Blizzard's Thoughts on the WoW Token in Wrath Classic, WoW Hotfixes - May 24, 2023

[Relapses]

Like no matter what they say, you apes will always be mad, and when they don't say anything... forum posts like "No Dragonflight numbers from Blizzard means" How do people live their life being this pessimistic. It has to be exhausting.

It's weird man. Hating on Blizzard is unironically a defining personality trait for some people. Like, I'm sure they'd put it on their resume if they could.

[Khaza-R]

They never did.

The token is the only thing that realistically hampered gold sellers as bans were meaningless when there was millions of dollars up for grabs.

Which isn't going to happen in Wrath Classic.

If gold buying was so rampant then it means it was reasonably reliable for people to habitually do it in the first place.

The only way it hurts 3rd party gold-sellers is new or prospective buyers. Which from now to ICC the amount of new players joining is likely negligible.

[Dadwen]

MMO-C forums: BIG GAME COMPANY BAD >
Blizzard: We're trying to disincentivize and devalue botting
MMO-C forums: MONEY HUNGRY
Blizzard: Botting and gold farming has been an issue not for only us but for the online gaming industry for years(this is a proven fact)
MMO-C forums: CORPORATE GREED!!

Like no matter what they say, you apes will always be mad, and when they don't say anything... forum posts like "No Dragonflight numbers from Blizzard means" How do people live their life being this pessimistic. It has to be exhausting.

Personally I could get two flying F's if they sold the tokens, what pisses me off it they went on some BS about some Pillars how classic will will be and how they won't put in original (but did put in number of retail ideas) wrath systems because of said pillars (systems that on the crap lopsided server I had started on would have made the game more playable), and as soon as they hit a bump that hurts them or is hard for them to solve, whoosh right out the window with the pillars crap....

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Which isn't going to happen in Wrath Classic.

If gold buying was so rampant then it means it was reasonably reliable for people to habitually do it in the first place.

The only way it hurts 3rd party gold-sellers is new or prospective buyers. Which from now to ICC the amount of new players joining is likely negligible.

The same thing could be (and was) said when they added the token in Wod. Gold sellers had 10 years of doing business with tons of people taking part, then the token came removing any risk of you getting caught and while the market didn’t die it was greatly diminished.

[Kralljin]

When you buy gold from Blizzard you're at least exchanging it for a tangible service.

The only effective difference is that someone else pays with gold for their subscription, rather than money.
For the one who buys the token on the store, nothing is that different beyond the risk of getting banned being gone.

But it also needs to be said that Blizzard takes a sizeable chunk out of that, 20€ for 1 month game time vs. 13€ a regular sub, that ~50% sure as shit isn't there to cover the extra expenses from them implementing the WoW Token.

Like no matter what they say, you apes will always be mad, and when they don't say anything... forum posts like "No Dragonflight numbers from Blizzard means" How do people live their life being this pessimistic. It has to be exhausting.

They're free to lower the prices on WoW Tokens, it would make them more competitive with RMT'ers and thus drive a lot more of them out of the business.

I said it earlier in this thread, you get roughly 50% more gold when you buy it on the Black market.
And 50% is a number that speaks for itself in my book.

[Khaza-R]

The same thing could be (and was) said when they added the token in Wod. Gold sellers had 10 years of doing business with tons of people taking part, then the token came removing any risk of you getting caught and while the market didn’t die it was greatly diminished.

Sort of apples and oranges because we are comparing two instances of time separated by 10 years and with different player habits as well.

Just as there's a cat and mouse game with botters, the same relationship exists with 3rd party sellers. For a person already buying gold who hasn't been hassled by the process there's no incentive to start buying gold from Blizzard for 2x the price they are getting it at now.

[LolFrank]

The only effective difference is that someone else pays with gold for their subscription, rather than money.
For the one who buys the token on the store, nothing is that different beyond the risk of getting banned being gone.

But it also needs to be said that Blizzard takes a sizeable chunk out of that, 20€ for 1 month game time vs. 13€ a regular sub, that ~50% sure as shit isn't there to cover the extra expenses from them implementing the WoW Token.

They're free to lower the prices on WoW Tokens, it would make them more competitive with RMT'ers and thus drive a lot more of them out of the business.

I said it earlier in this thread, you get roughly 50% more gold when you buy it on the Black market.
And 50% is a number that speaks for itself in my book.

That's actually true. If they want to truly combat RMT, they really need to monitor gold selling sites, and formulate their exchange rates based on those trends. Even if they weren't genuine, minimizing their profits will be the only way to get rid of them.

