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Post-max level endgame progression is easier in Classic than it is for SL. Leveling taking longer is moot, it's not endgame and nobody cares about it.
Reaches BWL level of gear in Classic can take maybe 1.5-2 months while reaching 226 in WoW can take literally 4-5 months of casual play. The vast majority of casuals don't do +10s let alone ever step foot into +15s to be able to even scrape 220s. I don't know why it's so confusing for people that Classic would be more attractive to casuals. The dungeons aren't that hard and the raids are definitely easier. 40 mans are a lot easier on individual players than the 20ish man guilds of retail. You mostly just have to show up and collect loot.
Eh... Technically progression taken away happened back in BFA in season 4 when Blizzard removed WF/TF for corruption. You no longer had an RNG element that could potentially reward you with an "upgrade".
Corruption (and corruption stacking) was RNG based until vendor was added in but even then, you were limited to how much ilv gear and how much corruption you could achieve. At some point, progression also ended if you didn't do higher tiers of content.
In SL, the difference is without WF/TF and without Corruption there are (currently) no gearing shortcuts that provide "free" access to additional progression. Instead, if you want that progression you must work for it (or wait until the next content patch for the inevitable bump in ilv rewards across the board).
What RPG gives player power for doing nothing or very little? Even a passive game like Loop Hero requires the player to plan and place tiles to provide progression.
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Lol, the "top 1%" were doing +14s and the heroic raid in ilvl 200 gear and no 2nd potency conduits or full soulbinds, if you can't do 10s in time or the heroic raid at ilvl 205, it's a you problem, you're just not smart enough or objective enough to recognize your terrible play.
Did he just ignore the exponential scaling off of stats on gear and tell players to gitgud in response to the massive gap between 2 players 20 ilvls apart? Maybe that's why their balancing is such shit, rofl.
This is a idiotic suggestion. I just got into another discussion with someone else earlier about reducing the iLvL of covenant gear. Like WTF are you and that other guy smoking to give suggestions about reducing iLvL gear. As if this shitty expansion isn't hard enough to gear a toon with.
Be careful who you chat it up with here on these forums. If you are NOT for WoW and about WoW, people will report whatever you say and get you banned
lol at the 20 ilvl gap issue. Such a slap in the face of pvpers. For pvp 20 ilvl is: +20 damage flat, +10% for versa, +33% HP, +5% crit / haste.
Not to butt into your conversation, but I find this comparison I bit misleading.
I cleared BWL wearing a mix of MC and ZG gear, hardly anything decent. And while parsing in Classic is a joke, I did purple so I wasn't a total carry.
226 on the other hand is quite a different benchmark. I'm currently 6/10M and I'm only 224, I was 220 in early February.
226 is more like, full AQ40/Naxx gear. While a casual player could hit 226, I think the ballpark is closer to full AQ40/Naxx in terms of time/skill.
If you said BWL was comparable to 213ilvl or even 220 I'd probably agree with that comparison. Just my 2 cents.
The item level thing is just ridiculous.
This is clearly observable. Maybe he forgot the ilvl squish. Idk, but it's definitely not 1% per ilvl, and it's definitely more disparity from 210 to 220 than 190-200. I can sim my character in 200 and then 220 if he wants to see the difference from a theoretical sim using the exact same "skill level."
He is just wrong.
so if ilvl is 1:1% power, 20ilvls is 20% increased power, and that that isn't some how a big gap....w....t.....f is he smoking-Power level from item rating has not changed even since Wrath. 1 item level is basically the equivalent of 1%.
-If there is such a big gap between players 20 item levels apart, it is more likely a skill issue.
This is where people show how out of touch they are. This is the most casual friendly expansion since WotLK. You have 3 very valid ways to make your character more powerful through grouped content. You have unlimited space for pets. You have easy to make legendaries. You have guaranteed weekly loot. Catch-up gear is at its highest comparitive ilvl since WotLK. Casuals have it great. You can literally play for 2 hours a week and still advance your character in a meaningful way.
I feel its at the stage now at least half of what he says will never happen.
when they hyped up the class changes before SL I really had high hopes.
adding back some curses for my lock is nothing like he suggested.
Certain Classes/specs are still boring because of the savage pruning, It doesnt what content is added
if a spec is lacking that impacts the entire game. My Alt is a Disc priest I just dont like shadow and not good enough for holy.
her damage is laughable. I can stay alive no problem but taking down an elite takes 4+ Minutes
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/repo...DjqgYYSFbsrYax
Sim of my character with full Mythic gear (226/233) vs absolutely same gear at Normal level (200/207), legendary scaled down to 210, every piece is 200, except for last boss pieces - at 207, as per what normal raids drop.
It's almost precisely 20%, so Ion is on spot and there go your feels.
Tbh it's always been a skill issue. The guys in the lower gear are usually worse at the game but they have this inflated ego where they think they are actually good. They aren't and that's why their gear is worse. That's why they get rekt.
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If you read two lines lower he stated that there are multiple ways of doing it to get the maximum rewards. Two lines lower.
I never mentioned anything about time for leveling, just brought it up as that IS a portion of the game where you still need to think about gearing.
I think you're severely...like REALLY bad, overestimating how long it takes to gear up in SL.Reaches BWL level of gear in Classic can take maybe 1.5-2 months while reaching 226 in WoW can take literally 4-5 months of casual play.
You're also not even accounting for the level of engagement it takes to level up to BWL item levels in Classic vs the equivalent ilevel in SL (which isn't 226). if 226 is your benchmark, then AQ40/Naxx level gear is what you should be comparing it to.
In SL you can gear up very casually, running Mythic dungeons, LFR, doing WQ's etc... with absolutely zero commitment to a guild and not having to rely on whatever raiding schedule your realm is on, unlike Classic. Granted some of those won't get you the highest ilevel available but it IS gear progression and that wasn't the argument, at least it wasn't mine and that's not what you stated in the post I originally quoted.
That's irrelevant. You're statement was that it's easier to gear in Classic vs SL, period. The point is that someone can get more gear faster and easier in SL than in Classic. If you're going to qualify it to casuals vs "hardcore" or whatever, your point falls apart even more, because to even get to the point where you can get BWL level gear (or better) in Classic there are no "casuals" at that point. It takes FAR more time and dedication to get to that point in Classic than it does in SL.The vast majority of casuals don't do +10s let alone ever step foot into +15s to be able to even scrape 220s.
Last edited by Katchii; 2021-04-27 at 10:05 PM.
-Power level from item rating has not changed even since Wrath. 1 item level is basically the equivalent of 1%.
.If there is such a big gap between players 20 item levels apart, it is more likely a skill issue.
so if add 20% of equip diff plus lets say another 20%+ for skill diff we reach a 50%<> from a 220 skilled vs a 200 bad player