Are Evokers getting a new spec?

[Ielenia]

Because that tanking Evoker is datamined from 10.1 where we’re supposedly getting a new Evoker spec.

There's no "evoker tank" datamined.

This has already been explained.

You mean "bullshitted". Making a "ranged tank" that will stay in melee the entire time is pointless.

The point is allowing a caster to tank.

But it doesn't need to tank, and the developers already expressed their intention for the class to be a ranged spellcaster. Not a melee, not a tank.

And a caster tank circumvents that.

It does not. On top of being completely pointless.

Doubtful, since it lines up both with the quest it mentions in 10.07, and the theme of 10.1 which is a Neltharion, the creator of the Dracthyr.

Because god forbids this internet troll actually try to make his trolling believable, to make as many people as possible believe it. Imagine that, trying to make people actually believe you.

[Teriz]

What is the point of this argument lol. It's obviously a super early outline of the quest text, not a real thought out quest text. It's not up to you to believe the screenshot being real or not, the quest was legitimately datamined like that so it exists in the files, you can find it on the PTR version of wowhead.

It’s simple; The evidence is so blatant and literal that all you can do is say that the evidence itself is fraudulent.

[Ielenia]

What is the point of this argument lol. It's obviously a super early outline of the quest text, not a real thought out quest text.

Then how come this is the only time such a "super early outline of a quest" is ever datamined in the history of datamining WoW PTR patches? It's a little super convenient, isn't it?

[Teriz]

There's no "evoker tank" datamined.

Stoneclaw is an Evoker that can assume a tanking role.

You mean "bullshitted". Making a "ranged tank" that will stay in melee the entire time is pointless.

Again, with that you can allow a caster class with primarily casting abilities to tank. How is that pointless?

But it doesn't need to tank, and the developers already expressed their intention for the class to be a ranged spellcaster. Not a melee, not a tank.

And yet tanking makes the most sense for a black dragon-based spec, and it can be done rather easily.

Because god forbids this internet troll actually try to make his trolling believable, to make as many people as possible believe it. Imagine that, trying to make people actually believe you.

Who is this internet troll you’re talking about? Blizzard?

[Ielenia]

Stoneclaw is an Evoker that can assume a tanking role.

And Garrosh was a warrior who could use the Void. Also Anduin is a priest who can wear plate and fighting in melee. Genn is a warrior who can fight unarmed. Thrall is a shaman who for half a decade wore plate armor. Stoneclaw allegedly taking a supposedly tanking role doesn't mean anything.

Again, with that you can allow a caster class with primarily casting abilities to tank. How is that pointless?

Because it makes the whole ranged thing pointless. But this discussion is meaningless. The developers already said they killed the idea for a tank spec for the class pretty early on in its development.

And yet tanking makes the most sense for a black dragon-based spec, and it can be done rather easily.

It doesn't make any sense for a ranged spellcasting class.

[Teriz]

And Garrosh was a warrior who could use the Void. Also Anduin is a priest who can wear plate and fighting in melee. Genn is a warrior who can fight unarmed. Thrall is a shaman who for half a decade wore plate armor. Stoneclaw allegedly taking a supposedly tanking role doesn't mean anything.

And this is an Evoker that can take a tanking role that is datamined from this quest that is related to the lost specialization in 10.1.

https://twitter.com/Portergauge/stat...48778215448577

But this discussion is meaningless.

The discussion isn't pointless. We have information pointing towards a 3rd spec for Evokers. Of those options, tanking makes the most sense, and given the nature of the class, Blizzard could make a very interesting new tank spec.

It doesn't make any sense for a ranged spellcasting class.

You're being obtuse for the sake of being obtuse.

[Kithelle]

I went from putting the chance at a new spec from like 0.1% to like 5-10% as more of the black dragonflight storyline has come out and I've seen pieces put together.

I think tank is super likely but I could also see some other kind of spec since they have gone with skinny wizard lizard look for the race (I don't think the word 'boost' is enough to think they are adding an entire new 4th role / gameplay style but it could be a kinda hybridy 2nd healer spec or dps spec with some unique utility).

Excited to see more pieces put together as we go on and this whole thing has gotten me more into datamining than ever before.

Well size doesn't really matter when you have thin blood/ void elf women and gnomes playing tanks

As much as I'd love a fire based melee spec, game could probably use something else more...devastation is the first ranged spec since vanilla, could be a black dragon dot spec or tank maybe

[Zantos]

Yes, and Evokers have instant cast abilities. That doesn't change the fact that they are casters. A tank utilizing instant cast abilities but having passives that reduce or remove hard casting wouldn't alter the fact that they are a caster tank.

That entirely alters the fact. Not a cast time, not a caster spell.

But, it also doesn't matter if we could envision another caster dps for them. Blizzard said that that is the aspect they would follow.

