[Movie/TV/Comic] Marvel Cinematic Universe: A place to talk all things Marvel

[exochaft]

And all this comes from?

Because p4 and p5 (one movie so far) haven't performed as p3 and Infinity War/Endgame?

Really, mate, i don't doubt the franchise isn't as successful as before, but all that dread and panic and stuff, are just things your brain farts.

Feige will only leave only and if p6 tanks.

Ultimately, it's because Disney either loses money or doesn't make enough money as it intends. Disney heavily intended for the MCU movies and shows (as well as Star Wars) to be the main driver for their streaming service... and they're losing billions of dollars constantly from their streaming service according to their own data. When it comes to the movies, looking at the gross totals alone isn't a good metric as the price of tickets and inflation have soared as of late and over time; accounting for such things, we're seeing roughly 40% less people seeing MCU movies (aside from No Way Home, which was technically a Sony production, so Sony gets most of that money). This isn't even getting into the fact that the advertised budget for these films is likely vastly underestimated, especially when you start to factor in movie delays, reshoots, etc. Furthermore, when you account for where the money's coming from and the bills Disney has to pay, an MCU movie is lucky to break even. At best, Disney probably thinks it's not making enough money from the MCU; at worst, Disney is actually losing money from their MCU movies.

Right now, Disney's revenue is being heavily carried by its theme parks. Despite that, they still fired their former CEO on a Sunday night while he was at an Elton John concert... which is not something a healthy company does when it thinks everything is going swell. Part of the problem is that a lot of the upper management at Disney as weeded out opposition so there isn't any internal challenges of substance. It's one of those self-installed regimes that everyone complains about from other large corporations, yet people seem to forget that when it comes to Disney. This is also why the direction and execution of the MCU is unlikely to change, as the people that were the most influencial when the MCU was starting and formed have been kicked out or fired for various reasons by the time Phase 3 ended. Phase 4 and beyond is basically being run by those who protected themselves after kicking out most of the people who built up the MCU up to that point.

Even if one just closes their eyes and ears to all of this, how the MCU is being run is ridiculous. It's no big secret that they audition directors not on their skill but if they meet certain ESG-esque criterion, they hire people with hardly any writing experience to where scripts aren't even done in the middle of filming (or they just go with the first rough draft without revisions), and their shows are more aimed at propagandizing and preaching to their audience versus trying to entertain the masses. Occasionally you get a writer or director that tries to make something beyond the current mold, then the executives note the project to death (Ant Man 3 is a good example of this, as the original plan was waaaaay better than what we got until the executive producers got their hands on it). And that's not just me saying this, these things have been said by those working at Disney and reported in the news and social media. Add onto this that Disney keeps delaying MCU movies and shows to a later date (or indefinitely in some cases, which is usually a nice way of saying they're canceling shows) constantly, as well as rearranging content on a regular basis... these sorts of actions to not indicate that the original plan is being followed or their plan is going well.

Even if P6 tanks, I don't see Feige getting the axe. Again, he's positioned himself by getting rid of all the other MCU architects (who were way more influential at the start of the MCU, like Perlmutter) so he's surrounded by people who agree with him. Considering how Phase 4 went and how we're starting Phase 5, I certainly think Feige needs to be axed yesterday. However, Feige's is now entrenched to where it'll be very hard to get rid of him. The problem is who would you replace him with if you managed to fire Feige. When it comes to several big name actors and directors, they haven't been shy about staying away from Disney (whether it's the MCU or Star Wars), so I don't think it'd be a stretch that executives may have similar feelings. Of course, if you don't offer massive amounts of money and guarantee the power to make any and all changes you see fit, I don't see anyone excitedly wanting to run the MCU.

[Fencers]

Demographic tracking for Antman 3 was not that great. 2nd week reportage even worse.

These numbers are so hot right now. I saw exhibitiors are clearing all premium offerings by the 3rd.

