete character upon hitting level cap has been delayed by weeks to months in order to push systems that simply get you to that old starting point.

I still enjoy wow's harder content and even loved their foray into solo content with mage tower. I just wish they had more faith in their product and moved away from investing so much into needing to farm X. Torghast is the worst example of this by far. Beta torghast was great. The powers were more impactful and the difficulty was such that it was a interesting challenge. Blizzard couldn't help themselves though and made it the main source of getting legendary items...items that make a class complete for its role. So in doing so they condemned it to be "completed by everyone content" and the whole system died and turned into a boring grind you invite a full group into to bulldoze rather then a interesting adventure.

Part of me longed for a return to tbc but to frank I am on the fence about if I will even play it now. Classic while enjoyable to relevel in greatly disappointed me difficulty wise. Its hard to redo content I beat over a decade ago. Worse I kept on raiding at the highest difficulty since then. What is challenging to most players has become trivial and you know what that is fine. I just wish alts didn't require a month+ of grinding to get back to challenging content.

- - - Updated - - -

1. just like the unique rewards from twisitng corridors you cant get elsewhere?
2. you could be carried through mage tower, it was called letting someone else play
3. so again torghast and horrific visions?

These systems are so divorced from one another its difficult to compare them... visions and twisting corridors are group activities for one. Now not every mage tower was amazing but at the very least they required you know how your class functions and depending on when you did mage towers they could of been a rather comprehensive test.

Visions and torghast really just have you doing generic dps rotations and interrupts. There is a reason why visions and torghast have not received any of the praise mage tower did. They are both shallow execution's of it.

[Stardrift]

1. just like the unique rewards from twisitng corridors you cant get elsewhere?
2. you could be carried through mage tower, it was called letting someone else play
3. so again torghast and horrific visions?

1. Rewards that most people don't care for.

2. That would get you banned so most people don't do it. Nor do most people have friends that'll do it for them.

3. There's not much skill in Torghast or the mage tower. Mage tower was just large numbers, where gear just immediately nullifies all difficulty. Same thing for Torghast. Except Torghast can screw you over, like all roguelikes, by giving you bad abilities.

[HateTrain]

1. just like the unique rewards from twisitng corridors you cant get elsewhere?
2. you could be carried through mage tower, it was called letting someone else play
3. so again torghast and horrific visions?

It's adorable that you think so, but ok suure, we can stretch a litttee bit since you require it to make a point. Yep, like Boreghast and Visions