What's so good about FFXIV?

[Graeham]

It doesn't matter what you think about the game, you are embarassing yourself by pretending to know the culture with that suicide forest bullshit and try to base your delusions on a single scene that was also quite obviously said as a joke.
I also love the fact that literally no one next to him was disturbed by it thinking "oh did he just say that, shiiit", yet you think it's equal to someone saying the N word in public televison/during an interview or whatever.

You're also becoming pretty creepy!

At no point did I suggest that I was an expert at Japanese culture, though I do know that it has a pretty major problem with suicide across the board due to an extremely stressful and toxic work environment as well as a sense of loneliness/abandonment. Which is why I brought up the fact that such comments are unlikely to go down well, either abroad on over there.

Certainly, it's the sort of thing that players themselves would be banned for if they dared to say it even as a joke.

You're being disingenuous, though and attempting to distract from the subject at hand. Which was a handful of posters, myself included, pointing it out as proof of Yoshi-P not being the perfect and shining beacon of kindness that many like to portray him as.

Again, I'm not saying the guy is the worst person ever. I'm just saying that there's enough incidents along such lines for people to take a step back and raise an eyebrow.

If you want to worship the ground he walks upon? Go ahead. Nobody is stopping you. Others are free to make their own judgements with the evidence before them, however.

So, moving on - what other than this would you like to discuss to avoid derailing the thread further?

[KrayZ33]

snip

I never said you were an "expert" either, I said you pretend to know the culture.
I don't worship the ground he walks on either, I just dislike people trashtalking others when they have no clue about a man or woman and what is truely happening. It could've been Ion for all I care.

But whatever, I'm pretty certain the last few posts made clear what was and is to be believed, and what was just absolute nonsense.


Keep doing whatever you guys were doing before that.

[Graeham]

Criticising someone for making light of suicide is hardly 'absolute nonsense'. If it isn't a big deal to you, fine. It doesn't offend me, either. I just don't think someone should be praised to the high heavens and treated like a perfect saviour when there's enough comments along those lines to reveal that the public face is at least somewhat different to the private face.

Which can be applied to pretty much everybody, I'd wager. Especially celebrities.

It wouldn't bother me nearly as much if not for his recent 'That Happened' tier stories he's been spouting in interviews to make himself seem like such a tolerant, thoughtful person. Which brings us back to my earlier comment of stating that I think he's a pretty intelligent and shrewd man. He knows full well what a large portion of the FFXIV fanbase will defend and lap up.

Believe what you want to believe and I shall believe what I want to believe. There's no need for back and forth arguments over what is, ultimately, a trivial matter.

[Aucald]

Let's drop this derailing tangent about Naoki Yoshida, suicide, and Japanese culture and return to the general topic of the thread.

[Itori]

I was talking about internal problems, like the time Yoshi-P raged at his whole staff saying KMS in 2017 during that live stream lmao.

Yes i remember that, and it was satire, dont make assumptions please

[Cthulhu 2020]

1. That's a player created problem.

The community being toxic is the fault of the players. But not doing something to fix that toxicity is on the company. SE has fostered a great and helpful community by banning harassers, malicious trolls, and other extremely toxic elements. It is the company's responsibility to foster the community.

It's like a disciplined kid vs an undisciplined kid. Blizzard has not given a shot about toxic behavior since Vanilla, which was the last time they bothered to ban people for very toxic behavior, short of doxxing.

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They already said the new housings will no lower work like this. It will be a raffle type thing for people that can buy housing in 6.1.

There are going to be different neighborhoods, some where you have to camp and some lottery wards.

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Balancing is easy when you design classes not based on how interesting they'd be, but on premise they have to deal X potency damage every 3 minutes with nothing extra.

WoW is supposedly the game with the best raids, but it hasn't been able to balance classes ever. The closest it ever got to balance was MoP, and that was the expansion when people felt the classes were the most homogenized.

So you have two choices, "class identity" or balance, with degrees in between.

With class identity, your favorite class may very well be useless, sometimes every single spec. Or you may want to play DPS and the only spec of your class that's good is healing.

FF has an elegant solution. One character can be any class. Plus, the classes have lots of identity in story (job quests provide a ton of content) and the abilities all look distinct and feel good to use. The abilities and limit breaks are based on common fantasy of the FF classes in past games.

[sarkayan]

The possibility that a character can be all classes is very good, perfect solution for alts. This in itself makes the game very interesting.

[Paladin885]

The possibility that a character can be all classes is very good, perfect solution for alts. This in itself makes the game very interesting.

also not being stuck with 10 alts and needing to replay the entire expansion 10 times is nice too. And you can just be whatever profession you want. wanna be all of them? go for it! on top of that the professions are classes themselves and gathering/crafting is like a mini game.

[Osmeric]

The community being toxic is the fault of the players.

No. The relevant definition of "fault" is: "responsibility for an accident or misfortune."

The community is not an actor that has responsibility. It's not an intelligent being, it's a collective. It has no one in charge to enforce decisions.