[Dystemper]

Ultimately, it's because Disney either loses money or doesn't make enough money as it intends. Disney heavily intended for the MCU movies and shows (as well as Star Wars) to be the main driver for their streaming service... and they're losing billions of dollars constantly from their streaming service according to their own data. When it comes to the movies, looking at the gross totals alone isn't a good metric as the price of tickets and inflation have soared as of late and over time; accounting for such things, we're seeing roughly 40% less people seeing MCU movies (aside from No Way Home, which was technically a Sony production, so Sony gets most of that money). This isn't even getting into the fact that the advertised budget for these films is likely vastly underestimated, especially when you start to factor in movie delays, reshoots, etc. Furthermore, when you account for where the money's coming from and the bills Disney has to pay, an MCU movie is lucky to break even. At best, Disney probably thinks it's not making enough money from the MCU; at worst, Disney is actually losing money from their MCU movies.

Right now, Disney's revenue is being heavily carried by its theme parks. Despite that, they still fired their former CEO on a Sunday night while he was at an Elton John concert... which is not something a healthy company does when it thinks everything is going swell. Part of the problem is that a lot of the upper management at Disney as weeded out opposition so there isn't any internal challenges of substance. It's one of those self-installed regimes that everyone complains about from other large corporations, yet people seem to forget that when it comes to Disney. This is also why the direction and execution of the MCU is unlikely to change, as the people that were the most influencial when the MCU was starting and formed have been kicked out or fired for various reasons by the time Phase 3 ended. Phase 4 and beyond is basically being run by those who protected themselves after kicking out most of the people who built up the MCU up to that point.

Even if one just closes their eyes and ears to all of this, how the MCU is being run is ridiculous. It's no big secret that they audition directors not on their skill but if they meet certain ESG-esque criterion, they hire people with hardly any writing experience to where scripts aren't even done in the middle of filming (or they just go with the first rough draft without revisions), and their shows are more aimed at propagandizing and preaching to their audience versus trying to entertain the masses. Occasionally you get a writer or director that tries to make something beyond the current mold, then the executives note the project to death (Ant Man 3 is a good example of this, as the original plan was waaaaay better than what we got until the executive producers got their hands on it). And that's not just me saying this, these things have been said by those working at Disney and reported in the news and social media. Add onto this that Disney keeps delaying MCU movies and shows to a later date (or indefinitely in some cases, which is usually a nice way of saying they're canceling shows) constantly, as well as rearranging content on a regular basis... these sorts of actions to not indicate that the original plan is being followed or their plan is going well.

Even if P6 tanks, I don't see Feige getting the axe. Again, he's positioned himself by getting rid of all the other MCU architects (who were way more influential at the start of the MCU, like Perlmutter) so he's surrounded by people who agree with him. Considering how Phase 4 went and how we're starting Phase 5, I certainly think Feige needs to be axed yesterday. However, Feige's is now entrenched to where it'll be very hard to get rid of him. The problem is who would you replace him with if you managed to fire Feige. When it comes to several big name actors and directors, they haven't been shy about staying away from Disney (whether it's the MCU or Star Wars), so I don't think it'd be a stretch that executives may have similar feelings. Of course, if you don't offer massive amounts of money and guarantee the power to make any and all changes you see fit, I don't see anyone excitedly wanting to run the MCU.

One name that keeps popping up in the rumor mill is Jon Favreau to take over. He is certainly talented enough and is the Man who basically started it all with Iron Man. In Hollywood and corporate America, it's not so much what you have done, it's what have you done lately. It's why you see extremely talented actors have a run if great movies, but one bomb and they suddenly disappear or start a swift downward spiral.

Big part of D+ losing billions in a single qtr can be traced back to the Marvel shows. No matter whow much the Stan's and shills want to say otherwise, the majority if the shows were very meh. She Hulk Mrs. Marvel, Hawk-eye. Etc ... all leading to dwindling subs and loss of money. There is a reason why Feige dud a sudden about face and Said they were going to cut costs, slow down content and focus on quality.

Also does not help you had Directore and actors insult basically half your audience and say things like, This show is not for you. You spend almost 10 years diving snd driving away audience, it gonna come back and bite you in the ass.