[varren]

"It reduces RMT"

"Here, have our version of RMT"

circus

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Sort of apples and oranges because we are comparing two instances of time separated by 10 years and with different player habits as well.

Just as there's a cat and mouse game with botters, the same relationship exists with 3rd party sellers. For a person already buying gold who hasn't been hassled by the process there's no incentive to start buying gold from Blizzard for 2x the price they are getting it at now.

The same thing was true of wod and even buying gold on retail right now. Some people will keep buying from sites, some of those will get caught, some will not want to risk it again when they get unbanned, and some will just swap to legit means.

The market will shrink some gold sellers will shut down others will keep going with lesser profits.

It’s just a repeat of history.

[Relapses]

The only effective difference is that someone else pays with gold for their subscription, rather than money.
For the one who buys the token on the store, nothing is that different beyond the risk of getting banned being gone.

But it also needs to be said that Blizzard takes a sizeable chunk out of that, 20€ for 1 month game time vs. 13€ a regular sub, that ~50% sure as shit isn't there to cover the extra expenses from them implementing the WoW Token.

They're free to lower the prices on WoW Tokens, it would make them more competitive with RMT'ers and thus drive a lot more of them out of the business.

I said it earlier in this thread, you get roughly 50% more gold when you buy it on the Black market.
And 50% is a number that speaks for itself in my book.

Are you unironically suggesting that Blizzard make WoW tokens less expensive than the subscription cost itself?

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That's actually true. If they want to truly combat RMT, they really need to monitor gold selling sites, and formulate their exchange rates based on those trends. Even if they weren't genuine, minimizing their profits will be the only way to get rid of them.

Making the WoW token cheaper than the actual subscription itself would kinda undermine the whole purpose of the subscription cost. This is not the way.

[Khaza-R]

The same thing was true of wod and even buying gold on retail right now. Some people will keep buying from sites, some of those will get caught, some will not want to risk it again when they get unbanned, and some will just swap to legit means.

The market will shrink some gold sellers will shut down others will keep going with lesser profits.

It’s just a repeat of history.

You're free to believe that. It won't be the case because the market evolves as well. Just like it has since 2013.

Buy hey, you're free to save my post and come back to tell you were right by the end of WotLKC.

[Sensa1]

Humans can also make mistakes and if there's even a single false positive then players will demand for there to be an appeal process. Now the botters have an easy way to slow down the bot swatting process by appealing every fucking ban. And if they deny the appeal for a legitimate character who got swatted then they have everything to lose and nothing to gain.

Not sure what you are talking about here. There's already an appeal process in place and there have been countless "false" positives over the last 15 years. Additionally, appealing a ban does little or nothing to slow down the banning process and fake accounts / bots are unlikely to appeal anyway because it actually would give Blizzard an even better chance to detect networks of bots. Once again your desire to be Blizzard's self-described MMO Champ defender has clouded your judgement.

[dandan]

It's crazy how they treat illegal RMT and "legal" RMT as completely different things. It doesn't become OK just because it's official and Blizzard gets a cut on the transaction, it's the same thing.

That's actually true. If they want to truly combat RMT, they really need to monitor gold selling sites, and formulate their exchange rates based on those trends. Even if they weren't genuine, minimizing their profits will be the only way to get rid of them.

Nope. If they want to truly combat RMT, they will ban people who buy. As long as there is a demand, there will be a lot of people trying to make it profitable, and Blizzard can't keep up. Offering their own brand of RMT doesn't combat RMT, it only increases it.

[Skylarking]

It's pretty simple really. Can blizzard stop the botting? Yes. Will they invest the time and money into it? No. Their automated systems are clearly not working which means this issue can most likely only be solved with more boots on the ground, so to speak. But they aren't gonna invest in more GMs.

[Feeline10]

"iterating and innovating on a nearly daily basis.."

Laying it on kind of thick here. They're usually good at these blue posts, but this is a bit much.

Edit: The entire post is Blizzard humble-bragging about their subscriber levels / player engagement. They could be a little less transparent, could they not?

[Tojara]

It's pretty simple really. Can blizzard stop the botting? Yes. Will they invest the time and money into it? No. Their automated systems are clearly not working which means this issue can most likely only be solved with more boots on the ground, so to speak. But they aren't gonna invest in more GMs.

They really can't. Just like you can't stop people from doing illegal things because nobody is going to allocate infinite resources into stopping it. You use the most efficient and cost effective ways to minimalize it, and in some instances you make a 'safer' legalized version of it. It's almost like legalizing drugs in some countries to make a genuine comparison. You going to stop people from growing weed, or buying it from illegal non-sanctioned distributers for a lower cost? No. Are you going to cut into some of that market for less risk adverse people? Yes.