[Teriz]

That entirely alters the fact. Not a cast time, not a caster spell.

There's such a thing as instant-cast spells.

Again, this is nothing more than semantics. We have a model for this already, and that is Dark Apotheosis Warlocks who were also caster tanks.

But, it also doesn't matter if we could envision another caster dps for them. Blizzard said that that is the aspect they would follow.

Maybe, but as I said I don't see how you can significantly differentiate a new ranged DPS from the existing Devastation spec. Also there is the Evoker tank datamined from 10.1.

[SilverLion]

It's kind of amusing, instead of presenting counter evidence about how the data mine is incorrect, a lot of folks are just dismissing it because they don't want Dracthyr to tank. Like. You're not making an argument, you're dismissing current information because you don't like the implication that Blizzard may of straight up changed their minds. Which btw, most of you dunking on it have complained Blizzard won't do in other threads. So which is it?

As for the tanking versus suppor thing, I don't really buy that Black Dragons couldnt support. I get that most of their representatives aren't but my personal reading and lore experience is that instead of Neltharion himself, we're tapping into the essence of what black dragons are supposed to do. Protect the earth. Now that means maybe tanking but imo, you could be a shield healer like a disc priest just fine. Using stone and earth magic like certain Resto Shaman spells use, to prevent damage, rather than flat out just healing it back up. That way you could also add "support" utility on top of it. Hell make it a damage healer like Disc, with earth spells like Resto Shaman, seems pretty plausible and wouldn't really break the mold as part of the trinity.

[Teriz]

It's kind of amusing, instead of presenting counter evidence about how the data mine is incorrect, a lot of folks are just dismissing it because they don't want Dracthyr to tank. Like. You're not making an argument, you're dismissing current information because you don't like the implication that Blizzard may of straight up changed their minds. Which btw, most of you dunking on it have complained Blizzard won't do in other threads. So which is it?

As for the tanking versus suppor thing, I don't really buy that Black Dragons couldnt support. I get that most of their representatives aren't but my personal reading and lore experience is that instead of Neltharion himself, we're tapping into the essence of what black dragons are supposed to do. Protect the earth. Now that means maybe tanking but imo, you could be a shield healer like a disc priest just fine. Using stone and earth magic like certain Resto Shaman spells use, to prevent damage, rather than flat out just healing it back up. That way you could also add "support" utility on top of it. Hell make it a damage healer like Disc, with earth spells like Resto Shaman, seems pretty plausible and wouldn't really break the mold as part of the trinity.

Interesting theory. Do you think it would be possible for Blizzard to create a specialization that could dual role much like Feral Druids did before Cataclysm? Perhaps a Black Dragon spec that could heal and DPS solely based on talent arrangement? That would line up with the "Boost" and "DPS" options present in the quest.

[Jester Joe]

It's kind of amusing, instead of presenting counter evidence about how the data mine is incorrect, a lot of folks are just dismissing it because they don't want Dracthyr to tank. Like. You're not making an argument, you're dismissing current information because you don't like the implication that Blizzard may of straight up changed their minds. Which btw, most of you dunking on it have complained Blizzard won't do in other threads. So which is it?

The counter is that Blizzard literally said in a recent interview that Evokers won't get a 3rd spec for tanking, and that if they do add a 3rd spec it would suit the other roles they have, healing/ranged dps.

That's literally it. I saw the counter was "But they said the same about classic!" but that was years after they said they won't do classic. Not months.

[Lolites]

Taunt. They were missing a taunt. Pretty crucial spell.

warlock in their MOP "tank spec"? they had taunt, soulshatter was turned into taunt while using the "tank spec" glyph

[8bithamster]

And Garrosh was a warrior who could use the Void. Also Anduin is a priest who can wear plate and fighting in melee. Genn is a warrior who can fight unarmed. Thrall is a shaman who for half a decade wore plate armor. Stoneclaw allegedly taking a supposedly tanking role doesn't mean anything.


Because it makes the whole ranged thing pointless. But this discussion is meaningless. The developers already said they killed the idea for a tank spec for the class pretty early on in its development.


It doesn't make any sense for a ranged spellcasting class.

Ignore it.. It's teriz. Even if it ends up not being a tank it'll screech it was right all along.
Like it screeched for years that tinker was 100% the next class and then when evoker happened "no! I always said evoker!!"

[Teriz]

The counter is that Blizzard literally said in a recent interview that Evokers won't get a 3rd spec for tanking, and that if they do add a 3rd spec it would suit the other roles they have, healing/ranged dps.

That's literally it. I saw the counter was "But they said the same about classic!" but that was years after they said they won't do classic. Not months.

I do believe that the possibility of this class getting. 3rd spec alone is a pretty big reversal on what they’ve stated about the class up to this point. Honestly a 3rd spec for Evokers would be one of the biggest reversals in the game’s history.