Feige was the one saying Quantumania was as important as Endgame and was the can't muss movie to kick off Phase 5.

Disney , Marvel and Star Wars has some serious issues that need fixing . Even the shill access media is starting to cone out and say it. Feige job is not guaranteed. No matter what you might have done years ago, if you are costing them billions now, they can and will get tid if you to make the shareholders happy.

- - - Updated - - -

Demographic tracking for Antman 3.was not that great. 2nd week reportage even worse.

These numbers are so hot right now. I saw exhibitiors are clearing all premium offerings by the 3rd.

Do you think this will negatively impact future movies? This trend of a big opening but dropping off suddenly and by 21 days the movie is just dead in the water.

- - - Updated - - -

https://movieweb.com/kevin-feige-say...ngers-endgame/

Things like this end up biting him in the ass.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Im gonna make a wild guess and bet they didn't die like shit against one super hero while being dumb and doing nothing

one literally had reed kill all the other members at there first meeting with out them even being able to get off of there chairs.

[Fencers]

One name that keeps popping up in the rumor mill is Jon Favreau to take over.

He is being rumored to be be a more frequent co-producer. Fiege was for a very long time the sole credited producer of Marvel properties at Disney. This was extremely rare and also a Disney development flex.

However, Fiege has taken on co-producers from other Disney development groups. This hasn't been seen as that great internally. Favreau is well liked by Fiege and Disney feels Favs has a lot of cache after leading several successful properties; namely the live action remakes.

Do you think this will negatively impact future movies? This trend of a big opening but dropping off suddenly and by 21 days the movie is just dead in the water.

No. The 4-Day helped Antman 3 dodge a bullet. Their gamble turned out to be a good play but that is partly why this was watched so hotly.

The positioning was an experiment. MGM/Amazon pushed Creed 3 one week out and Uni was going to lauunch CB sooner in the slate. But they felt their might be weaker returns in week 1. The focus testing for Cocain Bear was terrific.

Antman 3 might have a shorter PVOD release but Disney can still say they crossed century in week 1 and can finish under 250. Which would affect ancillary to a degree.

Though Multiverse of Madness didn't benefit from that release like Love & Thunder did on PVOD.

Antman 3 is skewing strongly male despite the two female co-leads. So they are not sure this will perform on PVOD like Love & Thunder did, which obviously, had strong female engagement in ancillary.

[Shadowferal]

This hasn't been seen as that great internally. Favreau is well liked by Fiege and Disney feels Favs has a lot of cache after leading several successful properties; namely the live action remakes.

I firmly believe that If it weren't for Favreau Ironman wouldn't have been nearly as good, and the mcu wouldn't likely exist.

[Fencers]

I firmly believe that If it weren't for Favreau Ironman wouldn't have been nearly as good, and the mcu wouldn't likely exist.

That is not a controversial take. That is what the industry thinks as well. Iron Man and the first Avengers have been seen as the key touchstones for changing modern business. Iron Man is as important to modern Hollywood as Jaws was in the past. Totally changed the blockbuster and tentpole film for distros and exos.

There is no property on Marvel's level of success in the modern era aside from Avatar. Which Disney also owns.

[loras]

So i've heard recent marvel releases suck ass, last one i saw fullt was Multiverse of madness which imo gets a bare passing grade but doesn't "suck ass" as opposed to that Thor movie with the god butcher that was just too painful to watch with how bad it was.

So the question: How have newer releases been? I've heard bad shit as stated but i tend to take any opinion with more than a few grains of salt, so i'm hoping to hear something about the "how"s and "why"s of sucking/not sucking.

[Jotaux]

I honestly can’t stand the actress that plays Cassie - she has such dead expressions and can’t act. Even more annoying, I feel like majority of the dialogue was her and Rudd just yelling ”Dad!” and ”Cassie!” back and forth to each other.

One issue I did have in the movie is her giving her dad a hard time. This guy saved not only half the planet but half the universe, let the man rest.

[everydaygamer]

One issue I did have in the movie is her giving her dad a hard time. This guy saved not only half the planet but half the universe, let the man rest.