Blizzard is an apt comparison to a government that just made something illegal, legal but only when sanctioned by them. They get money for doing it and while it's a bit more expensive it comes with the freedom of zero risks.

You can hire millions of cops and crimes are still going to be committed lol.

This isn't a defense of Blizzard either. As long as there's a way for people to make money from the game they're just going to do it, it's really that simple.

[Kralljin]

Are you unironically suggesting that Blizzard make WoW tokens less expensive than the subscription cost itself?

There's lots of numbers to choose from between 13 and 20.
Say the Token price would be at 15€, then you'd pay ~1,6€ per 1k gold (if we stick with the 9k gold per token from earlier), which is fairly close to the rate of ~1,4€ per 1k gold on some RMT sites.

The big crux however is, it would massively cut into their profit marigin of the WoW token, whether some people pay 15€ instead of 20€ makes quite the difference very quickly.

[Gorsameth]

It's crazy how they treat illegal RMT and "legal" RMT as completely different things. It doesn't become OK just because it's official and Blizzard gets a cut on the transaction, it's the same thing.



Nope. If they want to truly combat RMT, they will ban people who buy. As long as there is a demand, there will be a lot of people trying to make it profitable, and Blizzard can't keep up. Offering their own brand of RMT doesn't combat RMT, it only increases it.

They are different things. legal RMT doesn't involve account theft and stolen credit cards, which creates a lot of behind the scenes work for Blizzard that you don't see.

[Zodiark]

Personally I could get two flying F's if they sold the tokens, what pisses me off it they went on some BS about some Pillars how classic will will be and how they won't put in original (but did put in number of retail ideas) wrath systems because of said pillars (systems that on the crap lopsided server I had started on would have made the game more playable), and as soon as they hit a bump that hurts them or is hard for them to solve, whoosh right out the window with the pillars crap....

Yeah well the idea that you and others had that somehow you would realistically be able to relive those classic moments and times in a vacuum was folly on yours and their parts. The QoL features and systems that have been iterated on over the years were more or less a natural evolution of the game. This whole #NOCHANGES BS was foolish in the first place. RMT and botters weren't going to automatically throw up their hands and say "you know what, the quality and integrity of the classic game needs to be maintained we are just going to back away and let you guys enjoy a pristine experience".

The systems and quality of life features were a necessity to keep the game growing and viable over the years. WoW would have been a much more niche' game had they kept things exactly what they were in classic. I myself wouldn't have stayed with it for almost 20 years now.

To address one of your concerns though I think Blizzard should have merged more severs together or at least linked them together from much earlier on so that way no one would feel like they are playing on a "crap server" devoid of life and activity.

- - - Updated - - -

They really can't. Just like you can't stop people from doing illegal things because nobody is going to allocate infinite resources into stopping it. You use the most efficient and cost effective ways to minimalize it, and in some instances you make a 'safer' legalized version of it. It's almost like legalizing drugs in some countries to make a genuine comparison. You going to stop people from growing weed, or buying it from illegal non-sanctioned distributers for a lower cost? No. Are you going to cut into some of that market for less risk adverse people? Yes.

Blizzard is an apt comparison to a government that just made something illegal, legal but only when sanctioned by them. They get money for doing it and while it's a bit more expensive it comes with the freedom of zero risks.

You can hire millions of cops and crimes are still going to be committed lol.

This isn't a defense of Blizzard either. As long as there's a way for people to make money from the game they're just going to do it, it's really that simple.

I don't see that. I feel like people learn about these new trendy terms like "humble bragging", then try to use them whenever possible and start seeing these types of actions everywhere. Like when back in the 50's everyone was a communist.

Blizzard was just sharing what they are doing on their end a bit to make it more transparent that they ARE working on combating RMT and the actors that engage in it. I have a business myself and know that even when you TELL people the reasosns WHY issues arise and come up, people are still going to point fingers and cast blame because people want what they want when they want it and anything else is unacceptable and will raise their ire and consternation no matter what you say.

This usually brings me to the thought, "what good is honesty when it brings no good?" Then I say to hell with it, this is what it is and I'm just doing what I consider right and to hell where the chips land.

[Hexian]

Lol, I am so glad I left classic when I did. Blizzard was lying to our faces at every turn about trying to uphold the true feeling of classic. And now they try to stealth sneak in the token and afterwards post a block of bs claiming it’s the only way to combat the bots.

They know this dumpster fire of a game is going downhill, especially when Cata arrives, and now it is just turning into a raging inferno. They are just trying to milk the last sad monetary ounce of everybody before it all implodes.