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Ignore it.. It's teriz. Even if it ends up not being a tank it'll screech it was right all along.
Like it screeched for years that tinker was 100% the next class and then when evoker happened "no! I always said evoker!!"

Uh the point of this thread is a possible 3rd spec for the class. Simply because I feel that a tank spec makes the most sense doesn’t change that.

Also if you look at my signature below, I created multiple dragon class threads leading up to DragonFlights announcement. So yeah, I was correct about Blizzard introducing a draconic class that would utilize aspect-based abilities, have visage forms, have draconic bodies, be mail-based, and be a race-class combo.

But hey, who’s keeping score?

[Stickiler]

I do believe that the possibility of this class getting. 3rd spec alone is a pretty big reversal on what they’ve stated about the class up to this point. Honestly a 3rd spec for Evokers would be one of the biggest reversals in the game’s history.

I don't believe They ever said Evokers wouldn't get a third spec, from what I recall they basically said they were happy with the two specs as they are, and that they wouldn't get a tanking spec. Not that they wouldn't get a third spec at all. Would love a link if I'm wrong though.

[Nymrohd]

It just makes no sense why they'd keep something like this hidden.

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Ignore it.. It's teriz. Even if it ends up not being a tank it'll screech it was right all along.
Like it screeched for years that tinker was 100% the next class and then when evoker happened "no! I always said evoker!!"

Ielenia seems physically incapable of ignoring teriz, they are half the reason the other posts.

[Teriz]

I don't believe They ever said Evokers wouldn't get a third spec, from what I recall they basically said they were happy with the two specs as they are, and that they wouldn't get a tanking spec. Not that they wouldn't get a third spec at all. Would love a link if I'm wrong though.

I don't believe that quibbling over what a dev said here nor there really matters at this point. I'm sure if we actually look at the dev quotes, they've left plenty of semantic wiggle room to do whatever they want and still say that they never changed their mind or said something false. Nothing is ever a hard no.

A better exercise would be to simply ask ourselves if there is a third Evoker spec on the horizon, what role is the most likely? Again, here are the reasons I feel tank makes the most sense;

1. It fits the Black dragonflight
2. It is a surefire way to make the new spec feel distinct from the other specs
3. There are no mail tanks
4. A caster-style tank along the lines of the DA Warlock would be quite popular
5. It's probably the most demanded third spec among the Evoker community
6. Deathwing HotS can easily be used to harvest abilities for such a spec.

Now a second possibility would be Blizzard bringing back a dual-role specialization, like Feral Druid before Cataclysm. With a return to a more traditional talent tree, this is a possibility. A spec that can choose between DPS or Healing or Tanking and DPS would also be a way to differentiate the spec from the other two existing specs.

My issues with a pure healing and pure DPS spec is that healing doesn't really fit the black dragonflight, and I simply don't see how you make a DPS spec different from the existing devastation spec. A bard-like support spec also makes zero sense because it also doesn't fit the black dragonflight, and a support spec like you see from Bards or Dancers in FF14 doesn't work in WoW.

[FossilFree]

I do believe that the possibility of this class getting. 3rd spec alone is a pretty big reversal on what they’ve stated about the class up to this point. Honestly a 3rd spec for Evokers would be one of the biggest reversals in the game’s history.

It could also be possible that the third spec was always planned. The new patch cadence and philosophy about creating a bunch of content then slowly dripping that content out over time could explain what they are doing with it. Maybe the story narrative had to reach a point where they could unlock the third spec. Maybe they thought it would be fun for dracthyr to go back to their place of birth and be able to recover memories that Neltharion blocked out. If so, that would be really cool.

[Teriz]

It just makes no sense why they'd keep something like this hidden.

There is a possibility that this feature isn't a part of 10.1, and won't actually enter the game until after the events of 10.1. Maybe 10.1.5 or even 10.2.

- - - Updated - - -

It could also be possible that the third spec was always planned. The new patch cadence and philosophy about creating a bunch of content then slowly dripping that content out over time could explain what they are doing with it. Maybe the story narrative had to reach a point where they could unlock the third spec. Maybe they thought it would be cool for dracthyr to go back to their place of birth and be able to recover memories that Neltharion blocked out. If so, that would be really cool.

Yeah, I have no issue with such a concept. I think giving Dracthyr a new specialization as the story reveals more about their history and backstory is a great way to make Dracthyr Evoker players feel more connected to the expansion. I always felt that Monks felt kind of detached from MoP because they really didn't matter in the overall story. I think Blizzard has done a masterful job making the Dracthyr a big part of Dragonflight's story.

BTW, Blizzard being so insistent on making the Dracthyr a part of this expansion's story gives credence to a third spec actually happening mid-expansion.