They let him rest, now he's just resting on his laurels while repeatedly patting himself on the back. Its like an astronaut who won't shut about going to space. Yeah, good for you but it's time to move on.

[Fencers]

One issue I did have in the movie is her giving her dad a hard time. This guy saved not only half the planet but half the universe, let the man rest.

LMAO

https://www.amazon.com/Look-Out-Litt.../dp/1368090133

[Dystemper]

LMAO

https://www.amazon.com/Look-Out-Litt.../dp/1368090133

Have you heard of any extensive reshoots on The Marvels?

[Immitis]

That is not a controversial take. That is what the industry thinks as well. Iron Man and the first Avengers have been seen as the key touchstones for changing modern business. Iron Man is as important to modern Hollywood as Jaws was in the past. Totally changed the blockbuster and tentpole film for distros and exos.

There is no property on Marvel's level of success in the modern era aside from Avatar. Which Disney also owns.

I would say the mcu as a whole is one of the biggest accomplishments in film, not necessarily in quality but just the fact that they have a working cinematic universe.

Is there any other universe or series of films thats managed to work out?

Theres only a handful of series i can think of that exist in the same universe with anywhere near as many movies and none of them on the scale of sucess marvel has had.

I can think of super sentai/power rangers, star trek, star wars, the toei verse with the godzilla stuff. None of those i would say come close to being as successful financially as the mcu stuff except star wars.

[Orby]

My comment about Disney being "woke," and that being the issue, was based on that poster's posting history. Nothing more.

I thought you wre talking generally, my bad.

[RobertoCarlos]

I would say the mcu as a whole is one of the biggest accomplishments in film, not necessarily in quality but just the fact that they have a working cinematic universe.

Is there any other universe or series of films thats managed to work out?

Theres only a handful of series i can think of that exist in the same universe with anywhere near as many movies and none of them on the scale of sucess marvel has had.

I can think of super sentai/power rangers, star trek, star wars, the toei verse with the godzilla stuff. None of those i would say come close to being as successful financially as the mcu stuff except star wars.

James bond

/10char

[Makabreska]

James bond

/10char

Not really comparable. JB is a one guy show with a few recurring supporting characters. His pre-Daniel Craig movies weren't even connected to each other beside few small thinks like Jaws. Meanwhile MCU was building many interconnecting stories and characters since Iron Man, culmination with a MASSIVE ensemble cast in Infinity Wars.

[RobertoCarlos]

Not really comparable. JB is a one guy show with a few recurring supporting characters. His pre-Daniel Craig movies weren't even connected to each other beside few small thinks like Jaws. Meanwhile MCU was building many interconnecting stories and characters since Iron Man, culmination with a MASSIVE ensemble cast in Infinity Wars.

Shared characters in the universe. Reacurring style/themes.

I guess they needed more Dr No turning around in his chair at the end of the film?

People massively over hype the "shared multiverse" aspect of the MCU. Its glorified clever use of end credits.

[Jotaux]

They let him rest, now he's just resting on his laurels while repeatedly patting himself on the back. Its like an astronaut who won't shut about going to space. Yeah, good for you but it's time to move on.

I didn't realize you had to do more after saving half the universe.

[Biomega]

"You're really milking that whole 'I helped un-death untold gajillions of people' thing, huh, Mr. Hero? Give it a rest already, it wasn't even the WHOLE universe you saved, geez."

Pretty accurate tbh, because that is 100% how people would react to this if it was to actually happen.

[Makabreska]

Shared characters in the universe. Reacurring style/themes.

I guess they needed more Dr No turning around in his chair at the end of the film?

People massively over hype the "shared multiverse" aspect of the MCU. Its glorified clever use of end credits.

Again, JB does not compare. Separate movies with almost zero connection. They didn't treat them as a movie universe going on, just a separate sets of stories (until Daniel Craig). And strangely enough, this "glorified clever use of end credits" was having many attempts at copying it, but even it's natural competitor DC somehow failed at it. So maybe there is more to it and you are massively underestimating it?