The community may CAUSE toxicity, but it cannot be responsible for it.

[Cthulhu 2020]

No. The relevant definition of "fault" is: "responsibility for an accident or misfortune."

The community is not an actor that has responsibility. It's not an intelligent being, it's a collective. It has no one in charge to enforce decisions.

The community may CAUSE toxicity, but it cannot be responsible for it.

This is literally the definition of the saying "splitting hairs".

[Osmeric]

This is literally the definition of the saying "splitting hairs".

No, it's a vital point that cannot be ignored. If the community were responsible, then by the definition of that word they, not the devs, would be obligated to fix the problem.

But they don't, and they aren't.

[Cthulhu 2020]

No, it's a vital point that cannot be ignored. If the community were responsible, then by the definition of that word they, not the devs, would be obligated to fix the problem.

But they don't, and they aren't.

Again, literally splitting hairs. You and I are effectively saying the same thing and you want to swap the words around.

[FossilFree]

One thing I love about this game is how the gear is actually three dimensional models, instead of being painted on your skin. It's great how the little things stand out, like the awesome weather system interacting with your gear. Seeing your robe blow in the wind, or your hair for that matter, is just the icing on the cake to a game that is already so good. Makes WoW look like playing Runescape or something in comparison.

[srambo]

Personally I've never really bought into Yoshi-P's 'nice guy' act. He's a very shrewd, intelligent man who knows exactly what to say and do in order to milk the FFXIV community but there's been moments where the mask has slipped and his real opinions/attitude has crept through.

I actually have the same impression. He is a world class charismatic businessman that knows how to charm his customers to capture their loyalty long term, and the best way to do this is trough the "im just one of you guys, the little people" act. While i dont in any way think he's a bad person for doing this, or think its bad in any way, reading all the praises like he's a freakin' saint is kinda hard to stomach.

FF14 has been receiving less and less content each expansion, they too are going down the "minimize investment maximize profit" route same as blizzard, i hear people ask for content and quality of life changes to be developed for years and years while yoshi p says they just dont have the funds to develop the game??? if the main IP of a multi billion dollar company cant get funds to develop certain aspects of a already finished game, you know whats up. milk 'em. its working so don't change anything and just keep on milkin'.

yoshi is just smart enough to be friendly and open with his customers, do a cosplay on a fanfest here and there and keep on milkin'

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What i like about ff14:

- Good raiding system accessible and challenging for all skill levels, easy to get into, great raiding community willing to teach you and help
- much less competitive and toxic than wow makes a huge impact on the enjoyment of the game
- design of gear and transmog is amazing
- once you actually do get to play your character it feels amazing (possibly because just before that you watched hours of cutscenes of a
story catered to 10 year olds?)
- job system on one character
- no token
- regular banning of gold sellers and bots


what i hate:

- being forced to level trough the story that is not delivered interactively meaning you watch more cutscenes than push buttons on your character
- story dialogues being so drawn out and full of unnecessary bloat/gibberish designed just to waste your time making even the good parts of
the story not worth sitting trough all that crap
- quests literally sending you around teleporting just talking to people for hours making it an extremely boring experience
- pvp shows how crude and rudimentary the ff14 character/hitbox/distance/combat mechanics really are when not fighting versus AI
- all the over the top sexualizing and ERP, potentially an outlet for quite a few psychopaths

All in all i think its all just momentary hype. Its not that ff14 is THAT good (it IS a good game, i agree!) as much as wow just frecked up with its business practices/monetization and treatment of customers that led to poor game design. Basically when Asmongold stops playing it the hype will be more or less over and it will get more realistic numbers.

[Sariengrey]

its a great game with great story telling. But don't worry if you don't know that, a "WoW You Tuber" will make a fresh exciting first impressions/thoughts video to go along with the other 10,000 of those to let you know

[Tenjen]

Well atleast its something that we've gone from "argue offtopic about why its not good posts" to "poorly dressed bad faith posts"

[TheRevenantHero]

I actually have the same impression. He is a world class charismatic businessman that knows how to charm his customers to capture their loyalty long term, and the best way to do this is trough the "im just one of you guys, the little people" act. While i dont in any way think he's a bad person for doing this, or think its bad in any way, reading all the praises like he's a freakin' saint is kinda hard to stomach.

FF14 has been receiving less and less content each expansion, they too are going down the "minimize investment maximize profit" route same as blizzard, i hear people ask for content and quality of life changes to be developed for years and years while yoshi p says they just dont have the funds to develop the game??? if the main IP of a multi billion dollar company cant get funds to develop certain aspects of a already finished game, you know whats up. milk 'em. its working so don't change anything and just keep on milkin'.

yoshi is just smart enough to be friendly and open with his customers, do a cosplay on a fanfest here and there and keep on milkin'

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What i like about ff14:

- Good raiding system accessible and challenging for all skill levels, easy to get into, great raiding community willing to teach you and help
- much less competitive and toxic than wow makes a huge impact on the enjoyment of the game
- design of gear and transmog is amazing
- once you actually do get to play your character it feels amazing (possibly because just before that you watched hours of cutscenes of a
story catered to 10 year olds?)
- job system on one character
- no token
- regular banning of gold sellers and bots


what i hate:

- being forced to level trough the story that is not delivered interactively meaning you watch more cutscenes than push buttons on your character
- story dialogues being so drawn out and full of unnecessary bloat/gibberish designed just to waste your time making even the good parts of
the story not worth sitting trough all that crap
- quests literally sending you around teleporting just talking to people for hours making it an extremely boring experience
- pvp shows how crude and rudimentary the ff14 character/hitbox/distance/combat mechanics really are when not fighting versus AI
- all the over the top sexualizing and ERP, potentially an outlet for quite a few psychopaths

All in all i think its all just momentary hype. Its not that ff14 is THAT good (it IS a good game, i agree!) as much as wow just frecked up with its business practices/monetization and treatment of customers that led to poor game design. Basically when Asmongold stops playing it the hype will be more or less over and it will get more realistic numbers.

That's not even remotely true. FFXIV was seeing their player numbers growing more and more BEFORE Asmongold started playing. Stop putting him on a pedestal. Also, if you think the ERP in FFXIV is bad, you should NEVER go to Goldshire on MoonGuard. Because it is 100 times worse.

[Pretorian]

...what i hate:

- being forced to level trough the story that is not delivered interactively meaning you watch more cutscenes than push buttons on your character
- story dialogues being so drawn out and full of unnecessary bloat/gibberish designed just to waste your time making even the good parts of
the story not worth sitting trough all that crap
- quests literally sending you around teleporting just talking to people for hours making it an extremely boring experience
- pvp shows how crude and rudimentary the ff14 character/hitbox/distance/combat mechanics really are when not fighting versus AI
- all the over the top sexualizing and ERP, potentially an outlet for quite a few psychopaths

....

I completely agree with you... a lot of people are saying "great story telling"; it's so not great... a lot of the dialogs are completely irrelevant to the actual main quest/story, they felt the need to bloat the dialogs so it seems like a long complicated story when there really is no need for this.
Also, look at an anime face with a ridiculous name, speaking in old English language ... pleeeease. It just kills the atmosphere. Maybe it makes more sense in Japanese...

The game overall is not bad but it is nowhere near what the internet articles/people lately make it out to be.
It has been exactly the same game for the past few years, with no major change except regular expansions. Why is it that it blew up in popularity only in the last 6-or-so months, since Shadowlands "went bad"?

Lets see what happens once New World and Ashes of Creation go live. If FF retains the same number of players and growing, I will bow down and acknowledge that it's the greatest MMO on the market.
If the numbers goes down dramatically, it will confirm that it was just a temporary distraction while people are bored of WoW and waiting for the new MMOs to come out.

@TheRevenantHero - I hope nobody takes you seriously anymore. You proved again and again that you are just a WoW hater and FF defender, no matter what the topic was.

[Lane]

I completely agree with you... a lot of people are saying "great story telling"; it's so not great... a lot of the dialogs are completely irrelevant to the actual main quest/story, they felt the need to bloat the dialogs so it seems like a long complicated story when there really is no need for this.

This is 100% true in ARR, but was not my experience with HW or ShB.

Why is it that it blew up in popularity only in the last 6-or-so months, since Shadowlands "went bad"?

Perhaps people like myself looking for a new MMO after SL made me come to terms with the fact WoW's not developed for my playstyle anymore.

Lets see what happens once New World and Ashes of Creation go live.

My initial impression of both is that they're niche, but I hope they're successful because if not it'll be even less incentive for other companies to attempt making an MMO. Neither are anything I'm interested in though.

[Tojara]

I haven't played Shadowbringers yet, but I personally found Stormblood to be sort of awful. It's been years since I played FF14 again and I don't remember Heavensward being this bad when I played it. I actually like stories and Stormblood has an okay story, but a lot of it's completely unnecessary and drags out the experience a lot. WoW is far more combat focused even with it's quests, but Stormblood felt like a giant movie to sit through barely playing the game. Not talking post Stormblood MSQ, but the main story quest had barely any engagements which meant getting to the few trials, duties or level synced content along the way was a huge sigh of relief. No offense to the people who liked it, but Stormblood felt like a game I could watch, and getting any type of gear from Heavensward completely useless and pointless. It literally felt like a teleport simulator.

I've heard Shadowbringers is pretty good and I'll probably sit through it. The issue I find with the game still remains from when I tried it years ago though. It's basically the same game it was since the start, and aside from the story being pretty good I don't know if I'd recommend it to anybody. If you're bored of WoW and want something to sink your teeth into, go for it, but it's a huge investment to get into. For a story driven game ARR doesn't get that great until the end of the experience, HW is amazing, and Stormblood is simply "okay". There are story beats in Stormblood I really like, however there's so much filler that it really drags on the experience (Doma part was my favorite in Stormblood).

Heavensward is indeed amazing, which is probably why the free trial ends there. It tells a pretty good story from expansion start until half way through the post MSQ.